UKH

The Grand Jorasses Traverse seems to be mostly logged July/August, however I hear it can be busy then, with fierce competition for the tiny bivvy and many guided parties bagging the 4,000ers.

Anyone know how difficult it might prove early season, say mid June? Would it be more wading in snow than easy-going névé and the desirably dry rock sections plastered and thus more mixed?

However I assume this would make the descent easier, as when dry I've read it's lethal?

Any advice appreciated. 

Did it in July the year before last, during one of several heat waves after a dry winter. Lots of the ridge was completely snow free and was hard going scrambling over precariously balanced rocks, which seems to be increasingly the case on these sorts of routes. I might be misremembering but I think the low snow levels caused extra difficulties on part of the rochefort travese section (awkward downclimb to get onto a snow field)

The decent down the glacier was a bit horrible. Snow bridges were getting melty and we had to jump a few crevasses. We ended up having an unplanned bivvy half way down in the hope things would firm up (don't think it helped that much). Don't remember it getting especially worse when we got below the snow line onto the dry section but I think I've just blocked out most of my memories of it.

If you're there in June anyway probably worth asking what it's like at the guides office. I suspect there's every chance it would be in better nick than I found it, but probably worth considering my username before listening too much to my advice.

The Alps is increasingly unpredictable. If this is a hot year, then late June might be a good option. 

Pedants corner: there terms you want are snow covered and bare ice areas, not "dry" section. The "dry" section is, in fact, very wet. 

I always thought a glacier covered in snow was called a wet glacier, and with no snow covering just bare ice a dry glacier, regardless of how much water is running on/under it. E.g.

https://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/skills/series/alpine_skills/glacial_tra...

Plenty more uses of these terms if you do a quick search.

Your profile says you study glaciers so I'm not going to try to argue about it 😂

To be fair its the common mountaineering parlance, it's just that I have issue with 😂

Never let that stop a good debate! (Although yes, I am indeed a professional glaciologist) 

Slightly off topic, but anyone know the situation with the descent route off the south side of the Jorasses these days?

I recall that a few years ago that there were some fatalities when part of a serac barrier collapsed and the seracs were at one point considered so unstable that access to part of the Val Ferret was banned.

I did it with a guide in mid august a few years ago. No snow wading, glaciers in decent condition. Ultimately Im sure it will vary massively between years, from memory, more snow would have made it much harder for me personally.

We had the ridge to ourselves and bivvied (I think) near pointe croz. Certainly only space for two though, and that was cramped! If there were a team already there I probably would have had a breakdown and cried.

Hopefully this is useful information in some way *shrugs*

Seracs were still there and looking threatening when I was there, afaik still the case. We ran on the part of the descent where you have to cross the glacier below them.

Clearly you're exposed for less time in descent than if you went up the Jorasses via the normal route but out of interest, how long are you exposed to them for?

The fact that they made part of the valley out of bounds for a while suggests the potential exposure could be huge.

Do they do some Swiss style remote monitoring of the seracs which provides info on when a collapse is likely (such as is done on the Weissmeis) or is it just a case of semi guesswork?