UKH

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E9Q5toY_c54&ab_channel=ChrisAlstrinFilm...

Probably the single most intense bit of footage of any route I've ever seen. Completely raw, it almost feels like you're there with him.

I'd seen the Arcteryx film about ice climbing in Zion but this had never come across my radar so thought I'd share it here.

Someone in the comments made the very good point that the total lack of communication between him and the camera-man makes it even more powerful, there's no offer of rescue or help. Pure commitment to the situation from both people in what's probably a life or death situation. 

Shit the bed! That was very thin and lonely. He must have calves like coconuts and balls to match.

Great footage too, no music, no jumping around.

There was a brilliant American ice film some years ago called The Palenville Coronary. Steeper but fatter ice with a bit of mixed as well. It seems to have vanished from the ether, shame as it was a great wee film and a nails looking route.

Amazing. Thank you 

You should've posted this in the Today's Climbing Media Output Rarely Conveys Depth of Experience thread. 😀

Full marks for commitment and bonus marks for the decision to retreat. I don't think we make enough about how important it is to do that at times.

I'd have managed the retreat differently but I wouldn't have been there in the first place and it's easy to think that from the sofa!

Why on earth would you lower off both ropes through a single (super!) sketchy piece of gear?! That cam was not too far away but by doing that he pretty much guaranteed that if that gear went he was doomed.

It would make a pretty good “Friday night video” but I’m not sure it would gather that much attention?

Yep, I’d have been screaming for a rope off the cameraman but also I would never have thought twice about even stepping off the ground. 

I’m not sure, in those scenarios it’s not easy to think and you can tell he does it completely on the fly.

The cams look pretty far away to me and the difference in rope between one and two there is negligible in regards to keeping him off the deck (I think he’d entirely excepted his fate by that point). I was more worried that when he unclipped the cams that the rope would ping out and change the direction of pull on the axe…

My immediate thought too (an American thing?). Either that or leave both tools with a rope on each.

Having said that, I'm not sure the retreat off one of his better placements was worse than climbing on some much thinner looking ones.

Quite hard to watch.

Man...

Not that I could even get up there - way too thin for my liking - but I'd have left that cam in. 'Cos it seems like if the tool popped he'd be off into the void, smacking the ledge on his way down.

Though kudos for staying cool and calm !

I'd have a. not started. b. backed off sooner. c. got a rope from the camera man!

d. is where it get's interesting though. I'd probably have clipped one rope to the axe and had my belayer take in the other through the cam. I'd have left a cam in too.

But as I said above, all very easy to say from the comfort of the sofa.

It reminds me of my first season winter climbing in Scotland.

I did more abseiling than climbing.

Great ad for tech machines 

All I could think was glad he didn't ab off a nomic!

That's some watch. The cameraman is as impressive in their absolute silence.

Wonder why he doesn’t just get a rope thrown to him from the camera person?

I get being self reliant and able to do what he does in the video, especially if it happens without camera person above. Maybe he’s not keen on potentially putting the camera person in a more dangerous position to lower him down?

The whole nomic breaking thing just put me off.
Decided on tech machine a few years ago and then this

Although I don’t think the bottom clip thing is endorsed by Grivel ? 

I would expect nothing in that video is endorsed by anybody ever!

Very cool and composed climbing; that's for sure.

The climber involved - Scott Adamsom - was sadly lost on the North Face of Ogre II, in 2016. See http://www.alpinist.com/doc/web16c/wfeature-adamson-dempster-remembered-for... for an appreciation.

Thanks for that!  Impressive self control and decision making. It must have been tempting to push on regardless having got so committed.  

Having a bulldog or terrier might have helped the retreat, at least it could have been possible to downclimb with some semblance of protection above.

It's a really cool clip, I'm a bit annoyed I can't really see how steep it is though. Adamson was obviously such a good ice climber he looks very relaxed regardless whether this is plumb 90 degrees or considerably more slabby. I suspect it's actually not vertical because of just how relaxed he is, although of course the better an ice climber you are, the more relaxed you look when you climb.

There's something sort of magical about climbing very thin ice. When I lived in Finland and could do this every week, at my lowly standard I think I got quite good at it. The icefalls near to Helsinki are all very small to small, some starting at what would really be just highball boulder size, although taking ground falls wearing crampons is never a great idea. I've got a scar on my inside right calf muscle from about a decade ago to help me remember play stupid games, win stupid prizes (although that was actually off a lead attempt on a thin mixed route and my first nut pulled because it was in shite placement - I don't think I ever fell off an ice solo). We started off top roping stuff early season on the first drools of ice. But as soon as you start understanding that even one tooth on your picks and your front points just pushed down on thin ice will stay there, the temptation grows to solo mini routes that you have climbed before, including soloed before, on thicker ice. It makes you climb very well, and helps a lot to prepare you for when you are bigger routes and come across a thin section of ice that can't be protected for some metres. I've even shot up 10 mtrs of thin and unprotected ice at the top of Lakes mixed route, which I suspect I wouldn't even have tried if I hadn't messed about soloing 8 mtr sheets of ice that were a few mms thick in the forests around Helsinki for many years before that. There's a photo in this very old review https://www.ukclimbing.com/gear/clothing/waterproofs/westcomb_specter_lt_ho... of me climbing one of those first-ice-of-the-winter flows. Can't remember if I topped out then, or thought better of it at 5 or 6 metres and climbed down. 

The ice climbing in Zion looks amazing, but the temperature obviously fluctuates hugely - probably sun hitting canyon rims, so rapid melt flowing behind thin ice sheets and delaminating them. Delaminated thin ice is utterly terrifying. Kind of see why he backs down. I've had American friends visiting and doing a tour of English and Welsh classic crags recently and they were laughing at us Brits for insisting on dragging double ropes up everything - but in this case I can definitely see how doubles would have been way better for backing off that tool with the second rope clipped through the cam on its own!

Have you seen The Alpinist?  If you like your palms sweaty, you should

I didn't know that, sad. I'd heard of him but didn't know much about him. He's also in this outstanding film about Utah ice.

youtube.com/watch?v=Xp83UFuKxyE&

Whilst we're sharing ice climbing 'stoke' or 'psyche' or whatever the kids are calling nowadays - here's another great ice climbing video https://youtu.be/ChkX4G740gE?si=qHTs6JD84IGSnxtR that I came across today.

It's about ice climbing in the Indian Himalaya focusing particularly on the first Indian ice festival in 2019, and the Americans who went across to explore and help out. It's 25 years since I last went to Lahaul and Spiti (and in summer not winter) but watching the video, it seems thing haven't change much in terms of the exciting nature of travelling in the region! I've followed on of the Indian women climbing guides on Instagram for a good few years now, so have seen photos of some of the routes before, but the climbing looks pretty spectacular in the videos.

That's Millstone Edge, surely?

Not with all those conifers. I'm sure Toby will be along to tell you where in Finland it was taken.

Nope. Kauhala. And If things hold True, Toby would have soloed to the ledge just above and thus out of frame. From where he would have either battled moist/wet/slushy snow tge last 3m to the top… or asked for a rope… that being said, even downclimb from said ledge is possible,  but also darn hard… been there, got the t-shirt snd whotnot.

nothing as create (filmwise), but climbing on same of Toby’s old stomping grounds.

vimeo.com/321432461

vimeo.com/510194049

vimeo.com/504681744

the last vid even shows the line from which Toby pinged off and got the scar.

Bulldogs are great.

My palms are sweating buckets after that, great find!

At the end I had this thought from the comfort of my armchair- I think it would be better to ab off a really sketchy tool rather than lower off it.. Lowering off would put twice bodyweight on the tool (well a bit less than twice because of friction on the biner) whereas a perfectly smooth ab would just be equal to bodyweight? Not that I would want to hang around up there faffing with a rope either though.

Reminds me a bit of that nightmare inducing clip of Hansjorg Auer abbing off a tiny rock frozen into some snow a few years ago.

Yeah, second that. I mean this is getting there, but even the first scene made be poop myself more than this...

https://youtu.be/C6WnDnrFFiQ?feature=shared

https://youtu.be/X4wQhW4Yqwo?feature=shared

For example.  And those aren't the sweatiest bits

It's not a competition.

I'd definitely not be signing up to try that any time soon, but the tool didn't necessarily seem all that sketchy. At a glance the route looks like the thinnest of veneers, but the camera close-ups suggest the ice was actually a bit thicker in parts. 
When he actually starts the lower-off, there doesn't seem to be any wobbling going on in the tool, and it looks like the slabby nature of the route meant he could keep most weight on the feet and his retained tool. It then took more wanging about of the ropes to get it to flick out at the end than I was expecting - all in all it seems a testament to the design of modern tools, in solidly holding weight with a downward pull in fairly minimal placements 

Jeez, I think I have PTSD just from watching it, so intense! Can't even start to imagine what it felt like. Thanks for posting. Adam was one of the great, such a loss to the climbing world

Well, yes and no.  The thread title asks a question.  The answer is no, with an example of something at least as scary.  So not a competition, but then I didn't suggest it was!

That made me feel a bit sick.

Again, not saying I'd do better in the situation (I wouldn't), but thinking about the least sketchy way to retreat there, it would probably be to go in direct to one tool and weight it carefully, hitch one rope to the tool, get your belay device snug and backed up on that rope, then untie from it. Then tie off the other rope on the other tool and abseil off both. That's in theory though - managing all that while hanging and fretting about shifting weight on the tool would be nightmarish.