UKH

Are there any cheap, warm belay jackets out there? I know the ME Fitzroy and the Patagonia DAS are the usual recommendations, just wondering if there’s any cheaper option offering similar warmth and weather protection for Scottish winter? Seen a Simmond one, but it’s down, so probably not the best when it’s damp.

Just wondering if there’s a little known jacket people are using that’s sub £200 rrp. Maybe wishful thinking!

In reply to JJunior:

Alpkit 0hiro?

In reply to JJunior:

Simond do a synthetic insulated jacket, 80gsm throughout and a helmet compatible hood. Not sure if it's more a midlayer though as the outer fabric doesn't look to be very water resistant 70 quid rrp. I use a BD belay jacket 180gsm all over it is very warm. Fjern husly might be a shout if your looking for something on the heavier, warmer side at 120 ish rrp. Montane flux might be a good all round jacket 100 ish gsm and a price online of 80-120 quid.

In reply to Maximusf:

I have a simond belay parka cost me £40 in a sale loads warm and never been soaked yet.

In reply to JJunior:

Fjern Husly, slightly warmer than a fitzroy, but about the same pack size as a citadel.

In reply to JJunior:

https://www.sportpursuit.com/catalog/product/view/id/1820647

Have seen a few of these around the hills in winter, not sure how it compares to pricier competition but is a little heavier than the Citadel in comparable sizes (1kg hanging off your harness with a big winter rack isn't ideal).

FWIW, I've been very grateful of the new version of the Citadel and couldn't recommend it more, feels like a proper refuge in rubbish conditions. My only complaint is that it's a bit over engineered, it doesn't need four outer pockets and the two mesh inners IMO. Two hand warmers and a single mesh inner would've been just fine and cut a bit of weight out.

I used the ME Superflux for a while last season and the one before which did me fine for the majority of things but was never strapped to a belay for more than 2 hours, it also packed down small and was light enough to carry and easy to climb in. ME Shelterstone also worth a look but probably won't be warm enough to be an out and out winter belay coat. 

In reply to JJunior:

You can often pick up a Paramo one on the Paramo eBay shop for £150. Keela is another option 

In reply to JJunior:

I did see a quite favourable review somewhere for the Moon Meteor jacket with 200gsm synthetic insulation and a rrp well under £200. I can't remember the details but I'm pretty sure it was heavier than the cutting edge optiopns from the likes of ME.

In reply to JJunior:

Not little known but I got a Rab Generator Alpine earlier this year for 164 on a sale. I guess one can still find it for around 200? The jacket is indistinguishable from Patagonia Das but two times cheaper.

In reply to JJunior:

I'd want something warmer than a Fitzroy for Scottish winter, the Rab Nebula Pro is warm and can be picked up pretty cheap, think the RRP is £195.

In reply to Luke Brisco:

Is that warmer than a Fitzroy? Same weight of insulation, though the insulation is of a lower quality, stitch though micro baffles and a less windproof outer fabric?

For a cheaper equivalent to the Fitzroy, I'd get the Shelterstone, assuming ME was the fit you were after.

In reply to JJunior:

Snugpak might be another option. The SJ9 is very warm and tough and can be picked up new for around £130. It is a hefty beast though 

In reply to Luke Brisco:

Depends what you're doing. If you're moving fairly quick on classic I-III type terrain then a Fitzroy will probably be fine. If you're settling down for a long belay shift on something hard then you'll probably want a burlier jacket.

In reply to galpinos:

Don't you have connection to ME somehow? If so - do you know what the difference is between the Shelterstone and the Fitzroy? They are virtually the same weight, but the Shelterstone is 150 quid cheaper. It's not clear if the hood is helmet compatible on the Shelterstone, but the reviews on the product page suggest it is. If it is, it looks like it should be a really decent and not stupidly expensive belay jacket! 

In reply to TobyA:

I think the difference is mainly the Fitzroy uses expensive Primaloft Gold Hi-Loft Ultra (Super Deluxe Plaid Edition) insulation, while the Shelterstone uses Polarloft.

Not tried either though, I have a Citadel. Although I was considering a shelterstone as a general winter jacket if I can pick one up cheap sometime.

In reply to midgen:

And of course fancy Gore Windstopper versus ME's own (perfectly good) Drilite will make a big cost difference. 

Following.

The Rab Generator Alpine looks fab but does anyone know what the female equivalent is? Can't find anything on their site.

In reply to TobyA:

No actual affiliation. As ME is a Manchester brand, I do know quite a few people who work there as they climb at the same walls as me, I see them out at the crags etc and regularly climb with one ME staffer. It has become my "default brand" as I know the ME pattern for a size large always fits me well (whereas in Arc'teryx or Patagonia, I am between M&L depending on the product/fit and Rab seem hit or miss across my shoulders/chest) and Magic Mountain periodically have very good deals on samples and the ME sample size is L! I also really like most of the gear, like the people so would like to support them and impressed with the quality and performance of the gear such a relatively small company can produce.

Re Shelterstone/Fitzroy, as midgen says it's materials (Primaloft Gold and Gore Windstopper are both $$$$) and I assume a slightly more expensive construction. Gore Windstopper does make the jacket feel more amour like and apparently combined with the Primaloft makes the Fitzroy "warmer than the paper specs suggest". Last time I was in Scotland though I borrowed a Citadel and it was amazing, not sure I could justify the cost for the pitiful amount of time I get out in winter at the moment though......

In reply to Queen of the Traverse:

Afaik Rab don't do a female version, you have to just try the smaller sizes.

In reply to galpinos:

My Fitzroy and Nebula are both older models now but I definitely feel warmer in the Nebula. Don't really notice a difference in how windproof they are either especially when worn over a goretex.

In reply to DaveHK:

I agree with you there actually, I tend to use the Fitzroy as a warm midlayer but having worn it a couple of times marshaling fell races and being stood around on top of a hill for a long time I wouldn't want to be sat around for ages in it in winter. 

In reply to Luke Brisco:

New Fitzroy is apparently warmer but having not tried either I can't really comment on anything other than the paper specs!

In reply to anybody that wants to read the UKC reviews on the jackets

According to Mr McKenna  Shelterstone- less warm than Fitzroy ? Helmet compatible hood - Yes

https://www.ukclimbing.com/gear/clothing/synthetic_insulation/mountain_equi...

  Rab Generator - There is no specific womens version and the fabric does feel very fragile

https://www.ukclimbing.com/gear/clothing/synthetic_insulation/rabs_new_gene...

And Citadel + BD  Monster Jkts

https://www.ukclimbing.com/gear/clothing/synthetic_insulation/heavyweight_b...

In reply to phizz4:

Ok ta. I'll take that up with Rab. 

In reply to galpinos:

Though I should add, should ME want to give me free stuff, I would be more than happy…..

In reply to JJunior:

Of course I'm biased but Alpkit OHiro does a great job. I used both ME obvious options before and I actually prefer the OHiro. 

In reply to Nathan Adam:

Hi, how do you find the hoods of the new Citadel and Fitzroy compare? I have an older Fitzroy and the hood is fine with or without a helmet. I was looking at pictures of the Citadel { thinking of getting one} but the hood looks very big and bulky? great when wearing helmet, but might be too big if not?  

In reply to Fiskavaig:

I wore my citadel to watch fireworks last night, it's totally fine without a helmet, you can adjust it. Far too warm to walk anywhere in it mind 

In reply to JJunior:

I haven't seen anyone mention the Rab Photon X that has been reviewed on here. I have one, an XL to get big enough armholes (that turned out to be the limiting factor, unexpectedly). Awful colour choice, including black (why??), but functio appropriate minimal pocket spec with  hand warmers and big two internal pouches that can hold mitts. My only real design criticism of it is the seemingly lightweight main zip with its tiny runner -if I'd been looking for a daily use jacket that might have been a deal breaker but I suppose it helps with compressibility . They did have a women's model https://www.ukclimbing.com/gear/clothing/synthetic_insulation/rab_womens_ph...

In reply to Basemetal: Possibly because the Photon X was discontinued last year and replaced  with the Generator Alpine ?

Has anyone tried the replacement for the Montane Flux?  the Respond XT -Body is now Primaloft® Silver 133g/m2  with Hood, Sleeves and side panels 80g/m2 apart from more insulation it appears almost identical to the Flux but lighter and at a (fairly) reasonable price

In reply to leon 1:

Aah. Might be worth looking around some of the remainder outlets for discount stock then. Comments under Heather's article place it between a Fitzroy and a Citadel for warmth.

In reply to Fiskavaig:

As per above comments, it works fine without a helmet on as well. Good adjustability and I rarely need to use the sidepulls, more often than not I just use the toggle behind the head to close off the extra space. That is with a size Small however, I normally wear a Medium or Large on my upper body but the Citadel is sized well enough I can get away with wearing the Small. I have friends who sized up and there's a lot of excess fabric, it's worth trying on before committing. 

The Citadel uses M.E.'s Super Alpine Hood which is massive and will go over higher volume foam helmets and beanies, waterproof coat etc. whereas the Fitzroy has the Mountain HC Hood so is a little lower volume. I've had waterproofs with the HC hood before and whilst they're a little tighter overall, never noticed too much difference. 

Dave MacLeod has a good video on the ME YouTube channel which shows him wearing the Fitzroy over the top of all his layers and it doesn't seem obstructive. 

In reply to Nathan Adam:

Cheers for the info 

In reply to JJunior:

Depending on your size, you may be able to get one very cheap at Point5

https://www.point5clothing.com/shop