UKH

NEWS: Vixen Tor - Access Denied

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 UKH News 21 Sep 2011
No access 2, 4 kbThe long-running dispute between a Dartmoor landowner and groups representing walkers and climbers over public access at Vixen Tor looks to be going the landowner's way. The BBC reports that an enquiry has decided there is no public right of way at the site

Read more at http://www.ukhillwalking.com/news/item.php?id=64182
 Dan-gerMouse 22 Sep 2011
In reply to UKH News:

I cant help but feel that the kind of rhetoric used in this article is unhelpful. Whilst its clearly a great shame that access cannot be secured and recreational users will loose out becuase of it, the landowner has a right of appeal against the decision to an independant arbiter. The landowner used the correct process (notwithstanding previously potentially unlawful actions) and the planning inspector made a decsion based on the evidence presented to them. If the county council are aggrieved by the decision, they too have a right of judical review to the high court.

At some stage, the matter will need to reach a conclusion and perhaps its time to come to terms with the fact that access may be lost for the duration of current landowners ownership?
In reply to UKH News: This sucks, mega keen to get cragging at Vixen Tor, What was the point in the whole CRoW Act then???
In reply to Dan-gerMouse: Rhetoric?
 josh88 22 Sep 2011
In reply to UKH News:
This is ridiculous and any other cases like this are.

How can something that is a natural beauty spot (never mind the climbing we want to do) be made a private access area??? Its nature its as simple as that!!! It should be without any question be open for all to visit walk climb etc etc.
Im sure someone is going to turn round and say there back garden is part of nature bla bla and that they have the right to not want people to go in there but if you think that or want to say something like that just to be pedantic don't bother.

From the age of 13 i've spent a lot of time on dartmoor taking part in ten tors for all of my senior school years. Now though climbing visit often when i'm home. i love the moors and cant understand why even if you owned a piece of land IE Vixen Tor why you you would want to take it away from everyone else! Its nature for crying out loud, case closed!!!
 franksnb 22 Sep 2011
In reply to josh88: because some people are just ar$e holes
 franksnb 22 Sep 2011
In reply to UKH News: can the bmc afford to buy it?
 Ed morris 22 Sep 2011
In reply to UKH News: Surely when a land owner desecrates something as significant as this crag by painting graffiti on it they forfeit the right to ownership in the interest of conservation.
 USBRIT 22 Sep 2011
In reply to UKH News: I thought there was a right to roam in the UK ?
 josh88 22 Sep 2011
In reply to Ed morris: absolutely, its simply an act of vandalism and spray painting a crag is far worse then spaying something on the side of a man made building!
alastairm 22 Sep 2011
In reply to UKH News: I think all right minded people will do the only sensible thing and ignore an unjust law and a silly ruling. Go climbing there if you want to. I would be interested to know if the owner benefits in any way from land or agricultural subsidies that are paid for by UK or European taxpayers ie us.
 Stone Muppet 22 Sep 2011
Like it or not guys you live in a country where people have the right to own land (in quantities far greater than what they actually need to live on).

In Native American culture, and many besides, it's the land that owns you ... maybe a better way of looking at it, but not likely to be legally implemented by our large-scale-landowning elite any time soon.

Going back to Vixen Tor, whatever happened about the illegal change of use and attempted murder?
fijibaby 22 Sep 2011
In reply to UKH News: I'll be devils advocate here. See it from their point of view: litter at the crag and on the way in/out, chalk all over the rock, noise, dogs, cars blocking access, people using bits of the crag as a toilet and so on.
Just because we like to climb rocks doesn't give us any right to.
All that said it's a great shame it has come to this, hopefully some sort of compromise can be reached.
 Toby S 22 Sep 2011
In reply to fijibaby:
> (In reply to UKH News) I'll be devils advocate here. See it from their point of view: litter at the crag and on the way in/out, chalk all over the rock, noise, dogs, cars blocking access, people using bits of the crag as a toilet and so on.

Ok, how about barbed wire, spray painted rocks and copious amounts of black grease liberally spread about the surrounding walls? This was what I was met with when I was last there. If I remember rightly, the main access to the Tor (if you're a walker or climber) was from the road where there's a decent sized parking area which is generally already busy with tourists to the moor. Climbers wouldn't really increase the traffic by that much and it's far enough away to cause little inconvenience to her own access.
In reply to UKH News:

Interesting to note that Jeremy Clarkson can't get a single footpath closed when clearly it can be used to pester him. Yes this is allowed to happen. Unbelievable.
 nolan 23 Sep 2011
In reply to UKH News:
Well the sour old bitch is pretty old now so it shouldn't be too long before she pops it and I doubt if anyone has ever had the inclination to procreate with her so hopefully she doesn't have any vile little followers to carry on this nonsense.
BTW im sure some of the boulders (probably standing there for millions of years) that she so thoughtfully graffitied with slogans as in the picture in the article, are actually outside of the boundary wall. Surely this is breaking some law or something and if not then can't we just tie her to a stake and burn her anyway. I don't think anyone would actually mind.
 Vaughany89 23 Sep 2011
In reply to UKH News: I saw this on TV about 5 years ago. It was one of those bollocks conflict resolution programmes on channel 5 with Col Bob Stewart. As I recall, she mentioned all the reasons in the article but couldn't back them up with a solid reason. She also opened the crag for a limited period for a cash fee. This whole thing is done out of spite and is now money making exercise.
In reply to nolan:
> (In reply to UKH News)
> Well the sour old bitch is pretty old now so it shouldn't be too long before she pops it and I doubt if anyone has ever had the inclination to procreate with her

Unfortunately, they did.
king_of_edale 27 Sep 2011
Just because somebody has enough money to buy up large chunks of the countryside shouldn't be a reason why they can selfishly hoard it. I live in a big city and can't afford to have my own country estate, so I am grateful of the access I have to areas of beauty where I can walk and climb which is granted by landowners.

The Mass Trespass on Kinder Scout was to protest about similar selfish behaviour and should be remembered....
The Shelf Puffin 29 Sep 2011
In reply to nolan:
> (In reply to UKH News)
> Well the sour old bitch is pretty old now so it shouldn't be too long before she pops it and I doubt if anyone has ever had the inclination to procreate with her so hopefully she doesn't have any vile little followers to carry on this nonsense.
> BTW im sure some of the boulders (probably standing there for millions of years) that she so thoughtfully graffitied with slogans as in the picture in the article, are actually outside of the boundary wall. Surely this is breaking some law or something and if not then can't we just tie her to a stake and burn her anyway. I don't think anyone would actually mind.

Bad me agrees but a bit risky with the old Karma thing chap. Just a passing thought.

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