UKH

This is for the women who climb on UKClimbing (especially those who posted on SecretSquirrel's thread), if you're not really into climbing it probably won't be relevant to you.

Don't worry it's a simple, two part challenge that can be taken up irrespective of experience or ability or age, and that shouldn't take long.

Try this:

Firstly, post a topic about climbing, on Rocktalk or Rock Destinations. The topic can be about anything climbing-related, whether a question or anecdote or statement or explanation or discussion or anything - just a climbing issue that interests you. The only thing I'd ask is that it's not something that is asked regularly (there's a search function for that), and it's posted intelligbly.

Secondly, each day, post a reply to a topic that catches your eye in the Rocktalk or Rock Destinations forums. Again it doesn't matter what the topic is about, as long as what you reply is climbing related and on-topic (and again, intelligble).

If you genuinely can't find anything that interests you, either as a post of your own, or as a reply to another thread, that's fine - maybe you could mention that here or in SecretSquirrel's thread.

If you have climbing issues that interest you enough to post about and reply about, that's great - we will all see it and be able to discuss climbing (which is what we are all dedicated to).

In reply to Fiend:

To demonstrate, some examples of recent and varied climbing thread by female climbers on UKC:

http://www.ukhillwalking.com/forums/t.php?n=196689

http://www.ukhillwalking.com/forums/t.php?n=196740

http://www.ukhillwalking.com/forums/t.php?n=196628

http://www.ukhillwalking.com/forums/t.php?n=196643

http://www.ukhillwalking.com/forums/t.php?t=196471

http://www.ukhillwalking.com/forums/t.php?t=195540

http://www.ukhillwalking.com/forums/t.php?t=196511

http://www.ukhillwalking.com/forums/t.php?t=195942

http://www.ukhillwalking.com/forums/t.php?t=195533

This shows a wide array of topics that female climbers are interested in enough to post and discuss, however it seems there are many more female climbers on here who don't post such stuff about climbing....so see what you can do .

In reply to Fiend: Do I get a special gold star if I've already done the above?

In reply to Fiend:

i'm sure your intentions are good but it does come across a touch patronising.....hopefully i'm mistaken and your thoughtful post will induce a flood of threads from girlies otherwise too intimidated to put their views forward.

In reply to lasonj: this is getting annoying, people posting gender related topics, i dont see wat all the fuss is about. We all climb and post no matter wat gender we are!

In reply to Fiend:

I've already done it too I only joined a bit ago

In reply to Fiend:

What do we get if we accept your challenge?

An acknowledging pat on the head from the male climbers or just some light patronising?

In reply to Fiend: should they be exempt from flaming if they ask stoopid questions?

In reply to Bambi:
Let's start with the light patronising and see where we go from there?

In reply to Fiend:

Dear Fiend

Does this count? http://www.ukhillwalking.com/forums/t.php?n=196787

Norrie

In reply to Fiend: What about:

http://www.ukhillwalking.com/forums/t.php?t=196497&v=1#2864508

Or aren't I allowed to post in the gear forum?

In reply to Fiend:


err call me an old stick in the mud (please do), but isn't that all a bit patronising old chap?

In reply to Morgan Woods:


Sorry, I am aware it could be taken as patronising, and I probably could have spent a couple of hours twisting the language into a perfectly bland and politically correct post, but I trust that people on here are sensible and aware enough to not take offence at it. And yes you're right about mistaken, this idea is put forward with the positive intention to encourage the women climbers on UKC to see if they want to post about climbing, and do so if they want to.

In reply to Bambi:


You get to discuss a hobby you're passionate about with like-minded people - is that enough??

In reply to Norrie Muir:

Hmmmm, I think that poster has too many knackers and not enough knockers.

In reply to marie:

Oh yeah, Gear forum too (sorry I don't visit it), as long as it's about climbing gear of course - as your topic is (although there are worrying overtones of non-climber behaviour in it :P).

In reply to Fiend:

And obviously this is inspired by Secretsquirrel's thread - anyone who is concerned about raising gender-specific issues on this forum should perhaps discuss it with her or the other posters on that thread.

In reply to Fiend: Ummmmm, well I was always told not to buy and to borrow... so have nearly no idea about gear.

Only I think after 4 years and not much climbing cos of it, I'd better change something...

In reply to Fiend: What about my gold star?

In reply to lasonj:

Sorry I didn't see a climbing topic by you - but you can have a silver star for replying in some climbing ones.

In reply to Fiend: Damn you I want a gold star and a patronising pat on the head! I started a topic in the Rock Destinations forum, mind you it was last week, but I'm just back from my holiday!

In reply to lasonj:

Oh shuddup woman, that is all we get when we let wimmin on our climbing threads, want stars and pats on the head instead of how to tie the double furangled granny bowline.

Now get back in your rocking chair and finish knitting me that new arran sweater like a good little girl.

BTW, is my tea ready yet?

In reply to Fiend:

I wasn't aware it was invite only, that's all.

In reply to Fiend:
I post fairly regularly in the various climbing forums already, so will decline your challenge
Thanks anyway.

In reply to sutty: hehe! A rocking chair would be quite cool actually!! Tea will be ready in about an hour and you aint gettin any!

PS - is there actually such a thing as the double furangled granny bowline ;oP

In reply to practicalcat:

But of course.

Do you any climbing topics you want to start, though?

In reply to lasonj:


You sure you do not know it, well I am sure MarcC said that was what he used to tie his chalk bag on when he climbed unclothed. It may be a technical name for the testicle knot

In reply to Fiend:
Not at the moment, thank you. However, I am sure I will at some point when I have something to say and want to, as I have done in the past. Not one for posting something just for the sake of it.

In reply to sutty: Ok, I don't think Iwant to know!

In reply to Fiend:

Well, what about the women posting in Squirrel's thread:

upordown, TN, Sandrine, cathsullivan, Nao, Moomin, Adders, Bella, fimm, Pinky ??

(Of the others, JoH, Flicka, Marie and climbingpixie posted topics recently, Rosie hardly needs any encouragement, AlisonC posts enough on climbing stuff)

Or in Mick's thread:

Fille, Jenn, Netsrik, Tiggs, Rock Waif, Juicy Lucy, Hjonesy, es, Katie Weston, kamala ??

All of you are interested enough in the topics of a women's climbing forum, or why women don't post on this climbing forum, to post about those issues, and most of you have strong opinions about whether women should have a seperate climbing forum for them.

Are you interested / opinionated enough about climbing to post more (or more regularly, or at all) on this climbing forum??

In reply to Fiend:

Why should we do this, just because you have highlighted our names in bold?

As a matter of fact I will shortly be off on holiday to Mallorca for a week, during which I am planning to do some sport climbing. Do you need me to post about this to 'prove' to you that I am 'interested' in climbing?

I am sure you are well intentioned but I am not sure what you are trying to achieve. I think one of the main points on the last thread was more about the women who don't really post at all, therefore women who posted on there who hadn't really posted on anything else.

In reply to Fiend:
PS Hjonesy is off sick so won't be posting about climbing any time soon...

In reply to Fiend:

It doesn't really matter. I wouldn't bother with RT if it didn't have anything to do with climbing but part of the appeal is that there's much more. And to be honest I don't care if someone only climbs once every eight years as long as they have something to say.

I'm completely baffled by the fixation on gender some people have. Compartmentalising by genre of topic's fair enough. Compartmentalising people is seldom likely to be constructive.

Anyway, I like to reserve most of my prejudice for the hard of thinking. And there's no chance of corraling them all voluntarily into their own forum.

In reply to Fiend:


And guess what, you Lucky Laydeez! He's single!

In reply to Rid Skwerr:


Like people who don't know what a novel is.

In reply to Fiend:

Err..

<wracks brains>

hmm.. indoor bouldering last weekend, I'm still rubbish, but was happy that i could still do one handed cartwheels... no questions there.

Normally climb on Sandstone, so no leading issues, know how to set up top rope, can't think of anything else related there.

Going down to Dorset shortly, but have full set of QD's, rope and guide book, so not sure what else I need to know for that.

Have shoes, harness, rope etc, and no need for gear, so no gear related questions.

Need to loose weight and get stronger, but happy with my training at the moment, so no questions there.

Sorry.. can't think of anything to ask right now.

Can I have a star anyway for trying?

In reply to Fiend:

Yes. I would start a thread if I felt the need to. But I don't at the moment. I'll reply (and do) when I've got something to say. I've only recently started posting on here and I've found with other forums that it takes me a while to 'warm up'. Be careful what you wish for, Fiend!

BTW, I'm inclined to defend your 'challenge' to some extent. It is a bit patronising, I suppose, but it seems to me that you mean well.

In reply to Fiend:

Saw this thread and haven't specially started a thread or posted on other climbing-related threads because of it...because I don't think I need to justify how often or where I post to. And I don't post all that often full stop, because I'm working during the week and, generally, out actually climbing on the w/e. But if anyone's really that interested in checking my posting history...I started a thread a couple of days before going to Pembrokeshire, wanting info on Range West, and only got a couple of replies. (Thanks Pylon King for taking the time to provide some information). So is it that everyone posting on here, male and female, is too busy on t'inernet to actually have made the effort to get out to places like Range West?! (tongue in cheek smiley as I know Fiend goes cragging in lots of different places)

In reply to Fiend: I would post more often if there weren't already so many posts to read that take forever to get through!

In reply to moomin: And I think part of the reason I don't start many (any?) threads on RT is that I don't usually have anything I really need to ask about. Not saying I know everything, but I guess if there ever are climbing-related questions I have, I'd ask my climbing buddies.

I often have questions about destinations...but usually do a search of previous threads and that usually comes up with the sort of information I'm after. Rather than posting another "has anyone climbed in morocco?" thread. I'd probably do that with a climbing-related question too if there was something I did need to ask about.

In reply to moomin:


LOL, certainly. And a star for posting a non-reactive response.

I mean if you haven't got stuff you want to post about, fair enough. It's not just about posting questions though.



In reply to Bella:

Yes I was doubtful about mentioning you by name as I know you just don't post much on here in general.


This thread is posted in the context of Mick's and Squirrel's gender-climbing-related threads, and people being interested in those issues, I wouldn't have thought of it otherwise.

In reply to Fiend:
I don't post much because I, err, don't climb much (except indoors) so I don't have much to say!
Is that OK?

In reply to fimm:

Not having much to say is fine. Some people on here seem to have far too much to say .

Still, there's always mark reeve's "Favourite hold" thread...

In reply to Fiend:

And there, I think, Bella has hit the nail on the head. Instead of posting blindingly obvious questions, only to get shouted down and flamed, we do research first, and generally find the answers we're looking for.

Personally, I think taking serious rock climbing advice off these forums is a bit of a joke. I'm sure a lot of poeple on here do know what they're talking about, but I also think a lot of people talk out of their arse. As a human being, I tend to ask advice from those I trust. As I've never met 99.9% of you, I'm not inclined to trust what you say. And I *think* that's because I'm human, rather than specifically a woman.

In reply to Fiend:

http://www.ukhillwalking.com/forums/t.php?t=194971&v=1#2838847

I think you are asking the question why there are not as many women posters on Rocktalk or Rock destinations despite the high numbers of female members of the forums.

I asked a similar question about politics and it was brought to my attention that the cut and thrust of aggressive male dominated threads does not appeal to women that much. Especially when all advice is considered patronising anyway. The reality of the situation is that women prefer to communicate in differenet ways - well according to sociologists anyway!
From what I remember, with males it is a matter of who shouts loudest and longest wins, women are less likely to make their view known and see no competition in a
discussion environment.

Fex.

In reply to Fex Wazner:

This is one of the many very contested issues in gender research (possibly one of the most) and I don't think it is right to present it as a simple matter of (social) scientific fact.

In reply to cathsullivan:

Yup, I am well aware that there is a debate and I did not state it as fact. It's an interesting theory, what's your take on it?

Fex.

In reply to Fex Wazner:

Well, your statement that it was 'reality' might imply that you think it's fact. But, I take your point.

what's your take on it?

Well, I'm not entirely sure as there is so much contradictory evidence (as ever) and I'm probably not familiar enough with it all to draw a firm conclusion. I suspect that there are some 'real' differences (on average) but I think this is often over-stated. Everyday interpretations of this (e.g., in the media) tend not to recognise the fact, for example, that gender differences are average group differences and that they tend to be overlapping distributions. As with most of these things, I feel that the really key questions (academically) are about what causes these observed gender differences. But these are the most difficult questions (nature-nurture chesnut) and I sometimes think that they are not really questions that can be answered empirically. Also, personally, I'm more interested in other aspects of gender and language than I am in group differences between men and women.

In reply to cathsullivan:

The absolute classic argument has to be that women use the phone more often and have longer conversations than men, becasue they are more sociable and more concerned with how other people react to what was being said. Guys are just supposed to exchange short bursts of information and pay little attention to the atmosphere at the other end of the phone.

Things may have changed since I did any serious reading on the subject, but I do think men and women prefer different forms of communication, whether or not there is any real underlying reason for this is a real issue though as you say.

Fex.

In reply to Fiend:


Get the gist of what you're saying but does come across at patronising, however you say it tbh.

I post on Rocktalk etc when there's a post that interests me. Mainly though I prefer to talk about climbing to people than talk online. My friends know how I climb and I find it more helpful talking to them. Some of them, we've known each other for years so I get much more out of talking to them, than strangers I have never met who *could* give dubious advice.

Sometimes I would rather just climb than talk about the minutae and some of it seems quite petty. Too much information can be unhelpful when I want a clear head for climbing eg indoors I don't want to know the grade of a climb before I climb it as I prefer not to have preconceptions about how hard it will be for me (poor example).

In reply to Fex Wazner:

On politics, some of the men there just like to rant in an emotional and irrational manner. They try to "shout the loudest" but just come across as either drunk or ignorant sometimes. I often use stats when I argue which men often complain about in DTP. lol

In reply to Fiend:
I have been busy with work and other random bits. Changing your nationality isn't exactly done in one easy step. And I have actually been off climbing


Oddly enough - I normally do post in Rock Talk. As I said I actually have a life as of late!

If you don't beleive me: http://www.ukhillwalking.com/forums/info/search.php?id=10665

In reply to Fiend:

Something else just occurred to me that might be of relevence to this discussion. I don't know about other people but if I'm going to post a thread I feel like it should be productive and it should spark off discussion, so I'm not wasting people's time. So there are a lot of times when I've done something I'm really proud of but wouldn't think it was relevent to start a thread, though I might contribute it to another. Even my thread (referenced above) about climbing my first severe was broadened by asking others if they had experienced similar things, even though I was really just dead proud and wanted to tell everyone about my achievement.

Not sure if this is a difference between men and women though, but it has traditionally been assumed that men feel more comfortable 'bigging themselves up' and thus might feel happier starting a 'statement' thread rather than a 'question' thread. Just wondering...

In reply to Fiend:

Well, I have posted on some Rocktalk topics, eg about half/double ropes, where I was trying to follow the physics of the question.
I'll read many of the threads but don't post if I don't think I can add anything useful, for example wouldn't bother discussing stuff like grades of climbs I haven't done (which is most of them ). I certainly wouldn't talk about my latest achievements unless there was something unusual about them, except to people I know fairly well - at the moment that doesn't include any of you, give it time...

In reply to Fiend:

I could detail every wall I visit each week, the routes and grades we climb, how HJonesey and I are going with friends climbing in Sardinia. Or perhaps ask trivial questions to satisfy your assumption that women can only post on banal topics, but surely arrogant to boast of new achievements, and embarrassed to admit couldn't climb the 4a on sandstone while being laughed at by Nao

In reply to Fiend:

If you had actually bothered to check my profile you would see that I regulary post in rocktalk. I've been climbing since I could walk, I'm currently a climbing instructor, and feel perfectly happy posting in response to threads about climbing whne I feel I have something to say. If I don't, because I'm not a man, I don't see the need to repeat what someone else has already said.

In reply to Fiend:

often I spend more of my time at crags or walls socialising than I do actually climbing (much to my other halfs disgust) and on RT i spend most of the time in the more social forums such as chat room or DTP sometimes i´ll start a thread in rocktalk e.g. Devon Bouldering which I posted a couple of days ago. I don´t have any particular fear of posting in any particular category and hadn´t really considered gender issues on the forums as that kind of thing sails straight over my head never was much good at politics at school always prefered being outside playing rounders

C*

In reply to bendy:

In the US as elsewhere the women's movement of the Sixties and Seventies brought about new rights for women. The vote had been won in 1920 (seventy years after the first women's movement was started in 1848 by Elizabeth Cady Stanton in Seneca Falls, upstate New York), but inequality was still rife in the Sixties. Several great steps forward occurred in this turbulent social period. Birth control pills were given Food and Drug Administration approval in 1960 and in 1964 the Civil Rights Act prohibited employment on the basis of sex which was meant to give women equal opportunities in the work place. In the 70's there was Roe vs. Wade which gave women more reproductive rights and the inclusion of Title 9 in the Education Codes of 1972 gave women equal access to higher education. Title 9 outlawed quotas limiting women's enrollment in graduate schools, consequently the number of women doctors, lawyers, engineers and other professions doubled and doubled again. Title 9 also increased funds and opportunities for women athletes, this had a huge effect on woman's participation levels in sports. Whereas 1 in 27 high school girls played sports 25 years ago, 1 in 3 do today. Today Title 9 is as contentious and important as ever as women still fight for equal opportunities in sport. A significant case involving Title 9 involves the climber and modern feminist Tori Allen. Allen is not only a top performer on rock but also as a pole vaulter and with her father, they are using Title 9 to persuade the Indiana State High School Athletic Association to recognize pole vaulting as a girl's track and field event in Allen's home state, Indiana. This recognition will hopefully increase funds and resources so that Allen, and other women, will have gender equity with men so they will have the opportunity to reach their full potential and have a chance at Olympic selection.

http://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/page.php?id=110

In reply to Mick Ryan - UKClimbing.com:


eeeeerrrrr thanks ... got anything english?


C*

In reply to rock waif:


And, lacking immediate access to a New Labour-style spin doctor, I went ahead and posted it anyway, hoping (not in vain it seems), that most people would take the idea at face value.


I think that is a good point and I've met quite a few people who find some of the discussions on here too nerdy. Is there any gender correlation there though?


In reply to Katie Weston:

I did actually bother to check your profile, including the "all posts by this user".

In reply to Fiend:

No problem, however you did it, some woman would have probably moaned. Obviously I am not saying women moan more than men but because it's probably the nature of the topic.

<skates on thin ice>
I don't know about gender correlations on this, there may be none. I just don't remember or think to ask about that much detail. I do just before I will climb a route but that's about it. I guess also because I do not find it that interesting, I am less inclined to post about it. For example, I attempted a route on the weekend and could not finish it. I thought about asking how others did it but I did not think it was that interesting, and everyone climbs differently.

Maybe I will still ask, as it was a nice route.

In reply to Fiend:
Well in that case why include me in the patronising be brave and make a post in rocktalk part?
Yes I do choose to post in other forums from looking at all my postings most are in down the pub, but quite alot aren't, but feel happy to come forward on rocktalk or teh gear forums if I feel I have an opinion.

In reply to Fiend:

lol lol lol what on earth? ha haaaaaa.

I post about climbing. I post about non-climbing things too.

does it matter?



p.s. keep up the good work

In reply to Fiend:

I've just spotted this thread and I'm not sure I understand it. I am trying to cut down on the number of posts I make because I spend too much time on here already and I have other things I should be doing, like planning my next trip, writing my next article, updating the club website and working out which weekends I can go away on over the next few months. Oh, and there'e family stuff too.

In any case, UKC is far more than Rocktalk or Rock Destinations. We don't all have to be the same as you, you know!

I have a challenge for you. Post a topic about mountaineering on Winter Climbing or Expedition and Alpine. Secondly, each day, post a reply to a topic that catches your eye in the Winter Climbing or Expedition and Alpine forums. Again it doesn't matter what the topic is about, as long as what you reply is mountaineering related and on-topic (and again, intelligible).

I will grant you exemption for the days you are actually out mountaineering, and if you complete this task successfully I might even start to regard you as my equal :-P

In reply to Fiend:

PS I was unable to post anything on here last week because I was in the Ardeche. I didn't get any real climbing done though unless you count bouldering. Surprisingly interesting though. Limestone.

In reply to Fiend: I was in Cornwall last week, but I've posted sensibly on Cidernut's hard climbing thread, even though I am the softest climber ever to have lived, I still have an opinion on what makes me climb better. Now stop patronising and telling us how and what to post. ;^)

In reply to Tiggs:
I'm getting very tempted to start posting replies on threads about things I know nothing or very little about, or maybe just repeat previous advice. After all Fiend told me to post more on Rocktalk so I'd better do as he says! :-P

In reply to Katie Weston:

hey, if it works for the men on here...

In reply to Fiend:

Dear Fiend,

How long have you been climbing? Your profile says 4-10 years - does this mean that you have only been climbing for 4 years? How come you haven't put your hardest grades in? Were you too shy to?

My challenge to you is that you be brave and put them in.

Does this sound patronising? Oh - I'm sure that you won't take it as such, but will take it in the kind and encouraging way in which I intended it without me having to bother to put it all into PC speak.

(most women just post what they want to, when they want to. After a few years, the climbing discussions don't tend to cover new ground...)

In reply to Fiend:

Since you listed my name in one of your replies, I will take the time to answer you: I am a beginner, and reading technical stuff on a climbing thread can be tiring (that's also part of my job, reading technical stuff, and I do not always fancy doing that during the evening) and boring at times, and really interesting when properly written (which is far from being always the case) at other times. I find being shown what to do in real life, 10 000 times more efficient for me as a learning experience anyway.

My lack of expertise prevents me from posting my own threads at the moment: I would not have anything useful to add and most of my questions are answered by a search at this stage.

I also find that watching other better climbers in action helps me demystify certain moves and manage them where I have failed before.
The threads definitely lack the visual element that does so much for me.

I am not afraid of speaking out though, so watch out, one day I may well slag you off in one of your climbing thread, just because you dared posting this one and defy me!

In reply to Fiend:

Hmmm... I have also noticed that whenever I reply to a thread it ends.

I just counted, and out of the 12 posts in my profile, I am the last poster on 6 of them....

This is probably the end of this thread now! So encouraging me to post more is NOT conducive to good conversation....

In reply to tlm:

Used to happen to me, too. Now they just ignore me and carry on regardless.
I remember Rosie A saying when it happened to her, she took it to mean she'd obviously made the perfect response which no-one could better...

In reply to kamala:

That's my belief too, particularly if its mainly blokes on the thread - stunned into silence they are....

In reply to Tiggs:

I always think they just felt that their paltry whittering would look bad in comparison....

In reply to tlm, Tiggs, and Kamala:

Our arguments are so much more balanced, responsible and definitive, that they just have to shut up and ponder.

In reply to Fiend:

Sorry, Fiend, what's your point? I have been posting climbing related topics all the time (and actually not a lot of other ones at all) for years now. Mostly, I get some useful replies, but not that many (anywyas not as many as "what's the greatest curry recipe?" etc). And there are loads of other girls who do so, too. Can't see what you want to you try and achieve?

In reply to Fiend:

Just to reiterate what I am saying here:

Mick posts about a Women's Climbing Forum and gets a huge reaction from women who are have strong views on a Women's Climbing Forum.

SecretSquirrel posts asking why women don't post on the UKClimbing climbing forums, and gets a large response from women who have opinions and views on why women don't post on the climbing forums.

I look at these two threads, see the interest women have in the issue of posting on climbing forums, and see the crux of the issue to be, well, posting on climbing forums. Therefore I post this topic to see if more women will post on the climbing forums OR if they won't and perhaps will give reasons why not.

It really is as simple as that. I'm not so stupid as to be ordering anyone around, nor trying to make some snide hidden point, nor trying to provoke a reaction, nor trying to piss people off. Yes the title is a bit dramatic, I'm not so stupid to have missed that either - it's to get people's attention.

This is for all those people who are interested in Mick's and Squirrel's topics about women's climbing forums and postings, and it's just putting forward a suggestion about posting - I would expect the response is that either women would give posting more a try (as some may have done), or explain why they don't post (which some have done civilly - I hope that is useful to Squirrel, Mick and the others who are interested in the gender/posting issue). There are also a few more hostile reactions which is a pity and I have nothing to reply to those.

In reply to Alison Stockwell:

So you aren't posting so much because you're busy doing other stuff? Okay.

(BTW I've noticed plenty of topical posts from you in the past, I don't think you fit into Squirrel's "Women posting on Rocktalk" question).



To reply with the courtesy such a challenge deserves:

Sorry, I can't do that, I don't have any interest in those areas of climbing nor those forums. That's why I don't post on them.

In reply to Sandrine:

Thank you for giving a civil and informative response.

As for slagging me off in a climbing thread in the future - well I guess there has to be someone who hasn't slagged me off yet.

In reply to Heike:


Yes. This topic isn't for you then (unless you are interested in other women's replies perhaps).


See a couple of posts above.

In reply to Fex Wazner:


Well, that was, I presume, what SecretSquirrel was asking. But my suggestion to post more is derived from that, yes.


Interesting point, although not one for me to discuss.

In reply to climbingpixie:



That's an interesting idea - and a good reason for not posting so much, quality over quantity.

In reply to fiend$ish:


I don't make that assumption at all. I don't really know who posts on banal topics.

In reply to Fiend:
Ok, I take your point, I didn't bother reading all these threads, because I am a bit tired of "women this and women that". But I felt got at as it seems all the time there are people saying women aren't really into climbing, they don't post climbing topics, etc which simply isn't true!

In reply to Fiend:


Heh heh heh. This coming from you. Funny.

And yes, ladies: He's Still Single!

In reply to Fiend:

Thank you for explaining what you are trying to achieve, and I think it's brave of you to raise topics that are likely to provoke a strong reaction.

I had to search to find Secret Squirrel's post as I was away at the time. I think that making gender distinctions is sometimes of value, but can get very irritating because I regard myself simply as a person and I don't need constantly reminding what "sort" I am. I also think when it comes to posters versus lurkers this is not necessarily a gender issue. It's quite reasonable for people not to want to make idiots of themselves whatever sex they are.

As far as feeling slagged off by people is concerned; I hope you don't take that to heart. It's just an internet forum and in my experience individuals who post are often very different in real life. My view is that often what people post can be taken in multiple ways; and generally it's the good way that's intended. If not, well people who slag others off with the deliberate intention to cause distress are generally at fault.
Your contributions to these forums are refreshingly interesting even if I don't always agree with them. Please carry on, and don't take anything I post the wrong way. I have an odd sense of humour that is sometimes misinterpreted.

In reply to Alison Stockwell:


That is fair enough, clearly gender issues are more interesting to some than to others (I am amongst the others, really).


Oh don't worry, my reply about that was a wry wink at the reactions I've got in my posting history, and wasn't about this particular topic.