The best phone for trail running

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 Nexility 28 Feb 2023

Hi, my name is Miha I am finishing up high school and im doing a project on the best phone for trail running

I was hoping you could help me out. 

What do you think are the most important things when having a phone with you while running? is it battery life? Size, weight GPS, price? What do you see that your phone does not have and you wish it had? Do you use a watch while running, and if so why did you pick that particular watch?

I would really appreciate if you would take a moment to answer my questions, it would help me out a lot

Thank you in advance 

 deepsoup 28 Feb 2023
In reply to Nexility:

Hi Miha,

I use an Ulefone Armor 8

Pros:
It's 'ruggedised' - waterproof, shockproof etc.  (Waterproof is especially important because I use it for paddling too.)
It doubles as a GPS device, and also takes decent photos.
Syncs to my watch via Bluetooth.
Wasn't massively expensive.  (£100 quid odd to buy outright, no contract or anything.)

Oh, and one slightly unusual thing I use it for is to run the 'Merlin' app to identify birds from the sounds they make.  (That app is very clever, I can't even see the birds half the time.)

Cons:
It's big and heavy compared to some other phones.  (Which is offset a bit by it not needing a case.)  But, y'know, it's still just a phone - so still a lot smaller and lighter than, say, a bottle of water.

My watch is a Garmin 630, which has lots of clever functions that I never use.  I bought that one because it popped up second-hand for a bargain price on here when the original owner upgraded to a better one.

HTH.

 Michael Hood 28 Feb 2023
In reply to Nexility:

You don't need a phone to go trail running.

7
 veteye 28 Feb 2023
In reply to Nexility:

The best phone for trail running, is the one which you leave behind, turned off.

11
 Denning76 28 Feb 2023
In reply to Nexility:

If it works if I've broken an ankle and am stuck on a hill, then I'm happy. If it doesn't do that I'm sad. Don't care about anything else.

 Levy_danny 01 Mar 2023
In reply to veteye:

Maybe in summer but in winter a phone with signal could be the difference between life and death. 

1
 MisterPiggy 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Nexility:

I just use my usual phone (Oppo/android). Has GPS; I run Strava and it's pretty accurate. I'll also take photos if passing something memorable.

It's carried in a bum bag that also holds house keys and ID. The bag keeps the small of my back warm too.

I don't have a watch.

Good luck with your survey.

 veteye 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Levy_danny:

Probably my ignorance of what trail running is then. I thought that it involved running on pre-ordained routes, and certainly where it was part of a race, would be marshalled and names logged-in and out. 

8
 yorkshireman 01 Mar 2023
In reply to veteye:

> Probably my ignorance of what trail running is then. I thought that it involved running on pre-ordained routes, and certainly where it was part of a race, would be marshalled and names logged-in and out. 

Think the original just means running on hiking type trails which makes it a weird question and it certainly had a whiff of ChatGPT around it. Surely the one you have is the right one. I take pictures with mine and would use it an emergency but there's no specific choice behind it driven by trail running. 

The only one I wouldn't choose is an iPhone in the winter because all the ones I've had have batteries that die quickly in the cold. 

 Levy_danny 01 Mar 2023
In reply to veteye:

Tbf it’s a bit of a spectrum and usually would be but trails can take you to quite remote places and a twisted ankle in winter can become quite serious quite quickly. I wouldn’t buy a phone specifically for running though just use the one I’ve got. 

 Robert Durran 01 Mar 2023
In reply to veteye:

> Probably my ignorance of what trail running is then. 

It's the new name for "running on paths". Invented as a marketing ploy to sell specialised "trail running" kit. You know, stuff like t-shirts, bum-bags and phones.

9
 deepsoup 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Robert Durran:

> It's the new name for "running on paths".

The term is largely meaningless so it could be, or it could be more serious than that.  Some people say you're not fell running unless you're in the Lake District, so it could actually be fell running.  There are certainly places in the Peak where you could be out 'trail running' and a badly sprained ankle could become very serious if you don't have the means to call for help, especially during the winter.

I just call it 'running' personally (though tbh I sometimes feel a bit of a fraud even calling it that) - even so, I get far enough away from 'civilisation' and other people that it would feel a little bit irresponsible not having one.  Maybe to call mountain rescue.  Maybe if I can get to a road being able to call a friend or a taxi would actually prevent MRT from getting a callout.

> Invented as a marketing ploy to sell specialised "trail running" kit. You know, stuff like t-shirts, bum-bags and phones.

Nobody markets a phone specifically for trail running, "outdoors" is about as close as they get.

 deepsoup 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Levy_danny:

> I wouldn’t buy a phone specifically for running though just use the one I’ve got. 

I wouldn't either, but I did buy one specifically for sea kayaking and now that I have it use it for other stuff too. 

I never really intended to have a second, separate phone but now that I do I find it's actually quite a good compromise with the "just leave it behind" ethos - the phone that gets calls, messages, emails etc., does indeed stay behind.

 Robert Durran 01 Mar 2023
In reply to deepsoup:

> Some people say you're not fell running unless you're in the Lake District.

You're not. In Scotland it is always called hill running. I think internationally it is often called mountain running.

And by that precedent trail running is only possible in North America since we have paths, not trails in the UK. But somehow "path" isn't cool enough for the marketing types.

> Nobody markets a phone specifically for trail running, "outdoors" is about as close as they get.

Just you wait. If there's money in it, just like the other bits of "trail running" kit, there may soon be.

7
 compost 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Nexility:

I was following a gpx route in an unfamiliar area using my phone (hadn't expected a run so didn't print off a paper map) but cold fingers and heavy rain made using the touchscreen almost impossible. Can you fix that?!

 Doug 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Robert Durran:

its 'le trail'  or 'le trail running' in French, even though its on 'chemins' & sentiers', but its fairly new & mostly marketing led - our neighbouring village is trying to market itself as a 'centre de trail' eg https://www.widermag.com/news-des-parcours-trail-ancelle

Post edited at 09:57
 deepsoup 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Robert Durran:

> You're not.

Ha, why am I not surprised?  A niche and somewhat snobbish view, but you're entitled to your opinion. 

Here's a more mainstream view on what constitutes 'fell' -vs- 'trail' running:
https://www.fellrunner.org.uk/faq/frequently-asked-questions

> In Scotland it is always called hill running.

Nope, not always: https://www.isleofjurafellrace.co.uk/

 Robert Durran 01 Mar 2023
In reply to deepsoup:

> Ha, why am I not surprised?  A niche and somewhat snobbish view, but you're entitled to your opinion. 

Not at all. My point is that fellrunning is a peculiarly English (admittedly not just Lakes term) for hill running.

> Here's a more mainstream view on what constitutes 'fell' -vs- 'trail' running:https://www.fellrunner.org.uk/faq/frequently-asked-questions

Of course there's a difference. I just object to the term "trail running". 

Bloody colonisation! Though fell is a norse word so it may be appropriate in areas of Scotland colonised in the past by the vikings where fell or fjell are found in place names.

2
 yorkshireman 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Robert Durran:

> But somehow "path" isn't cool enough for the marketing types.

You seem to have a bit of a bee in your bonnet which is at odds since we're all outdoor types just doing what we love eh? I can't say I've ever called it 'running on paths' but I haven't lived in the UK for a decade so might have missed the memo of acceptable wording.

Paths to me are also of the pavement variety so to me trail makes the distinction - I think most people get it, unless they're deliberately trying not to. 

1
 Enty 01 Mar 2023
In reply to yorkshireman:

Exactly. It's very boring.

I was looking for some trail running shoes in Decathlon last week and couldn't for the life of me find the running on paths section.

Trail running = dirt, gravel, stones, grass, unmetalled bridleway, mountain paths, ridges etc etc

Road running = on frigging tarmac

Not that hard is it?

E

 Neil Williams 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Michael Hood:

> You don't need a phone to go trail running.

It's very prudent to carry one, particularly if, as many trail runners do, you go alone and with very light equipment.  A very small dumbphone would do that emergency-call job though.  I reckon you'd regret your choice if you went flying, were badly injured and had to wait possibly hours or longer for someone to find you.  Obviously if you normally run in areas without a signal that doesn't work and you'd need to use more traditional methods e.g. checking in with someone.

I personally find it handy for navigation - sure, you also need a paper map and to know how to use one, but a phone is just more convenient.

I just use my iPhone 13 Mini in a decent ruggedised case, plenty are available.  Great battery life and waterproof.

Post edited at 10:49
1
 Neil Williams 01 Mar 2023
In reply to veteye:

> Probably my ignorance of what trail running is then. I thought that it involved running on pre-ordained routes, and certainly where it was part of a race, would be marshalled and names logged-in and out. 

I think most people would just see trail running as "the middle one", i.e.:

Road running: er, fairly obvious

Trail running: basically the running version of lowland walking, e.g. along old railway lines, along the top of Stanage, through the local woods, whatever.

Fell running: serious stuff on mountains, the running version of hillwalking.

Obviously if it's a race the route is organised and there's safety cover, but it doesn't in any of them have to be a race.

Post edited at 10:53
 Neil Williams 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Robert Durran:

> It's the new name for "running on paths". Invented as a marketing ploy to sell specialised "trail running" kit. You know, stuff like t-shirts, bum-bags and phones.

I think this thread is the first time I've ever heard the phrase "running on paths".  And there are different types of shoe for each - it's not pure marketing - you're not going to enjoy running along the rock on top of Stanage in Mudclaws or whatever, whereas your road shoes aren't going to be great in the mud.

Post edited at 10:55
 Robert Durran 01 Mar 2023
In reply to yorkshireman:

> You seem to have a bit of a bee in your bonnet which is at odds since we're all outdoor types just doing what we love eh? I can't say I've ever called it 'running on paths' but I haven't lived in the UK for a decade so might have missed the memo of acceptable wording.

I don't think there was any specific term for it until quite recently. I just think it is telling that the marketing people have gone for the "cool" americanisation of "trail". 

> Paths to me are also of the pavement variety so to me trail makes the distinction - I think most people get it.

Really? That amazes me.

1
 Neil Williams 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Robert Durran:

> I don't think there was any specific term for it until quite recently. I just think it is telling that the marketing people have gone for the "cool" americanisation of "trail". 

I think it's because we didn't have a word for it so we nicked it from the US.  It is a different sort of thing, that sort-of line up-ish with the Mountain Training awards, i.e. that fell running would probably sit in ML type territory but trail running in WGL/Lowland Leader.

The FRA site does explain how races work (though there's plenty of overlap, e.g. Lakes in a Day includes elements of all three, in essence north of Ambleside it's a fell race and south of it it's a trail race with plenty of road joining the bits up), but just "going fell running" or "going trail running" conjure up different images to me.  I could go trail running at lunchtime, but for me to go fell running would involve a 4 hour drive to the nearest thing big and mountainy enough.  Just "going running" would to me default to road.

Post edited at 10:59
 compost 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Robert Durran:

Good god. Are people being deliberately obtuse?

trail noun (PATH)

a path through a countryside, mountain, or forest area, often made or used for a particular purpose:

 deepsoup 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Neil Williams:

> The FRA site does explain how races work (though there's plenty of overlap, e.g. Lakes in a Day includes elements of all three, in essence north of Ambleside it's a fell race and south of it it's a trail race with plenty of road joining the bits up), but just "going fell running" or "going trail running" conjure up different images to me.

I posted a link to their FAQs above, and messed it up so here it is again: https://www.fellrunner.org.uk/faq/frequently-asked-questions

They fairly specifically don't say that - the difference between 'fell running' and 'trail running' as far as they're concerned is all about the terrain and the nature of the run itself and not where it is geographically.  (And of course for races they also have a grading system, breaking them down into A,B,C for how hilly they are and the nature of the terrain, S,M,L for distance.)

 Robert Durran 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Neil Williams:

> I think it's because we didn't have a word for it so we nicked it from the US.  

We had a perfectly good word - path!

The other problem with using the US "trail" is that trail here always used to mean something you made with your footprints (eg trail in the snow or mud), though I've noticed that people are often now using "track" for that (another americanisation?), even though a track has always been an unpaved vehicle road.

2
 Robert Durran 01 Mar 2023
In reply to compost:

> Good god. Are people being deliberately obtuse?

No.

> trail noun (PATH)

> a path through a countryside, mountain, or forest area, often made or used for a particular purpose:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trail

 deepsoup 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Neil Williams:

> A very small dumbphone would do that emergency-call job though.

Assuming the OP isn't a 'bot - I think that's the nub of only real question for them to consider.  (Other than whether or not to carry a phone at all.)

You could take a small, light and cheap dumbphone with buttons, but probably no GPS.

Or you could take a smartphone you can use to get a GPS fix on your location (or that rescuers can potentially use to locate you by sending you a SARLOC link to open with a browser).  Perhaps you also want the GPS functionality in a non-emergency situation, and maybe you want a nicer camera than a dumbphone is likely to have too. 

The downside, as mentioned above, is that touchscreen phones can be very difficult to use when you have cold hands and everything is sopping wet.  And chances are the battery life is shorter than a dumbphone too, as the fancy functions all draw power from the battery.

Oh, I just thought of another good use for a GPS phone other than navigating with it at the time..  These events are great - 2hr (very) mini-mountain marathons in the Peak using an orienteering app to keep track of the controls and tot up your score: https://explorerevents.co.uk/map-run/

(The terrain of those events is kind of borderline between what would be considered a 'fell' -vs- a 'trail' race in a mass start event.)

 Wimlands 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Nexility:

Hope you’re getting all this down for your school project..will certainly pad it out if you have a word count to hit… 😀

 Justaname 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Nexility:

The phone you currently have....

Each OS has pro's and con's in the features that you have in the apps (e.g. Maps, Garmin Connect, Strava). Ona n iPhone I can add new shoes to Strava in the App, but can't on Android, a minor point I know. I've forgotten what's beter on Android. I can easily send routes to my Garmin device directly from an iPhone, on Android I need to email the route to myself and other convolutions, but that may have changed following an update to either Garmin or OS Maps.

I use an iPhone 12 and appreciate the much improved battery life it has over any Samsung phone I've experienced. Durability is important, and good water resistance are important, and I've found my phone is pretty good for this (apart from a broken back glass). A decent camera you can use in the rain is good. 

Unless you use an app on the phone to record your route, or you're on an epic round, battery life shouldn't be any more of a requirement specific to running as opposed to anything else.

Size - a big screen is good for mapping (especially if you're long sighted), but a larger phone takes up an awkward shape in a bumbag.

I find that for the 1st month I am pretty caustious with the phone and wrap it in a buff to protect the screen, but shortly after that it just goes in the bumbag. Yes it gets little scratches on the screen, but it'll get those in ordinary use anyway.

 compost 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Robert Durran:

From your link: In the United Kingdom, the term trail is in common usage. Longer distance walking routes, and government-promoted long-distance paths, collectively known as National Trails, are also frequently called ways as in the Pennine Way and South Downs Way. Generally, the term footpath is preferred for pedestrian routes, including long-distance trails, and is used for urban paths and sometimes in place of pavement. Track is used for wider paths (wide enough for vehicles), often used for hiking. The terms bridleway, byway, restricted byway are all recognised legal terms and to a greater or lesser extent in general usage.

Trail running is a catch-all term for all of these types of route. 

 Neil Williams 01 Mar 2023
In reply to deepsoup:

> I posted a link to their FAQs above, and messed it up so here it is again: https://www.fellrunner.org.uk/faq/frequently-asked-questions

> They fairly specifically don't say that - the difference between 'fell running' and 'trail running' as far as they're concerned is all about the terrain and the nature of the run itself and not where it is geographically.  (And of course for races they also have a grading system, breaking them down into A,B,C for how hilly they are and the nature of the terrain, S,M,L for distance.)

I suspect you're not familiar with Lakes in a Day.  The split is at Ambleside, but that's because of the terrain, not the bounded areas - the first half of the race is mostly self navigated high fell, the second half is mostly lowland trail.

The race recommends fell shoes for the first bit and trail shoes for the second bit, and allows a change at Ambleside.

 petemeads 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Robert Durran:

The shorter (80 mile) version of the South Downs Way was first run as a trail race in 1986. I remember trying to get an entry in the 90's but it was that year the trail running championships and entries filled within a few hours. Definitely a different concept to fell or road running, Britain has several national trails, including the Pennine Way, marked on OS maps.

 Robert Durran 01 Mar 2023
In reply to compost:

Yes, it's very insidious. Traditionally we had things like The Pennine Way. Now we have stuff like "The Cape Wrath Trail" - which doesn't even exist in any physical form - it's entirely a marketing ploy!

2
 Neil Williams 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Robert Durran:

> We had a perfectly good word - path!

Path is wider in scope.  Outside the front of my house is a path (I live in one of those 1970s estates where the road is at the back).  If I went running on it, as I fairly often do, I'd call it road running because it's tarmacced.  Road running doesn't mean you run down the bit intended for vehicles, it just means running on tarmac (I know you know that, I'm being facetious )

> The other problem with using the US "trail" is that trail here always used to mean something you made with your footprints (eg trail in the snow or mud), though I've noticed that people are often now using "track" for that (another americanisation?), even though a track has always been an unpaved vehicle road.

I'm not sure that running following the trail/track left by someone else is even a thing, other than in the context of fox hunting, which is (a) banned and (b) called hunting.  If someone came up with it they'd probably come up with a name.  Until it is a thing we don't need a name for it.

Though if I saw someone's footprints, I'd say they were someone's footprints, not a track or a trail.

(It does come up in Scouting - following "tracking signs" - but it's so niche anyone who's never been in a younger Section in Scouting will never have heard of it)

Post edited at 11:44
 Robert Durran 01 Mar 2023
In reply to petemeads:

> Definitely a different concept to fell or road running.

I never said it wasn't; again, it is just the term I object to.

> Britain has several national trails, including the Pennine Way, marked on OS maps.

See my last post. Also these things used to just get called long distance footpaths. As I said, insidious.

Post edited at 12:08
1
 ianstevens 01 Mar 2023
In reply to veteye:

> Probably my ignorance of what trail running is then. I thought that it involved running on pre-ordained routes, and certainly where it was part of a race, would be marshalled and names logged-in and out. 

Have you heard of this thing called training?

 Neil Williams 01 Mar 2023
In reply to compost:

> From your link: In the United Kingdom, the term trail is in common usage. Longer distance walking routes, and government-promoted long-distance paths, collectively known as National Trails, are also frequently called ways as in the Pennine Way and South Downs Way. Generally, the term footpath is preferred for pedestrian routes, including long-distance trails, and is used for urban paths and sometimes in place of pavement. Track is used for wider paths (wide enough for vehicles), often used for hiking. The terms bridleway, byway, restricted byway are all recognised legal terms and to a greater or lesser extent in general usage.

> Trail running is a catch-all term for all of these types of route. 

Agreed.  It sort of sits in the middle - it's not road running (which takes place on tarmac) and it's not fell running (which takes place on the high fell).  It's the stuff in the middle.

I suspect if you really wanted another word for it "off-road running" would work - of course a fell is also off road but I think most people wouldn't have the image of a fell run if you said that.

The term is also sort of applied to cycling, though I suppose "gravel biking" is sort of squeezing in there, for the sort of thing that wouldn't be much fun on a skinny tyred road bike, but equally is fine on a decent hybrid and doesn't require a full-on MTB, e.g. unsurfaced old railway lines and the likes.

Post edited at 11:49
 Robert Durran 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Neil Williams:

> Though if I saw someone's footprints, I'd say they were someone's footprints, not a track or a trail.

Really? You've never followed a trail up, say, to a winter climb?

 Neil Williams 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Robert Durran:

> Really? You've never followed a trail up, say, to a winter climb?

I've followed someone's footprints, but I wouldn't use the term "following a trail" for that.  I'd say following their footprints/footsteps.

 Robert Durran 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Neil Williams:

> I've followed someone's footprints, but I wouldn't use the term "following a trail" for that.  I'd say following their footprints/footsteps.

Fair enough, though I'm sure it was the most common usage of "trail" in this country before the term "trail running" was invented and the americanisation of trail for path became common.

Post edited at 11:52
3
 deepsoup 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Neil Williams:

> I suspect you're not familiar with Lakes in a Day.

Ah, fair enough then - you're quite right, I'm not.

 Jimbo C 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Nexility:

As long as it has GPS and Strava, all is good. I start recording and put it in my pocket, then get it out of my pocket to stop recording at the end of the run. Battery easily lasts for the hour or so that I'm out. I'd never buy a really big phone as I like to be able to put it in my pocket (it's an Xperia X Compact). If it's raining I put it in a small plastic freezer bag (that I keep and re-use of course).

In reply to Robert Durran:

> It's the new name for "running on paths". Invented as a marketing ploy to sell specialised "trail running" kit. You know, stuff like t-shirts, bum-bags and phones.

I think you mean undershirts, sporrans and telegraphs. 

Post edited at 13:30
 The New NickB 01 Mar 2023
In reply to veteye:

It’s running on trails. That might be through forests, over mountains, whatever. It might be in a race, it might not. It may well be in an environment where some navigation is needed or where an accident could have serious consequences, or it could be in a country park with plenty people around. Doesn’t seem like rocket science to me that there are times when trail running when a phone as part of a safety back up might be a good idea.

Last year my wife went out on a run and whilst some of the run was probably fell rather than trail terrain, she was definitely on a trail when she had an accident that put her in hospital for four nights.

 wbo2 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Nexility: If it will cheer Robert up I often run on tracks, as opposed to trails , so I will call it track running.  Except that's on a track (400m oval thing) so I'll call it a natural track.  They definitely aren't paths, though sometimes I run on those as well.

I fear someones brain has been scrambled by trying to make an exact definition of what defines 'in nick'

 Robert Durran 01 Mar 2023
In reply to wbo2:

> If it will cheer Robert up I often run on tracks, as opposed to trails , so I will call it track running.  Except that's on a track (400m oval thing) so I'll call it a natural track. 

Fair point. 

> I fear someones brain has been scrambled by trying to make an exact definition of what defines 'in nick'

Who? Definitely not me!

 Michael Hood 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Robert Durran:

Can we call it Wild running please 😁, then everyone will know that you're livid about it.

 Robert Durran 01 Mar 2023
In reply to Michael Hood:

> Can we call it Wild running please 😁, then everyone will know that you're livid about it.

Wild? I'm already livid. Clearly.

Anyway isn't wild running simply any running not indoors on a treadmill?

 veteye 02 Mar 2023
In reply to The New NickB:

Please do not get haughty about things. When I was in America, albeit a long time ago, where I was, a trail was either way marked with regularity or was like a groove worn into the landscape; and myriads of people passed along these routes on a daily basis. So in my mind a trail run involved these sorts of public ways, not heading over fells with no waymarkers: A sort of a park run with a bit more length. 

Obviously it is a re-designation of one variation of the old fashioned "going for a cross-country run". It seems that inherent in the discussion is that the derivation and definitions for a trail run vary with different people, and that there is no exact definition.

As t'other Robert says, it is in part to do with marketing.

Rob

 petemeads 02 Mar 2023
In reply to veteye:

You're right about the pre-existing nature of the trail, there has to be a track/path/trail to follow to count as trail running. In the case of hound trailing, the track is made by dragging a smelly sack around the open hillside for dogs to follow by using their advanced olefactory organs - humans need to be able to see where to put their feet so they follow an established path/way/track. If it's not on a track it's not trail running, I'm with you on this.

 tony 02 Mar 2023
In reply to petemeads:

There's a run I do which covers all sorts of ground - there's a bit of scruffy tarmac, landrover tracks, quad bike tracks, old pony tracks, overgrown boggy paths, and a section with no paths or tracks, linking other sections.

I wonder how you would classify that?

 Rampart 02 Mar 2023
In reply to Robert Durran:

>   it's entirely a marketing ploy!

Further evidence of the sinister machinations of Big Trail?

 The New NickB 02 Mar 2023
In reply to veteye:

I really don’t think that I am the one being haughty.

Cross-country is a specific discipline in running, it generally isn’t what most people would consider trail running. 

I organise a club “three day event”. Day one is a Road race, day two is a trail race, although we refer to it as multi terrain, day three is a fell race. The event has been going for 30 years and I can think of other local trail races that have been going for as long. It’s nothing new.

 petemeads 02 Mar 2023
In reply to tony:

Looks like you have invented a new concept, I think it is up to you to find a name for it (and market it appropriately)!

Edit: The New NickB has solved the problem already, multi-terrain covers everything that is not a trail. Note to self: read the whole thread before commenting...

Post edited at 14:54
 tony 02 Mar 2023
In reply to petemeads:

> Looks like you have invented a new concept, I think it is up to you to find a name for it (and market it appropriately)!

Not really. I call it trail runing and all my running friends know what I mean. As someone else said, it's really not complicated.

 petemeads 02 Mar 2023
In reply to tony:

Fair enough. I have no friends...

 Ridge 02 Mar 2023
In reply to The New NickB:

I thought the distinction between trail and fell races was that one usually costs about £15 more to enter?

 Denning76 03 Mar 2023
In reply to Nexility:

Everything would be a lot better if people stopped banging on about semantics and spent the time going for a run instead. 

 duchessofmalfi 03 Mar 2023
In reply to wbo2:

Surely that's a "wild track" not a "natural track"


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