UKH

We had a great thread (can't remember who started it but ta muchly) a year or so ago about running goals, which inspired me and generated a lot of responses.  So I thought  we might like to compare notes on how it went.

I have not been doing so well recently so it is useful to look back and note that I got a PB in the Reading Half in March (2:06), and ran the Windermere marathon in May (5:12). I had some memorable runs in the hills earlier in the year - a frosty dawn run from Bacup up to Cowpe reservoir, and a trundle round Shining Tor in rather warm weather later in the year.

I think I underestimated the time I needed to recover from the marathon. And I am rubbish in hot weather. And I think  I got a bit anaemic earlier in the summer. Whatever the reason, I did very few runs over 10 miles in the summer, and in Sept and Oct did nothing over 5 miles. I had entered the Loch Rannoch marathon in October but bailed out. Whether all this was physical  incapacity or mental is unclear. My mum died in April and my kids left home in September (the empty nest is truly horrible) so it has not been the most straightforward year ... 

Anyways, I am now feeling a bit perkier, ran 10 miles last Sunday and enjoyed it. The only race on the horizon is the Reading half in April. Maybe next year I should collect interesting Halfs (hmmm "Halves" sounds wrong) next year rather than another marathon? Or just one marathon a year?

I enjoy the ukc Strava club - to those who give me kudos for runs, thank you, it actually means a lot.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Same as last year for me, sub4 at Jura. Did 4:00:26 last year having come the wrong way off the first top and lost a few minutes so I know it's possible.

Why don't you try some different stuff like fell and trail races assuming you're not already.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Bit fed up at the moment, had set a goal of 1000km for the year and have been up on blocks for the last month waiting for hernia surgery just 30km short of the goal. Still set a triathlon pb this year and have some great races to look forward to in 2020. 

In reply to BusyLizzie:

I didn't have any running goals at the start of the year, but when the weather started getting warm I decided since I couldn't canicross in the warm weather then I needed a goal to keep me running until canicross season started again.

So at the start of the summer I could run 5km slowly with some rests. I made it my aim to run 10km by autumn. I ran 11km this week with barely any rests. I have increased my running to 4 or 5 days a week, 2 or 3 of these will be canicross and then some longer ones on my own. I'm still not very fast when not dog assisted, but can now just keep going and today ran up both flights of stairs on my 7.5km route.

Feeling strong 😊

In reply to the sheep:

I too set a 1000km goal, and as of this morning I've got 186 to go, so very much on target. I've come at it as a 'non-runner' so it's been good to see how it's changed me. I'm still very much just running for the sake of it though, with little to no real targets. I'd like to run over to Sheffield (from New Mills - exactly 26.2 miles to the train station!) very soon, and I'd like to do more fell races next year but it's all very unstructured. 

Looking forward to next year I'm not sure whether to go for 1000 miles, or 2020km? 

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Set a goal of 50 miles a week for the year starting in April and I'm not on it ha ha

 3 week Holiday knocked me out so now I'm trying to get back with some high mileage for the rest of the year so could catch up if i stay strong

2020 is the goal to be fit for 100 mile race in May so just gonna keep grinding away through the winter

In reply to BusyLizzie:

I had to abandon my goals this year due to heel injuries (complicated ones that I now manage but will never be the same again) in BOTH feet then, horror of horrors, a blood clot in my right shoulder (inexplicable so far despite scans looking for cancer, which was a fun few weeks).

Been building mileage back up slowly. Now up to 30 miles a week and longest run of 12 miles. Goal for the rest of the year is to keep that up really. Next year's goal is at least one trail marathon plus an ultra later in the year. Oh and avoiding physios, podiatrists and definitely hospitals, consultants and scanners!

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Build mileage back up to 50-60mpw after the first marathon this year (Kinloch Rannoch by the way!), then get some more trail runs and maybe even sign up for a trail race or two. 

Winter is going to be rough as I want to be able to do running during the week and get out to the hills on weekends. At least I am ready to run some trails if the snow is lacking this year - just hoping I don't need to run on a treadmill (haven't done that in years!). 

In reply to BusyLizzie:

I only hit one so far, a 2:49 at Boston, sub 2:50 as planned but think I was in better shape.

I wanted to run quicker in a 5k but only went sub 17:30. My only 10 k was the day after a 5k and was 37 something on a hot day.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

I'm on a mission to become so fat adapted that it actually hurts to look at me. 

To do this, I'm going to finish off completing the Wainwright's, get some long days in on the Moor / coast path and eat lots of yogurt. 

Then, I'm coming for a really good 2020 OMM finish and a 2021 BGR. 

In reply to BusyLizzie:

I didn't have major goals this year -both my A races were shortish ultras which were backups as I couldn't get into my first choices (I'm going to enter UTMB again for next year). I completed them both with no real issues but since the one in September, we then moved house and that's involved a lot of DIY work too so I've really struggled to get back into a routine and motivation has taken a bit of a nosedive.

I'm off to join our local running club next week so hopefully that will get me out a bit more and I'll discover new trails and before long XC ski pistes and ski touring routes will be opening up so I'm hoping fitness, which according to TrainingPeaks has taken a massive battering since September, will climb back up.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

After a handful of 2nd, 3rd and 4th's last year my main aim had been to been to win a race. Good start to the year. 5th in the Trigger, 2nd at Bamford and broke 37 min for a 10k. Then stupidly ran the Great Lakes with a sore Achilles pushing it into full blown tendonitis. Now haven't run for 5 months despite physio. Been hammering the road cycling which is fun but missing the fells.

In reply to yorkshireman:

I was getting well psyched for some alpine ultra's, maybe not the UTMB but something with an easier qualifying list.. then my wife announced she's pregnant with twins. I'd literally just entered Boston Marathon and they are due about then.

100 milers are now kicked to touch.

My plan is just 60 miles a week, no specific goals, keep enjoying training and racing and come out of it in 3-4 years time with some sanity..

I'm also coaching high school varsity soccer a lot but love it and have started playing in a local over 35s league, its good fun to be back playing, just Sunday morning and rolling subs so its no real hit on my running. 10 games each spring and fall so not a huge time commitment and with a big squad we all miss when we want.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

I didn't have any major goals other than to run more than last year, which I've done by a long way. I did my first marathon distance run (although not an event) when I ran the Clarendon Way in April (Salisbury to Winchester) in just over 4 hours. Also did my first proper event with the New Forest Half, and managed 1:26:30 which was a good 5 mins quicker than I was hoping for. Just when it was all looking good and my enthusiasm was at its peak, I then started getting IT band knee issues, and haven't been able to run for the last two months and now feel quite fed up... Hopefully it'll pass soon.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Was 60 earlier this year. Set myself the target of (as a 60 year old) running my timed runs (various local routes) quicker than I'd done it in any/every year in my 50's.

Lost some weight, got quicker, finished the target in September; fastest runs since early 2009 when I was 49

Don't think I can beat my best times on each of those runs which were set when I was 45-49. But you never know, maybe I'll lose some more weight and up the mileage.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

My first goal has been achieved, to complete the Dales way Ultra (82 miles from Windemere to Ilkley) in under 24hrs - 23.39! Next is to do the Tour of Pendle fell race and not get timed out. Not done this for about 5 years, but was marshalling last year and got tempted. Serious training has gone into this - distance and hills. We shall find out on 16th this month. All this at 62.

In reply to Michael Hood and Matt Podd:

Inspiring stuff both. 

In reply to BusyLizzie:

2018 finished badly - December started with a decent parkrun followed by the club hike around Longshaw on the Sunday, Monday I was limping with my right leg (hip replaced 18 months previous) and by Jan 1st I was using a crutch to watch MrsPete's festive parkruns. I wanted an MRI scan but Bupa wanted me to see a physio so neither happened. Resting seemed to substantially cure the problem. Restarted parkrunning in Feb, managed to catch Mrs at the finishing line...

The plan for the year had included the Welsh 3000's with my big lad, having failed the previous year in poor conditions, so we started training on the Edale Skyline. First attempt was anticlockwise from Hope and ended up with me stumbling and incoherent descending Lose hill in 7h 25m - hopeless, could only jog the downhills slowly. Tried again 6 weeks later aiming for 6 hours, going clockwise, and had a minute to spare.  Ran quite a lot, no significant pain, much more encouraging.

Booked the hut for the last week in May, just after Finlay Wild broke the old record. Studied his route and timings, multiplied them by 4 and went for it - only to give up at the A5 with cramping and exhaustion having struggled down the West gully of Tryfan. Spent the rest of the week doing more recce work to find the easiest route and get accustomed to the mountains again. Went back a month later and got around in 16 hours (20h 40m total from Ynys to Aber) - skin of our teeth, no visibility on the tops all day. 30 years ago I managed 8h 30m, with a bit of support.

Revisited Edale skyline on the hottest bank holiday in August - wanted 5 hours, got 5h 24m and very dehydrated. Ended up on Burbage and climbed Knight's Move...

Since then focused on getting some speed back whilst adding lsd Sunday jog/runs down the canal, managing 13.1 miles in 2h 13m at what seemed a steady pace prior entering our club's 10m race in September. Managed 88:30, 10 minutes slower than 10 years previous, not last by any means but still a bit disappointed. Started making more effort at the gym, hour- long sessions on the treadmill at constant tempo pace twice a week seem to be working. Finally managed to get under 25 mins again in the last couple of local parkruns. Now to get back under 24 mins by 2020!

Total distance involving some running, but not necessarily uphill, 750km in 10 months.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Thanks for reigniting this topic.

I’ve had a real mix bag this year. My highest mileage and most consistent training since taking up running 4-5 years ago so I’m happy about that.

I DNF’d at Lavaredo which was my main race due to stomach issues but pretty sure a lot of it was mental as well. 

Had an okay result at Snowdon 50 and have enjoyed hill racing. Feeling like I have capacity to be more competitive there.

My list of objectives contained a lot of routes rather than races. I’ve ticked some off this year but still plenty to go for. I’ve recced all the Bob Graham round multiple times and feel ready to have a go at a Tranters when I get the time.

Next year I’m hoping to get a place in the CCC and West Highland Way race but we’ll see. 
 

My wife is expecting our first child in December so will need to be more efficient with training. 

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Great thread sometimes  you have to take a few moments to see how far you have come rather  then how far you need to go. 

I didnt know there was a strava club is it open invite?

In reply to Shaunhaynes99

Yes, just join. See you there.

In reply to EuanM

Gosh yes that will be a change. I always enjoy your runs on strava, very impressive and in great places.

In reply to DaveHK

I love running off road and did a lovely trail half along the Thames Path last year - yes, that's a good plan for 2020. Not fell races, though - I'd still be struggling up the first hill when everyone else was home (I am a bit slow).

In reply to PPP:

How was Kinloch Rannoch? I was sad to miss it.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

My main goal for 2019 was the Bob Graham. Managed it in July which was great, although I didn't massively enjoy it on the day itself as I started finding it hard several hours earlier than I expected! The training motivated me to have some great days out that I wouldn't have done otherwise, both in beautiful and terrible weather, sometimes both on the same day. The highlight was probably a trip with an overnight camp on North Harris in March, which was really remote and absolutely stunning, made even more interesting by snow to sea level in the morning.

Running had taken a bit more of a back seat since then as I think I need to spend a bit more time with our two young children. We've been enjoying parkrun though, which the kids tolerate in the double buggy. My remaining goal for this year is to try and get a sub 20 minute 5k (without the buggy), but I've still got to find about 30s...

I don't have any particular goals for 2020, although I'd like to get at least one big day out in the summer. Maybe the Dartmoor 500m+ summits, which is about 80km. Have vague ideas about trying the Paddy Buckley at some point so might try and get to Wales to have a look at the bits that I'm not familiar with.

I've also been loving the UKC Strava group. It's great to see what other people have been getting up to!

In reply to BusyLizzie:

I wish I had time to run more so my runs are sporadic. Im just pleased that I've been relatively injury free for the most part this year. 

Absolutely deligted to have run a HM distance, for fun, on Thursday this week. Not fast but I made it round.

The UKC Strava group is really inspiring. 

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Not a great year for me. It started well, but then life caught up and I will struggle to reach 1000 miles this year, down from 2000+ the previous year.

Still, I haven't totally given up. I have explored parts new to me of my local moor and do manage the odd run in far-flung places when I go to them, which I enjoy.

Also enjoying the Strava club.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Found  this morning.  

In reply to BusyLizzie:

It was good, thanks! It was my first marathon and certainly not the flattest, but I like smaller races for that reason. Finished top 20, didn't hit the wall (although slowed down a bit) and had good company for most of the race. The only time I didn't have company was when I was having a rough patch at miles 18~22, where I pretty much ran on my own. 

My most favourite race this year is still Kyles 10 Miles. I struggled on it the most out of 5 races this year and was disappointed with the results, but thoroughly enjoyed the route and scenery. I am likely to run it next year if it doesn't clash with some other plans. 

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Hoping to be marathon fit at the beginning of the year then use this as a base to work towards the Pinnacle Ridge Extreme race with some milestones thrown in first. 

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Great thread to start 😁

Completed my first ever race in September, running the snowdonia 50km.

So it's more of a 2021 goal buts it's early in the year so all my training will be this year for it and may as well go big or go home and I'm going to attempt to get a place in the spine challanger - oh no I've said it aloud now. 

Need to sit down and pick a few races to do throughout the year but haven't decided on any yet.

Also love the ukc strava club it's great to see what other people are out and about doing and good to see what areas are good to run in

A mixed bag:

My highest mileage year ever with only very short periods of reduced running due to mild injuries/niggles whereas in the past there has usually been a bigger issue at some stage. I have enjoyed my training - which is a good job as I have been prevented in doing several big races by work or more recently the flu after which I was kiboshed!

I have the confidence of thinking 2020 is going to be good based on all this successful training, but I am still really sad when I look at the LIAD facebook page, after putting so much effort into training and recces only to be ill the week before. 

Did manage to come 24th in a local nighttime hill trail race last week and I will finish the year (racing wise) on that high. 

Good thread.

In reply to TheDrunkenBakers: 

Averaging 8:08 a mile isn't too shabby!

Been a funny old year really. My old lurcher, who was my running buddy, died in January which flattened me a bit (a lot). February I fell off a curb when out with the running club and tore my rotator cuff trying to break my fall.

I've been easing back into it and trying to stay injury free, (I have all sorts of achilles, glute and brittle knee problems). Getting a new rescue hound and the end of March has improved motivation, as he's got a few issues but running with me really seems to be bringing him on.

568 miles run this year. Done a couple for fell runs (Blencathra and Fellside) plus the Lowther trail race (13 miles 1600ft) which has given me a bit of confidence in entering Fell stuff, so will aim to do more next year.

Will be concentrating on running with the dog and getting his mileage up, (it’s headtorch running for the next few months, which he really enjoys), and aiming to do some longer, slow, runs over the fells with him.

Also looking at doing more gym work to try and strengthen the non-running muscles to stave off injury.

Absolutely, as Lizzie said, the kudos is a real boost on the bad days.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

I set myself the #run1000miles challenge for 2019 having never done more than 1000km in a year before. It was looking unlikely in the summer when I badly sprained my ankle and it took me a couple of months to fully recover but I'm chuffed to now be at 930miles and looking like I'll comfortably finish the challenge in early December. The big question now is, what next?....

Stephen

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Regarding the Strava Group - the metres of ascent is amazing - makes my little hills look like pimples!

And for those that would like to join ->  https://www.strava.com/clubs/UKCStrava

In reply to Ridge:

I appreciate the comment and sorry to hear about the pooch. 

I look at pretty much every UKC run and feel really inspired by the variety and interest on the runs.  Sometimes you just cant be arsed but a quick look on the group, where someone has run 10 miles in shocking conditions or up a bloody steep rock, and it has kicked me in to action when I really didnt want to.

In reply to Climbthatpitch:

The ballsiest first race I ever did hear! 

In reply to BusyLizzie:

 Question is when  will the 2020 goal thread be up?

In reply to bouldery bits:

I didn't really have much of a choice. I was going through some stuff in my home life and a friend guilt tripped me into it. 

Still haven't worked out if they were trying to help or just taking the mick 😂

In reply to Shaunhaynes99:

Opps I read it wrong and put my 2020 goal on here 

In reply to Shaunhaynes99:

Good idea, although my plans are still in flux as race entries aren't all out yet. There was also the idea mooted of having a weekly thread in the style of UKC Fit Club as these long-running threads can get a bit unwieldy. I guess the idea is to talk about weekly goals and levels of success the previous week but primarily to offer support, encouragement and motivation. 

What's the etiquette for that? Who starts the thread etc? Seems to be a rotating basis every Sunday night from a quick look just now. Would that be useful to people? If you use UKC Fit Club, what works/what doesn't work? If so, I'm happy to kick something off and see how it goes?

In reply to Climbthatpitch:

While we're talking about 2020, for those that are interested the entries for the 90km du Mont Blanc lottery close tonight at midnight.

https://mbm.reg.livetrail.net/etape1.php?evt=10&course=103

I DNF'd this a few years back so might give it another go (if I get in). For a 'short' ultra its a toughie but the setting and support is amazing. 

In reply to BusyLizzie:

My goal this year was to try my first Ultra. I was signed up for one in June. However, the ski season was very good, as a result I didn't get as much running in as I was hoping, and then ended up with bad achilles problems, so I bailed the night before. Running has always been about trying to fit as much in as I can between injuries, but this summer I decided to take strength and physio more seriously. I'm following a plan from my physio, which involves 20 minutes of heel lifts and drops per day (with 30kg backpack), and about 4hrs of strength training at the gym per week (various leg and core exercises). I also cancelled all major goals as I didn't want to feel any pressure to force anything.
I have bunions on the outside of both little toes with can be painful, the surgeon confirmed he could operate if I wanted, but I've decided to try another year and see how it goes. I run with Altra shoes which have more space in the front and work for me.
Both achilles don't bother me so much anymore, but I have some discomfort on the inside of my right leg. So, the next thing I'm trying is some footbeds, as I have a high arch, and my ankles do weird stuff when I run.

Ski season is starting now, so a bit less running although I am slowly increasing my weekly distance (around 70-80km now which I hope to maintain through the ski season), but I look forward to running without worrying about my injuries soon, so I can start a training program.

I did set one goal this year, which was to run up Geitfjellet once per week (on average). Geitfjellet is a hill next to Trondheim with a panoramic view of the fjords and across the city. It's about 450m high, and is about 5.5km from my office (sea level) and has a selection of trails up it, from pleasant to very technical. So far I've been 49 times, so it looks like I'll make it.

I also completed a spontaneous goal, to run 7 half marathons in a week, all incorporating Geitfjellet. It felt ok at the time, but probably contributed to the injury problems I had during the summer.

The UKC strava club is great, it works really well for me to stay motivated "seeing" everyone out and about. Thanks also for all the kudos I've received this year!
 

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Good stuff Lizzie.

It's always good to see people out and about on the UKC Strava group. My year has been stable from a running point of view with last year's improvement more or less maintained but not improved upon. I've got a half marathon next Sunday at the Strathclyde country park, anyone else taking part? I hope to get under 1 hour 40 minutes. 

In reply to yorkshireman:

Well as were on the 2020:

5km sub 22 min

10km sub 48 min

 Get comfortable  running regular half marathons as in once a week at least. 

I've also entered a few races, i just fancy some silveware in a  frame. When/If i can get up  to a comfortable half marathon  maybe an end of marathon and 50km ultra  is on the cards. I doubt i would go futher than that as a distance. 

In reply to bouldery bits:

If you want any crew for the BGR let me know  - leg 1 is my usual

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Not been a good year at all, a few periods of illness, quite a bit of work related stuff getting in the way and some periods when I was suffering from a bad case of CBA. Not helped by my wife being injured and having her activity seriously curtailed.

Hopefully, I can get enough done before the end of the year to have lost the bit of weight that I have gained and feeling comfortable with decent mileage. Get my mileage up to a 50 mile per week average and work on my 5 and 10k, first target will be a sub 18 5k.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Pick the right race and you will be fine.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

My main goal for 2019 was to score a point in either the British or English vets fell running champs. I managed to get 6 points in one English champs race (finished the season 79th overall having missed 3 races - 2 when I was on form!). I also had a good runs in Great Lakes and Borrowdale (21st overall, 3 vet) and then couldn't run for over 2 months due to injury - still not sure it's fixed... but it was that injury that got me climbing through the end of summer!

Other highlights include a 5k pb (19:05) achieved 2 hours after doing a BGR leg 1 in just over 3 hours.

I was aiming for 3000km for the year, and was ahead of schedule in August, now 450km behind.

Goals for next year are to do better in the fell champs, get my 5k under 19 mins, 10k under 40 (pb is 40:05).

Joined the strava group about a week ago

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Over all a disappointing year for me. After suffering with plantar fasciitis through the summer of 2018 and rehabbing through winter last year, this year started off positively. Slowly built my mileage up and managed to run the Milton Keynes marathon at the start of May. Wasn't an impressive time but happy to have made it round. Made the double mistake then of thinking my struggles were behind me and stopped doing my stretching as well as then trying to do to many miles and injury started to flare up again. Work then got in the way over the summer so injury is nicely rested now. Started off running again last week with a couple of 3 milers and going to start building up the mileage nicely and slowly. Next scheduled event for me is the Newport Marathon in mid April so plenty of time. Trying to get back into the habit of stretching and strength exercises as well. Getting old sucks I miss being young and injury free. These days I have to do a half hour warm up just to think about doing physical exercise!

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Funny year for me too, mojo a bit low and not raced much - interest in running tailed off a bit as I've done more climbing (started running more when kids were young and climbing was a bit time consuming). First xc of the year yesterday, errk, wake up call. Highlights of the year: entering a new hill marathon in the Clwyds with bog all preparation. Not dying. Nav leg of the fell relays two weeks ago. Not getting lost.

In reply to yorkshireman:

I would like this very much. Could you? But how about a monthly thread rather than a weekly one?  Some of my weeks are a bit samey and a report on a month might be a bit more interesting. And it would give it a different flavour to the Fit Club, just for a change.

In reply to The New NickB:

Suggestions welcomed - perhaps where the hills are not too steep.

I did the Nine Edges race in 2018 and thatbwas ok - I was one of the last runners to finish butnhugely enjoyed it.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

I have 3 goals - run 2 ultras: I've found 2 good ones almost from my doorstep (in Bragg Creek, Alberta), a 44.5km "marathon" and a 60k ultra with 3000m of ascent.

Goal 3 is to do a beer mile!

Not sure how that will all work out with the other goal of doing as much ice climbing as I can this season and leading WI5.  So to get my running legs in I'm off XC skiing this afternoon.........

In reply to George Ormerod:

I’ve ran 3 road marathons (2:49, 2:51 and 2:56), 1 trail marathon, 2 trail 50ks, 2 x 20 mile road races and a 21 mile mountain race.

on top of that I’ve done a 75 mile FKT and a 48 mile FKTin the mountains.

ive had a solid year performance wise but mainly happy to be back healthy, robust and able to tolerate solid mileage in training (just over 3000 miles in 2019 if all goes well) and racing regularly.

Ive millinocket marathon in a month which is a quirky free marathon in northern Maine, but doubt I’ll quite reach 20 races for the year.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

I snuck in a sub 17:30 5k, 17:21 on a cold night, a few small hills. finished 3rd, but pretty spaced. On a good course, with the right field sub 17 is possible, but it's still a way off. 6s per mile is still a step, about a 2% improvement. But if I'm running sub 17 as a masters I'll be pretty competitive. One more month as an open runner..

In reply to Roadrunner6:

I’m looking for the elusive* 17.30 5k as well.  I ran 17.34 in April and felt like I left 20 seconds out on the course but haven’t been able to go faster since.  17.30 would only have given me 13th at this morning’s Cardiff parkrun.  The top 6 were all (well) under 17, and most of them are in my club and will be 40 before me, so I can’t really hold out for V40 positions.

* I say elusive.  I expect you’ve run sub 17.30 loads of times, but for me it would be a PB.

In reply to gazhbo:there are some good 5k programs online.  The 'magic' session is 6 x 1km, a second a lap faster than race pace , 1 min recovery  .  

In reply to gazhbo:

That's the beauty of running, you'll run sub 17:30.. then sub 17:15 is there.. then it's sub 17. The goal posts keep moving.

I've ran 16:15 (I think it was), then a few mid 16's, but this was 5-7 years ago when I was running better so I'm treating it all as new and seeing where I can get back to. 

I ran the 16:15 full of a cold, new years day, after a few beers in the cheers bar in Boston. I was jet lagged so woke up early, found a race and ran 16:15. I thought sub 16 was a formality and never got below 16:25 again. I ran sub 34 in a 10k around then so was in pretty good shape but never targeted the short stuff.

wbo2: I'll try that, generally I do LT work at the track so 3 x 2 miles, 5 x 1 miles, with 1 min rest per mile. I've started adding in a few faster sessions to get me turning over a bit. We've 13 inches of snow due tomorrow so our tracks could be gone until April..

In reply to Roadrunner6:ha ha - unfortunate.  I used to do a similar session on grass in Richmond park, but I'd done it enough times on the track I knew the effort level to be at.

  Those 3x2 mile, 5 x 1 mile sessions are great but I am very doubtful many do/can do them at a high enough speed,  especially weekly.  If you want to race at say, 76s, I'm doubtful you can do it reliably unless you're banging out a bunch of laps at 74.  Makes the pace easier.  I'd rather do 7.800 at the right pace.  Below 800 the length of rest becomes too short ,it just gets a bit silly. 

 This was done in spikes or flats by the way. Normally spikes

In reply to wbo2:

I don't wear spikes, I might try again. I tried and developed lower leg issues but at the time I was struggling with various issues from high mileage so I might try again. I no longer run 90+ miles a week, with 1 kid (2 more coming), and working full time teaching and coaching (plus being almost 40) I'm finding 60-70 miles a week is manageable. I really notice my recovery isn't what it was so 60-70 seems to work.

The longer reps are more in marathon training. I'll try the 7-800s.

In reply to wbo2:

I do pretty regular track sessions, including 6 x 1k, and 3 x 2k, off about a minute, but my 1k pace, even over 6 reps, is much more than 1s per lap faster than target 5k pace, more like 3.15 - 3.20.  I think I just need to run more flat 5ks.

I’m not specifically training 5k though so I’m not really frustrated as I’d prefer to bring my times over longer distances down, which I am doing.  I’m just surprised it’s not automatically translating to a quicker 5k.

In reply to gazhbo:

How is your pacing? You're not going off slightly too fast?

Just 5-10s too fast on a first mile in a 5k will hurt later. It doesn't seem too much but it's such an intense pace going inside it hurts.

In reply to gazhbo:  yes it sounds like you need to do more races.  Given how many park runs there are it's not a big deal to go to one and just go for it, see what happens and get used to hurting.  With those sessions it sounds like it should be pretty easy.

What longer distances.?  Looking back I wish I'd spent more time racing 5k

In reply to gazhbo:

3:15/km? That's quick. I struggle to inside 5:20 pace which is basically 80s per lap (for 1600m).

In reply to Roadrunner6:

My pacing is awful.  I did a flat 5 mile race trying to get under 29 and did the first mile in 5.35.   Blew up completely at about 3 and a half and just squeezed under 30.  Definitely something I need to work on.

My local park run is also quite hilly.  I’ve done 17.50 there (also paced terribly). The consensus is that the course is worth about 45 seconds compared to a flat course, but I haven’t been able to do that.  

In reply to Roadrunner6:

Yeah - 3.15/k.  That’s about 78/lap.  I seem to get back quite a bit on the recovery (which is not very strictly timed as the track sessions I go to have quite a big spread out group - I expect it’s actually quite a bit longer than a minute).  I’d also quite happily do 2k reps at about 6.45, but slow down loads after that.

In reply to gazhbo:3;15 is still quick reps for 17.00. What other training are you doing?

In reply to wbo2:

Tempo runs, long runs on weekend, some trail running, park run occasionally.  Not massively structured and I’d be surprised if I was hitting 30 miles/week consistently.  I generally do a track session weekly though.  I tend to find that I can hold my own with quicker (distance runners) on the track sessions, especially on shorter reps, but then there’s a fairly big gap at about 5k.

In reply to wbo2:

I also know that I need more mileage, but I’m trying to climb a bit more as well so it’s difficult to fit it in.

It’s idle musing really.  I’ve had a pretty good year with half, 10k and 5k pbs.  I’m doing a 10 mile race at the end of December and would love to go under 60 but I’m not sure I’m quite there.

In reply to gazhbo:

Work on your pacing. The odd blow up is good, shows ambition and teaches you what you can and can't do. Blow ups every race aren't good. Try running the first mile slightly slower as an experiment.

Saying that I'm a hypocrit and something I need to work on myself.. most do.

I had a very low key 10 miler though today (a free race with 15 food items donated to the food bank) and had no idea of the course other than it was pretty hilly, so ran the first mile at 6:20 pace. I was guessing I'd be ~62 at the end. I ran 61:14 but it was 0.15-0.2 short (with about 600-700 ft of ascent). But I felt so good and climbed the final hill at a similar pace to the winner. I was second. It's probably the best race I've had since getting back in terms of consistent pacing, because I'm struggling to accept I'm no longer at the front of many races and still try to open up races at paces I used to run, not can run... It's the first time I've started fairly conservatively.

In reply to gazhbo:

I know it's antisocial.. I'd not train like that.

When I've trained with mixed groups we used to do timed efforts like 3 minutes on. These guys were GB internationals or sub 2:25 marathoners, so we'd do 3 mins hard, 1 min easy and repeat. That was a km for them and ~900m for me. Those sorts of workouts. 

You going hard and having a longer rest than you need doesn't help you.

We used to do social hill reps, run up hard, rest, wait, jog back down chatting, hard back up.. nobody improved but the slower people so 2-4 of us broke away and did them kenyan style.

Many weren't happy, it wasn't very sociable, but we all improved massively. Awfully hard sessions, you'd taste blood that first hill on cold nights. Up hard, the front guy would turn around and we'd turn around when they did, we'd run down at a decent clip and back into it.. It went from a pretty useless session to a staple for all of us as we improved over the next few years.