UKH

Interested in finding 2 mountains to walk up, a days drive away, close together so we can put the tent up once and walk to them, 2000 to 3500 ish. Anyone have any suggestions? Complete beginner, have done Scaffel, Snowden and Ben Nevis, and looking for easy climbs to see how I am with altitude. Cheers!!

In reply to Eddie Fennell:

A day's drive away from where?

T.

In reply to Eddie Fennell:

A day's drive from where?  2000m to 3500m?  Are you using a guide or independent?  On the beaten track or off it?  What time of year?

Anyway, the Alps aren't just all about Mont Blanc, they have excellent transport links, civilisation and even culture!  And if you include the outlying smaller hills, peaks from 2000 feet right up to 3500m.  There's loads of walking in Austria, Slovenia, probably even places like Poland and Russia too. 

You just need to do your own homework before you book flights and check whether any peak will probably meet your criteria of "bang on", and not "way too hardcore" or " a boring trudge up a big grassy mound"

You're after a trekking peak, so I guess you don't want a rock peak, but how are you with snow?  Above some kind of threshold altitude in the Alps you'll get snow.

If you just want the altitude tick, you can find mountains that start from altitude, like in Bolivia, or if you want none of that as it's totally cheating then Kilimanjaro has one of the biggest "ascent from Base Camp"/ sea level altitude gains, and is scenic and a travel destination in its own right.  But take your time to a void a common side effect (death) and hire a guide if you need one.

In reply to Paz:

Plenty of good peaks in the Pyrenees at that height range, not too busy and usually with good local camping or wild camping options too, and with no crevasse dangers. Possibility of significant snow until mid summer, especially this year, which has been notably cold and snowy until very recently. Would be a long drive from anywhere in the UK,  just about doable in a day, but flying options into Toulouse, Carcassonne or Pau would be much quicker and easier.

In reply to Eddie Fennell:there's loads in Scotland  that meet your criteria.

 

In reply to Pursued by a bear:

Birmingham unfortunately. (joking)

In reply to Eddie Fennell:

Ta for replying. So 2000 - 3500ish. Feet or metres?

T.

In reply to Paz:Hi Paz, we want to drive from Birmingham, put up a tent, walk up a couple of mountains 2- 3500 metres and drive home, no guides or climbing gear. I have no idea if its possible. Thanks for all the info in your post. Were looking for easy walks and scrambles.

 

In reply to john arran:

Cheers John, would prefer the driving option, will take your advise on board tho.

In reply to Billhook:

I should have written metres Billhook. Cheers buddy.

In reply to Eddie Fennell:

Probably the closest you can drive to to get hills/mountains in that sort of height range would be the Jura or Haute Savoie where there is loads of choice. But you are talking about a long drive from the UK. It will take you the best part of a day each way, with a day in the middle to do the walking - minimum of 3 days

So far as the effect of altitude is concerned, you are unlikely to notice much difference from walking in the British mountains on hills of 3000m or less.

In reply to Pursued by a bear:

Metres, we just did Scaffel Snowden and ben Nevis, so just want to continue with the altitude. I'm aware that at some point we will have to start paying for equipment training guides etc, but were just looking for easy climbs and easy bills just now.

In reply to Trangia:

Sounds on the money will google those areas. Cheers Tangia.

In reply to Trangia:

That's all sound advice. And given the travel time, I'd be for going for a week.

T.

In reply to Trangia:

I did not know that, I thought altitude was something that affected different ppl at different stages. So if we had the right gear experience and guides we could go for any altitude mountain without doing increasingly higher ones? 

In reply to Eddie Fennell:

It is possible to have altitude problems below 2500m, but in practice it is rare enough that it's not worth worrying about.  Many people can feel a difference between 2500 and 3000m but it's not enough to be a problem.  3-4000m is where most people start thinking about making an effort to spend nights high etc.

You would have to be really unlucky to have trouble on a 2500m peak but it does happen.

In reply to Eddie Fennell:

unfortunatly, acclimatisation is lost very quickly. So you can spend a year above 5000 m in La Rinconada, and after a few weeks at sea level, most of the adaptation and acclimatization is gone... 

Nevertheless to do e.g. Mont blanc, besides fitness, experience and a guide, you would need some time for adaptation and acclimatization, not just over one week, but ideally two and work your way up (sleep low, train high) higher and higher mountains. (or do some hypoxic training beforehand)) 

btw, adverse effects from altitude are rather rare in reasonably fit individuals below 2500 m anyway.  

In reply to Eddie Fennell:

I shall get a lot of stick for this, but I can't resist. The mountain you refer to is not Scaffel, it's Scafell. Also you can sound like a knowledgeable person if you pronounce it as if it were spelt Scawfell (which it isn't). Incidentally, you probably didn't climb Scafell, but climbed Scafell Pike which is a separate mountain and is the highest point in England. Good luck with your adventures, and if you go off to the Alps you'll need much more experience before you can climb big snowy peaks safely on your own.

In reply to d_b:

Well I'm living and learning as they say. Cheers Trangia.

In reply to iknowfear:

Ok cheers, great information.

In reply to Rog Wilko:

Cheers Rog, what do you class as a big peak? I'm sure there are peaks I can climb safely that are bigger than Ben Nevis.

In reply to Eddie Fennell:

Have you considered expanding your experience in other ways than altitude? You have climbed the biggest hills in England, Scotland and Wales and seem to think that the next logical step is bigger mountains.

You can walk multiple hills in one day, do routes which require scrambling or navigation, or learn to walk safely in winter.

 

Some other suggestions.

Scrambling, try Striding edge from Glenridding in the lake District on day 2 you could walk up Fairfield and St Sunday crag.

Multiple hills- try the Yorkshire 3 peaks, a logical next step from the national 3 peaks.

Navigation - learn how to orientate a map and take a compass bearing and enter a 2 day mountain Marathon, which requires camping and you can choose a route to suit your fitness.

 

I'm not criticising your ambition for altitude, just pointing out that bigger isn't always better!

In reply to Eddie Fennell:

As ablackett has said, size isn't everything. You've clearly enjoyed your experiences in the mountains, but has your pleasure derived solely from how high you've reached? Many of us who haunt this website have spent the best part (and the best parts) of a lifetime walking, climbing, scrambling or even running in the mountains and the altitude has been of no consequence in itself. Like many others I did feel the need to climb Mt Blanc, but the satisfaction was found not in just reaching the summit but doing it unguided and via one of the classic routes rather than being part of a crocodile via the normal route. Ben Nevis is quite a boring walk, may   I  venture to say, via the so-called Tourist Route, whereas the the longer less frequented route via the Carn Dearrg arete is highly memorable. There are over 250 summits in Scotland exceeding 3,000 ft (called Munroes) many of which give you a much better day out than The Ben. Oh, and incidentally, Scafell is a much more interesting (and quieter) mountain then its slightly higher neighbour Scafell Pike!

If you're lucky you could find that mountains will transform you life. Or you might decide you've ticked off a list and move off to tick something else. The choice is yours.

In reply to Eddie Fennell:

a few have already said this,  but from Brum you can be in Snowdonia in a couple of hours,  and start to tick off some of the mountains there,  combining a number of them into long challenging days.  Once you get confident around those you can look further afield to Scotland and then the Alps.

Alps is a long way for someone with limited experience and can be frustrating with limited weather windows,  as well as the extra height and snow.

In reply to Eddie Fennell:

All fantastic advice,certainly given me something to think about. I semi retired last year and on a whim decided to do the Birmingham marathon, which I duly completed last October after training hard for 8 months. How mountains become the next challenge was my Daughters announcement she was going to start climbing mountains seriously after Machu Picchu and Chachani on her gap year, we watched Everest together so inspiring! and I thought if Emmers can do it with her experience level then why not give it a go? Next thing is to join a club I guess.

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In reply to Eddie Fennell:

My own experience is that you will feel some effect from altitude if straight on the hill from the UK as low as 2000m, though it's not likely to make you feel ill at that altitude, perhaps just that going uphill seems a little more strenuous.    You can help this by walking up hills in the UK carrying a bit more weight than you would in the Alps - I've found this very effective, particularly carrying up several litres of water as you can get rid of this on the top and be light for the walk down.  Carrying a toddler in the hills all summer before going on holiday allowed me to outpace people in the Oetztal even though we were  "straight off the plane" up to the Breslauer hut  because I'd developed greater lung capacity and strength in advance. 

In reply to john arran:

lourdes is another option, and quite cheap quite often. also biaritz, but a bit more of a drive...

In reply to wercat:

I am not sure that fitness has much impact on acclimatisation. I have found altitude to be more of a great leveller of people with different levels of fitness. I notice a definite bunching effect where the super-fit people who start out the fastest get slower the higher they go until  getting caught up somewhere near the top.

In reply to mysterion:

General fitness no, but I've found great benefit in increasing weight carried up hill, say Skiddaw by a steep way, till it's about 20-25%   of my body weight.   By the time you get up high in the Alps the air can have 25% less oxygen and if you are carrying far less weight than you trained with there is a definite advantage as you have increased your basic capacity.   I'm not talking about speed fitness as I don't believe that helps in the least but in my experience the weight training uphill carries great benefits. 

In reply to mysterion:

could be it's more of an advantage when older of course

In reply to Eddie Fennell:

I'd just say that it's highly unpredictable.  The one time I've suffered badly from altitude in the Alps was going up over 3200m straight after my Uni final exams, when I was seriously unfit.  On the other hand (and maybe relevant for the OP and his ambition to rush out and do a couple of Alps) my Australian nephew, 16 and generally fit but with no hill experience until a couple of days immediately beforehand when he walked up to c.2000m, was very badly afflicted above about 2800m on the Buet.  Happily he recovered within 5 minutes of starting down.

In reply to Eddie Fennell:

The advice of the Jura or Pyrenees is sound, higher hills but without the risks that come with snow, ice and altitude over 3000m-ish. Another area with higher-but-not-high hills is the Massif Central in France. For any of these, you need a full holiday to make the journey worthwhile if your going to drive.

However, to make the most of these trips, I'd explore the British hills more first, before you actually leave for your planned trip. You might jokingly dismiss Birmingham as a good location of hitting mountains but actually, you can be in Snowdonia very quickly. There you can not only enjoy walking up some truly beautiful hills, but also start scrambling as they contain some of the best easy scrambling in Britain. Look at doing Snowdon by Crib Goch, Tryfan and the Bristly Ridge, or various other classic Welsh scrambles. This might also help you enjoy your first trip abroad to the maximum of your ability and confidence. The Welsh "hills" may not be as high, but it would be hard to argue that the rocky peak of Tryfan is anything but a proper mountain.

Don't right off the Peak District either. It might not have mountains or altitude, but its beautiful, and you can have great fun scrambling up the "brooks" on Kinder or Bleaklow, or playing about on the easier rocks of the Eastern edges.

Both of these UK destinations are how many of us got into climbing and mountaineering in the first place, they're great for learning many of the basic skills, and also for getting the hill-specific fitness that will make your bigger hills less of a drag!

Of course, in Britain, Scotland is home to so many fantastic hills and "mountains", you don't need to travel to enjoy tougher hill challenges than the 3 highest peaks, unless the altitude is the main driver. Have a look at pictures of the Cuillin Ridge for example!

Wherever you go, go with open eyes, a sense of adventure, but a sensible approach to taking it one step at a time and learning with experience. Learn to enjoy the planning through map reading in particular, as well as reading up on stuff online. To me much of the joy comes from working it out for yourself on a map.

Enjoy your journey!