UKH

Hi all, 

I’m looking for advice/opinions on a goal I’m going for. I intend on climbing Mont Blanc, solo and unguided. As I’m only 16, I’ll be 17 when (if) I actually do it, it’s a pretty damn big challenge. I know Mont Blanc is no hike, even for experienced climbers. I am fully aware of all the dangers (Grand Couloir,  crevasses, weather etc). I will be going up the “classic” route: Goûter Route. 

I just wondering what you all think of this? Is this a crazy, stupid idea that I shouldn't do? Or an amazing goal to aim for? I’m trying to find the youngest person to solo Mont Blanc, as it might be a record breaker...maybe, maybe not.

Also, any advice on actually climbing Mont Blanc, either solo or not, would be greatly appreciated. 

W 

As with most things soloing, if you have to ask online whether it's crazy or stupid then it's definitely a bad idea and you shouldn't do it. 

Age is probably not so relevant here. You will definitely not be the youngest person to do it by some way.

Whether it is a good idea or not will depend on your background and your experience. Some people will find it a simple walk; Others will be dangerously over their heads and risk death by their inexperience. Maybe if you have to ask you are probably not prepared to do this relatively serious climb solo?

With a mountain guide and some basic preparation you might have a great challenge and a really fun achievement though if you choose not to do it solo.

Sorry to be negative but it seems that your sole motivation is an ego trip.  When you write that "I am fully aware of all the dangers (Grand Couloir,  crevasses, weather etc)" do yo really mean that or have you just heard or read of the dangers without fully understanding them?

That's harsh. Maybe youthful romanticism? 

Terrible troll attempt

More importantly, what do mum and dad think about it?

A tad bit harsh, I’d say. I’ve spoken to people, who I’ve climbed with before, who have lost close friends on the Grand Couloir and Mont Blanc itself. I do know the severity of this situation. Climbing is my passion, and I certainly do not do it for my “ego” 

??

I’ve climbed two 4000m peaks before and I climb winter Scottish grade IV+. I’m not saying I’m fully prepared for this, yet. And obviously I’ll do more training before hand. Just thought it would be a good challenge, and a brilliant experience. 

When I say “crazy”, I meant is it worth climbing solo, or would it be easier, and more enjoyable, with a partner/group? 

Solo or not you'll be surrounded (well, in a linear fashion) by hundreds of other people on any reasonable summer day. If self-sufficient solo tranquillity is what you're looking for, you won't find it there!

My opinion? If it's your first time playing in the Alps, it's a bad place to start. Find an experienced partner, become familiar with the alpine environment and all of the novel ways of dying that it brings. Reading and hearing accounts of the objective dangers is one thing, staring into a yawning crevasse from a snow bridge you didn't realise you were stood on is entirely another! Until you're confident and capable in the environment I wouldn't entertain thoughts of soloing big mountains, no matter how 'easy' the route may be.

Probably more fun with someone else. Reduced issues with falling down crevasses too. As long as you both know how to rescue each other.

At age of 16-18 (2010-2012ish), I have hitchhiked a lot. Living in an Eastern Europe with limited resources and a dream to move to UK for studies, I couldn’t waste a ton of money I earned as side jobs after school. 

My family never approved it, but never denied me doing so. I had 3000+ miles trip across many countries with a vague plan. On a solo trip to Czech Republic (from Lithuania, so over 2k miles round trip), my sister took me to the highway so I can have a head start that morning. She handed me in ~€30 saying that she knew I had pretty much no money. Surely, I had a whole week of walking hills in Czech Republic, and came back home a fortnight later - around €70 were spent in total. I still remember to this day receiving that money - I knew she didn’t like what I was doing, but she showed the support I won’t forget.

I am fully aware my mom was worried, but I’m so grateful for her to let me do this, even if she didn’t like it or approve it. That’s how I had so much love for mountains (Lithuania is damn flat) and it prepared me for life a lot. Moving to Scotland at age of 19 on my own was stressful, but it was certainly easier compared to some of my peers. 

My point is not being that one should not care about what parents think, but look at what experience one can gain from something that’s out of the comfort zone. Of course, everything requires experience and you can’t just solo K2 in slippers. 

Thank you. A lot of people are not too supportive of my decisions, when it comes to mountaineering. My parents find it very scary, but they’ll support me, no matter what, even if they’d rather I worked in a supermarket! From the risks I’ve taken already (obviously I haven’t soloed K2 or anything like that) everything has paid off and I don’t regret any of it. 

I climbed mont blanc at 17, but with a guide and my climbing partner. Our guide had just got back from new routing on Everest and so was outrageously fit. We were up and down in 20 hours.

At that time I had a several years of trad climbing experience (up to E5) and several weeks experience in the Alps. We did the Cosmiques in winter without a guide (during a ski trip). But I would not have tried to solo mont blanc. Too much objective danger, too long, too easy to get lost in low vis should things go wrong. On the other hand... on a perfect day it basically a walk in the park. All depends if you can accept the risk of the shit hitting the fan and having to rely on yourself entirely.

Do it guided/with someone who knows what's up before you think about the solo. Speed will be your friend. Dont spend days up there.

http://www.loveadventures.co.uk/climbing-mont-blanc-solo-and-unguided/

Is it really soloing if you're in a trench of footsteps with people all around ?- not denigrating it as Ive supposedly 'soloed' Mt Blanc twice in that fashion, just asking for the purist definition of soloing.

I think people aren’t supportive because you haven’t provided evidence you’re experienced mountaineer? 

That’s how I had to convinc my family that I’m not going to get eaten by wolfs or bears if I camp in the woods! 

Theres something odd about that article....

I think your age is largely irrelevant - there are 17 year olds, and there are 17 year olds.....it depends which one you are! As others have said, your experience is the real point here.

Climbing Mont Blanc "solo and unguided" feels like adding danger with out adding much satisfaction: a bit like saying you're going to cycle the End to End.....without wearing a bike helmet. I appreciate the satisfaction of going alone but on Mont Blanc there'll be lots of people around you, and the types of danger (falling rocks, crevasses, etc) are not ones that you'll take much pleasure in evading.

If I was you, I'd do Mont Blanc with a friend or a guide. Then find a more satisfying objective to solo; one that contains dangers (navigation, endurance, etc) which are more satisfying to evade.

Hi Willow and good luck with your plan to ascend Mont Blanc via the Gouter route. As most folks have said it is more fun and safer to go with a mate as even though the Gouter is technically a very straightforward route in good conditions it should not be underestimated due to the high altitude, snow conditions and the spectacular but very exposed Bosses Ridge which leads to the summit!

Regarding advice most folks normally take the Belvedere cable car from Les Houches and then hop on the MB tramway train to the Eagles Nest before a short 2 hour walk to the excellent Tete Rousse Hut with it's amazing views to Aiguille Bionnassay . From the Tete Rousse it is about 2 to 3 hours in the dark to cross the Grand Couloir and the loose scramble with some fixed cables up to the Gouter Hut. My partner and I are average Joe's and we stayed overnight and left the Tete Rousse at around 2am and were on the summit by about 8.30am, and then back down at the Tete Rousse for just after 12 noon before a leisurely stroll back down to the Eagles Nest to catch a train back down. Incidentally everyone we spoke to said the Tete Rousse is a far nicer hut than the Gouter to stay in due to the lack of grumpy, head achey + vomiting folks...

As a shameless plug you can see a short vid showing all the main landmarks + features here: 

  youtube.com/watch?v=fRBF_y3URI0&

Bon chance and hope this helps!

Dave

I’ve read it. What do you find odd about it? (Aside from the fact he had no prior experience) 

That entirely depends on when you do it.

One October I went up Mont Blanc via the Gouter, and then down via Mont Maudit to the Midi teleferique, and only saw one other person (he was climbing up to Mont Maudit) on the entire trip.

I hate crowds.

Why so much emphasis on going solo? 

I can see the attraction of Mont Blanc although there are 1000's of peaks in the Alps most of which will be a lot more fun than following the procession up the Gouter route.  I don't see any problem with your age there will be many teenagers out climbing and as others have pointed out you'll be far from the youngest.  The Alpine environment isn't really a good place to be on your own, I know people do the Gouter route solo and usually get away with it. But, if something goes wrong relying on strangers being around and willing and/or able to help is quite a gamble. When I did Mont Blanc we were descending the Bosses ridge when we came across an unconscious person lying on the snow. There were at least 50 people just standing around watching her die. 

Why not just go and have a season in the Alps, forget about having any goals and let the weather/snow conditions dictate which routes you do. At the end of it you'll have a much better idea of what's what and what's needed, and maybe even made some like minded friends for your next trip.      

Sorry if that comes over as patronizing but it does real worry me when people are in such a rush to go wandering around on glaciated mountain on there own. 

Lots of quiet less busy alpine peaks to go at. Why not have fun on those and get a proper solo experience?

If you're seeking plaudits or some form of recognition by soloing the easy route up Mont Blanc at 17, then forget it, because there'll be nothing remotely special about it.

If on the other hand, you want to do it to experience the freedom, excilleration and emotional personal satisfaction that soloing an alpine route gives, then fine.

However, get some alpine climbing experience under your belt first, because there are many skills you need when soloing - even on something as technically easy and popular as the Gouter.

Soloing any alpine route is a serious undertaking, as irrespective of your ability and fitness, or the relatively benign level of difficulty, there are always objective risks and dangers, even on easy ground, which have a nasty habit of catching folk out - especially the inexperienced.

Perhaps there's a reason for this... Taking unnecessary risks for a quick ego boost is neither big nor clever.

Like I said in previous posts, I climb for enjoyment, not for my ego. Please don’t jump straight to conclusions that all I care about is the size of my ego. Thank you. 

Thank you very, very much for your reply. It has helped me a lot. It’s greatly appreciated!

You're willing to take risks to get to the top of a lump of rock, I presume? (Or you wouldn't be a climber)

But the reasons you do so are more valid and noble than other people's?

Absolutely not, my reasons are as stupid as the next persons! But I would hope I generally manage risk to reasonable levels (for me) - Partially informed by several of my Father's friends killed while climbing and myself being involved in a serious climbing accident, which has dispelled most of the romance in dying in the mountains.

Climbing's fun, but I really don't want to die doing it, so I don't take what I would deem necessary risks, like soloing on snow covered glacial terrain. As romantic as it may seem, in my opinion, dying at the bottom a a crevasse alone doesn't seem a particularly fun way to go. By all means if you have the experience, and you are able to make an informed judgment call, go and solo alpine routes - but the OP is 16 and posting about this on UKC looking for encouragement, implying that this is not the case.

Of course everyone is free to do what they want, but I really don't want to encourage a comparatively inexperienced 16 year old to solo a glaciated route, if the worst happens it would be an incredibly tragic accident.  

What an amazing goal to aim for. Remember to enjoy the journey as well as, hopefully, a successful ascent and descent.

    You seem to have done some research which is good. I presume you will be doing some training too. Your training will help you decide if the goal is a realistic one for you or not. I suggest some of the following:

Very long mountain days walking and scrambling, including scrambling down. Ideally, work towards  matching some of the times you will need on Mont Blanc, starting very early in the morning and keeping going for around 12 hours with the same kind of load in your rucksack. Obviously the Lakes, North Wales, Scotland are perfect for this.

Ensure you do lots of walking and scrambling in crampons so you are totally confident using them on a wide variety of terrain for many hours. If you go solo you need to be 100% confident in your cramponing and scrambling skills - it is amazing how many people, especially when tired, trip over their crampons or catch a point. We've got great conditions for this at the moment!

    Once in Chamonix ensure you use the services of the OHM for up to date information on the route, conditions, weather as it is extremely variable. I presume that you will be doing some acclimatisation peaks with a climbing buddy beforehand? This will be a good opportunity to learn to judge snow conditions, see if your skills are up to scratch, learn the signs of crevasses and have great fun getting ready for your big goal. You will also ensure you have the right clothing, equipment, skills and it will be a great time to confirm to yourself that you are ready for your challenge.

    I'm sure not everyone would agree but I would consider wearing a lightweight harness with some self rescue equipment just in case. You may choose to join another roped party on the descent, a strong wind and icy conditions can make the descent of the narrow ridge below the summit quite precarious sometimes. The scramble down from the Gouter hut can be very snowy or icy - (or as dry as a bone). Should you find yourself in a crevasse ( assuming someone has spotted you and knows what to do ) they can drop you a rope and you can use your skills and equipment to get yourself out.

    Sometimes the weather is very sunny, the route a trench and easy to follow with a long line of ants. In cloud the route can be obscured very quickly and navigation can be tricky. As well as thorough route knowledge and visualisation and ensuring the best weather window you could take a very basic GPS unit with a bread crumb trail. Should navigation become hard you can always follow your bread crumb trail back to your hut.

   Some people summit on their first ascent, some take many attempts before all the ingredients required for a successful attempt come together. I hope you enjoy the learning, the journey and the challenge and look forward to hearing how you get on. Who knows, we might meet on the summit?

All this advice is amazing, thank you very much. I have had previous experience in the alps and I have climbed some 4000m peaks there e.g Weissmies. But I totally agree on everything you said. Thank you very much, it’s one of the only sound pieces of advice I’ve been given

Im assuming that Mark Haward (my Dad) is referring to me when he mentions frequent crampon trips in the Alps :/. Ive also been getting into mountaineering at a young age (18) and the biggest things I have learnt from him is that you know yourself better than anyone else, including all the folks on UKC, so only you can make the best judgement as to what your goal is and whether you are ready. 

Secondly that the best scenario in mountaineering is to be back in Chamonix eating a monstrous burger ( check out Poco Loco on this front) after a wicked day out, fit and ready to keep on shredding for many years to come. After all we have a lifetime of peaks ahead of us, so GET STUCK IN!

I'm not saying don't wear a harness, but I think that if you allow the probable presence of other people to affect your decision to "solo" or your planning for a "solo" ascent, then you should be seriously asking yourself whether you should be considering it at all.  If you are going to solo, then your thinking should be on the (possibly hypothetical) basis that you really will be completely on your own without the possibility of calling on and inconveniencing (and possibly endangering) anybody else; if the thought of being entirely alone on the route does not appeal, then don't do it.

Or is that one of the only pieces of advice you wanted to hear?

Perhaps, but the OP asks the folks on UKC, 'I just wondering what you all think of this? Is this a crazy, stupid idea that I shouldn't do? Or an amazing goal to aim for?' On which note, Robert's question, 'Or is that one of the only pieces of advice you wanted to hear?', is pertinent.

Even if unintended, that’s certainly the impression being given 

Indeed, and of course I'd agree with all that. I just felt compelled to defend the lady who posted originally as the same accusation could be levelled at anyone climbing, (whether it would be fair or not is another matter).

If she was my daughter I don't think I'd be encouraging this idea though.

... Glad you came out of your scrapes  

Fair enough, in hindsight, I didn't exactly write my original post in the most constructive or diplomatic manner. Good point. 

Thanks, me too! 

Interesting use of English syntax & grammar for someone saying they are so young.  For example, in your second post you said, "A tad bit harsh, I’d say", a phrase that rarely, if ever, comes out of 16 year olds - or indeed teenagers and the young in anycase.

There are a few others instances as well, which I won't embarrass myself, or you with, if your are indeed only 16.

And if you are 16?  Good Luck to you.  Just get fit!

Go for it, probably better to find a partner, try posting for one on here. I would do it, but wouldn't be able to keep up with a 17 year old.

Go for it!

I wish I'd had that attitude at 16. If I could have all the days / weekends / trips back that I didn't go on because a partner let me down I'd be twice as good a climber and have done twice as much climbing.

W

Its a perfectly realistic solo goal. Last year the crevasse danger seemed very very minimal.

I felt the biggest danger on the peak was the sheer volume of utter muppets about, you’d be far better off alone than roped up to half the people on the mountain.

As solo alpine routes go (and I’ve done a few) it’s a pretty workable goal. Clearly safer with a competent and experienced partner but might be really nice to do it alone.

The wiser idea would be to find somebody who has more experience than you and do it with them. Alternatively find somebody else and then both ensure you stalk a guided party out of the hut and do not let them out of your sight. The more sensible plan is to join a guided party judging by your post. 

I speak from experience having tried Mont Blanc about 15 years ago and being forced back from an hour from the summit in a storm. Visibility turned to nothing and it became very serious very quickly. Fortunately I was with someone who knew a bit more than me and we managed to get out alive. 

I climbed Mont Blanc when I was 17 with a guide. Don't get me wrong, it was an amazing experience, but looking back on it, I wish I had built up the experience to go up MB with some friends without a guide.

My advice would be to build experience and then try it with some friends - perhaps booking onto an alpine intro course - learn the basics then go practice.

Good luck!