UKH

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-highlands-islands-42760394

I am going to anger some of you guys. And, I am slightly tongue in cheek but at the same time I have a good point to make that needs to be considered by users and managers of Scottish ski resorts:

You need to stop using the excuse that resorts are run by volunteers/last minute staff AND charge £30 ish quid a day for a pass if the service is rubbish almost ALL the time!!!!!

I can see that things are not great when the cover is thin. BTW, what a PR nonsense to have snow machines in one place at the bottom!!!!. Noone anywhere is able to spread snow widely on barely frozen ground from one spot at the bottom!

But, if things are also shit even when conditions are good then you need to rethink the way it is all managed. I am not sure how? I have systematically been disappointed, sometimes appalled by how things are run here. I do appreciate that staffing something so ephemeral is a huge challenge.

Could they try to take what there is to take and be brave enough to say to customers that it is full by admitting a maximum number possible? I see that it would be really difficult to implement.

More generally, is it possible that running a ski resort for profit in the UK is not possible?

I am forever perpelexed when climbing in the northern coires/ loch a'an bassin, to see how many people are willing to come for a a service that, simply put, is neither fit for purpose or value for money! Or is it part of the experience in this country to be able to moan about your rubbish snow/piste to make it complete?!

Not that I mind that much... I just don't use them. I also want to add that I rate very highly the touring possibilities which when good are as good as anywhere.

Oh, I remember it well. "Powder on a hard base. All runs complete. Access roads closed."

or "runs open but incomplete" seen many years ago at Cairngorm.

I've had the occasional good day/half day piste skiing in Scotland but mostly midweek & at the time I lived within an hours drive, or less & could often take time off work at short notice. But they compare badly to the alpine resorts, maybe the best comparison would be to some of the ski areas in the Vosges or Massif Central ? 

But the management of Cairngorm has been terrible for at least 30 years (go look at web sites such as parkwatchscotland or winterhighland)

Have you seen the amazing (drone, I guess) photo of the tail back across rannoch moor yesterday? Incredible. Everything white but the road, cloudless blue skies, and a line of traffic heading back to the Bridge of Orchy. Reports on Facebook of "spent 8 hours in car stuck in traffic. Only got out to pee." 

Can't think of a better argument for skimo/Tele gear!

Where was it posted ? I remember a cloudless blue sky & very white Rannochmuir when we did the upper couloir on Stob Ghabhar (early 80s ?, a long way for a short climb) & always regretted I never had a camera with me as I've never seen the muir like that again

I think I saw it posted on the British Backcountry group on Facebook.

Does this work: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10156073743748599&set=ms.c.eJwz... ?

Thanks, looks almost arctic -  took a moment or two before I realised the black line was the road/car park.

The best ski days I've had in Scotland have definitely been in Glencoe. Short and steep. Friendly atmosphere - on one occasion got befriended (taken pity on) one day by an old member of the Creag Dhu - it had been impossible to put our tent up at the top of Glen Etive the previous night as the ground was iron hard and we were effectively homeless (sleeping sitting upright in an MGB wasn't great). He invited us to their club hut(?) in Bridge of Orchy where he and his mates regaled us until the early hours with tales of the derring do of the Creag Dhu in their golden years... and put us up for the night and refused all offers of payment.

The only downside of the skiing there that I recall was the five mile walk through bogs, wearing wellies, from the top of the car park lift to the bottom of the upper lifts...

There are currently many many discussions going on both online and in bars around the Highlands about how ski resorts are run. There are a lot of unhappy people out there so many are already angry and you are only making small extra waves Erick! 

I am one of the lucky ones located where I can get up early, check the forecasts and decide between resorts for today. If the roads are blocked at Drumochter or Tyndrum then that's a plus for locals! 

Scottish skiing will survive mainly through the activity of local people. Hoards of visitors from equatorial britain will help but things will probably live or die based on the life conditions for local customers. 

- General income levels
- Availability of staff with employment flexibility
- Amount of, and flexibility, of leisure time
- Uptake of snow sports in new generations

With so much snow around this year it will be interesting to see how this pans out considering the current economic background.

Tell us more! That is the kind of post I want. People that can explain without getting all emotive about it.

I would consider using local resorts AND accept its downsides if I found the price to be more appropriate and proportionate to the service provided.

Admittedly, my £10/£15 bracket is very low but that is all I am willing to pay at the moment. The odd excellent day out being swamped by hundreds of folks will always be the limiting factor ( I can't choose my day being a teacher. Weekend warrior way only for me thereby limiting willingness to pay for...queuing on the slopes).

I am only considering it too to teach my kids enough skiing that they can then come touring with me.

So who can tell me about the model of staffing used, the rational about "fixing" snow in a windy fickle climate, the costs (including electricity) of running a resort and finally what would be the theoretical minimal profit any company would be ready to make to run such resorts. After all I do accept it is not a charity ran to entertain people for free.

Jim, I am not interested in waves, just genuinely baffled that people are still willing to pay

When I was in Scotland, I quite often went to Nevis Range at 12pm for a half day. This is cheaper and loads of people leave from about 2pm, so quieter too. And you can stay in bed.

we went last weekend (13and 14th*  to Cairngorm and it was awfull.  the conditions were nothing like they described on the web and only for the fact that my partner had skied in the alps prior to the trip I dont think Id  ever got her back on to skis again.

A six hour drive. we had a great weekend in Aviemore but i will not go skiing again there.  If i could trust their snow report it would be different.

NO SH!T, next you'll be telling us Codona's isn't as good as Disneyland

There wasn't that much in the East, friends skied the mountain bike tracks to get off aonach mor at the weekend and there was powder down the the road at bridge of orchy. I skied piste at cairngorm on Thursday for the first time in ages and they've done the best with what they've got, which wasn't great.

I can't believe I just sided with Cairngorm mountain though, the business side of it plays funny games to maximise investment and senior staff salary, before getting surprised when they go bust, again. Get bailed out, again, and start a new company, again, to continue to milk the system.

Can you not just get your kids taught in the Alps, then go touring?

But then they probably don't charge the same either...

My personal favourite from cairngorm was the description of the snow conditions as 'pisted powder'.

The conspiratorial may wonder why they removed the winterhighland.com webcams without permission from the Scottish Ski Club hut...

(P.S. All the snow is in the West at the moment)

Day tickets for 1 adult + 2 kids at Glenshee = £64

Day tickets for 1 adult + 2 kids at Chamonix = 139.10 euros (let's call it £126)

So, not the same either.

That's a ridiculous bit of cherry picking, comparing prices at Glen Shee (which is actually £70 according to their website) with the Chamonix pass which gets you access to almost all of the areas in the valley.

Here's a better comparison: 1 adult and 2 kids for Les Saisies = 92 euros = £81

1 adult and 2 kids for Cairngorm = £80.

So even with the current crap exchange rate they are totally in the same ball park.  

Salut Erick, I think the reality is (given the fickle nature of winters) that a ski area relying purely on skiing probably (certainly) isn't a viable business no matter how you frame it. Parallel activities (eg granny & grandad coach tours going up the gondola at Nevis Range to have tea & cake and a walk around - minimal staff needed compared to opening for skiing) and 'out of ski season' activities (MTB-ing etc) are the lifelines I suspect...

Hi Simon....you lucky dog. Make the best of all that pow!

I think you might be right in there but the price of the ride up is still outrageously expensive all the same!

And Disneyland is supposedly not a patch on Disneyworld! Not I would know as I would rather eat my own hands rather than spend time in either, kids be damned! I'll never take them there willingly and I will grudge every penny in the unlikely event of me agreeing to finance it (without accompanying).

Meanwhile, I still maintain that you would get more for your bucks of skiing in the following scenario (5 full days on piste) by flying to an all inclusive abroad than what most people pay here provided they don't live in Aviemore.

Couldn't agree more with your comments regarding all things Disney! And you're right about a week abroad vs a week at cairngorm (which is why we're off to Cham later in the season). I would say though if you do live close to a Scottish ski centre and you pick your day carefully you can get a good day skiing. My girls skied themselves almost to the point of collapse at GS on Saturday, loving every minute

Anyways...if we all upped our game snow could become a thing of the past!!!

https://www.facebook.com/CandideThovex/videos/10155038627933204/?ref=tahoe