Eye-watering downhill running

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 john arran 04 Mar 2017
When I'm running in the hills and come to a downhill section my eyes often start watering, to the extent that it becomes pretty hard to see clearly where I'm going on technical descents. Seems worse in cold weather but happens even when it isn't cold.

Anyone know why this happens and if there's anything I can do about it? (in addition to just MTFU, obviously.)
 Pete Houghton 04 Mar 2017
In reply to john arran:

The eyes watering is a physiological response to the sudden changes in air pressure as you descend. Simply wearing a pressurised diving helmet will negate the problem.
 digby 04 Mar 2017
In reply to john arran:

For me the tears are literally shaken out of my eyes. I know someone who maintains that it's the increased wind from the added speed that makes them run, and gets very cross if contradicted. But if the wind is from behind and thus not a factor it still happens. Nothing you can do! Except wear absorbent gloves.
OP john arran 04 Mar 2017
In reply to digby:

The wind theory doesn't sound plausible at all, since it's just as bad on very rocky descents where I'm gingerly having to pick my way down. Indeed it's much more noticeable then as the consequences of misjudging a step are much worse. It does seem particularly bad with some directions of wind though.

I'm wondering if it has anything to do with looking downwards much more rather than essentially straight ahead - the tears literally leaking out?

I quite like the pressurised diving helmet suggestion; would I need the weighted boots to go with it?
 wbo 04 Mar 2017
In reply to john arran:
I get the same problem. And if im going to get an asthma attack thats when it will be as well. Uff
 PM 04 Mar 2017
In reply to john arran:
Keeping your eyes closed at all times might help to hold the tears in, and be much lighter than the diving helmet. Might cause some different problems though.
Post edited at 11:54
 Yanis Nayu 04 Mar 2017
In reply to john arran:

Blink hard. That's what I do cycling.
 Chris the Tall 04 Mar 2017
In reply to john arran:

I'm not convinced by this air pressure theory, so before you splash out on the helmet I suggest you try a little experiment

Simply try running downhill backwards
OP john arran 04 Mar 2017
In reply to Chris the Tall:

I suppose as a control group I should also try running down while looking up at the sky?
OP john arran 04 Mar 2017
In reply to Yanis Nayu:

> Blink hard. That's what I do cycling.

Presumably that helps expel the water from your eyes, but why does it appear in the first place?
 Luke90 04 Mar 2017
In reply to john arran:

I get this when mountain-biking and have always blamed it on the wind. I find that clear glasses help, though that's more common for riders than runners so you might feel like a bit of a tit.
 Michael Hood 04 Mar 2017
In reply to Luke90: Decathlon do glasses for £3.99 - sunglasses or yellow (skiing?) or clear (running/cycling).

Presumably they'll be 5 euros where John is.

OP john arran 04 Mar 2017
In reply to Michael Hood:

> Decathlon do glasses for £3.99 - sunglasses or yellow (skiing?) or clear (running/cycling).Presumably they'll be 5 euros where John is.

They are indeed €5 here but I'm really not sure they would help anyway, since the tears seem to come even when there's no discernible airflow. That's what puzzles me so much about it - it doesn't seem obviously wind-related.
 DaveHK 04 Mar 2017
In reply to john arran:

Are you an emotional fellow otherwise?
OP john arran 04 Mar 2017
In reply to DaveHK:

I have my moments, but if anything I would have thought that running uphill would be more likely to bring me to tears.
 fellrunningjen 05 Mar 2017
In reply to john arran:

I spoke to my optician about this who explained that the eye produces a fine oil film to stop it drying out, if the duct is blocked or your not getting enough omega oils in your diet then you can get watery eye. The oil prevents the water from drying or running from the eye, not enough oil and your eye produces more water to compensate. I would think this occurs when you run down hill, and is worse if running into the wind or cold.
 digby 05 Mar 2017
In reply to fellrunningjen:

The watering occurs immediately you start descending so that's unlikely. Each footfall descending is jarring compared with level or uphill running. I stick by my tears shaken out theory.

Now, why does my nose run as fast as I do?
 digby 05 Mar 2017
In reply to john arran:

Ah, looks like the nose is linked to the tears... http://kidshealth.org/en/parents/tear-duct-obstruct-surgery.html
ceri 05 Mar 2017
In reply to john arran:

I get this too, very annoying.
OP john arran 05 Mar 2017
In reply to ceri:

Interesting that there doesn't seem to be any well known explanation for this phenomenon. We live in a world where we somehow expect to have answers for everything and for those answers to be easily searchable, yet even simple things like this seem to remain mysteries, with speculation or theoretical possibilities being the closest we actually are to an explanation. It's actually quite nice that simple things like this can remain a mystery despite the immense volume of scientific research.

I'd still like a convincing answer though - and even more so a way to stop it happening!
In reply to john arran:

I beleive its to do with the fact that we don't blink very much when concentrating on something. I saw a video of a rally driver once that showed how little he blinked. If you couple that with the wind on the eyes and the fact your eyes are constantly producing tears which your eye lids would normally wipe away, you get water pooling over the eye.
 ianstevens 05 Mar 2017
In reply to john arran:

> Interesting that there doesn't seem to be any well known explanation for this phenomenon. We live in a world where we somehow expect to have answers for everything and for those answers to be easily searchable, yet even simple things like this seem to remain mysteries, with speculation or theoretical possibilities being the closest we actually are to an explanation. It's actually quite nice that simple things like this can remain a mystery despite the immense volume of scientific research.I'd still like a convincing answer though - and even more so a way to stop it happening!

It's a sub-conscious release of emotion as your body realises it either a) is going home or b) has another steep hill to ascend.

I get it as well.
 petegunn 11 Mar 2017
In reply to john arran:

Not sure if its true but men don't blink as much as women, this might go back to hunter/ gatherer times, when we had to keep fixed eyes on prey etc.
Maybe as others have said keeping a fixed stare on the ground in front of you as you descend, drys the eyes greater than when on flat easy ground.
 Strachan 12 Mar 2017
In reply to john arran:

Is it to do with looking down? When I cycle in cold weather I'm not especially aware of my eyes watering until I try to look down at my Garmin and find that I can't see a thing because of the huge pools of tears sat on my lower lids. So possibly they're watering all the time running, but you only notice when you're having to look below a certain angle?
OP john arran 12 Mar 2017
In reply to Strachan:

> Is it to do with looking down? ... possibly they're watering all the time running, but you only notice when you're having to look below a certain angle?

This seems by far the most plausible answer so far. Simple mechanics could be changing the path of the tears so they start welling unhelpfully only when looking down.
Thanks.
jacck1234 12 Mar 2017
In reply to john arran:

There’s a reason snowboarders and downhill mountain bikers are all young punks: they have no fear. The older we get, the more afraid we get. If you wanna be fast, you gotta be fearless. Evaluate yourself on the downhills. Are you scared? Are you playing it safe? You are going to have to make that decision to put it all on the line if you want to become a faster downhill runner.


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 deepsoup 12 Mar 2017
In reply to john arran:
> This seems by far the most plausible answer so far.

Perhaps you could design an experiment to find out. How about wearing upside-down belay glasses to run downhill whilst looking up?
OP john arran 04 Apr 2017
In reply to digby:

> For me the tears are literally shaken out of my eyes. I know someone who maintains that it's the increased wind from the added speed that makes them run, and gets very cross if contradicted. But if the wind is from behind and thus not a factor it still happens. Nothing you can do! Except wear absorbent gloves.

After running again last night (Twice in 2 months - I'm in danger of getting fit!) I'm inclined to agree. There certainly must be several factors at work, and when cycling I think the wind is possibly the biggest factor, but this can't be so when you're running with a slight tailwind and still getting blind with tears. What I did notice was that it was much worse when the down gradient or terrain was steeper, so that I was really having to impact each step to decelerate, rather than able to use a smoother, more rolling motion. I was conscious of the tears bouncing around in my eyes, even to the extent of wondering whether there was any correlation between long-term fell runners and brain problems, such as is sometimes reported with boxers or American footballers. I very much doubt there is but the impact was very noticeable nonetheless and not surprising that it could cause tears to be released into the eyes.
 morpcat 27 Apr 2017
In reply to john arran:

Are you altering your breathing on the downhill? On high impact descents do you naturally switch to nasal breathing and keep your mouth closed?

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