UKH

Many years ago I was walking through a Canadian forest, heading for an ice climb, not too far from the town of Banff. I was alone, with my companion a few hundred yards behind me. There were a few inches of fresh snow on the ground and the forest was a silent place. I stepped into a clearing and suddenly realised I was no longer alone. A young mountain lion had entered the small sunlit area at the same moment as me. We both froze, uncertain of what was about to happen. The creature paused for a moment, looked at me, decided I was no threat and strolled casually away. The whole encounter only lasted a few seconds, yet it left a profound in impression on me.

It is a pity that the Scottish Highlands are bereft of their top predators largely through man’s fear and ignorance. Why not bring back the wolf?

See more here http://www.ukhillwalking.com/articles/page.php?id=5888

In reply to John Burns: I was lucky enough to have a close encounter with a lone wolf in Alaska whilst on a Sea Kayaking expedition. The encounter lasted over 10 minutes, a fantastic and memorable experience. Each time one of us stepped forward the other one stepped back. It ended with the Wolf giving me a long and musical howl before he trotted off slowly into the woods. One of many animal encounters I've had but definitely one of the best.

In reply to John Burns: I agree. I did my ML assessment talk on this subject. It went down pretty well.

In reply to John Burns:

As I'm sure you all know, wolves occupied the whole of the British Isles until the 1700's.

But bringing them back today? I'd love to see them here agin. But how would you stop them roaming into farm land and eating sheep (amongst other stuff)?

I know there's a couple of large landowners who also would like to re-introduce them to large fenced off areas. But won't that just be a wildlife park?

In reply to Dave Perry:
>You're getting your species confused. Wolves became extinct in England much earlier than that, and there were only a very few left in scotland by this time.

In trhe meantime, enjoy this

http://chriswoodfolkmusician.bandcamp.com/track/the-wolfless-years

One of the side effects of the return of the wolf in the US was an increase in wildflowers as the deer became prey again and grazed less out in the open. Maybe Cairngorm in 2050?

In reply to John Burns:

One of my favourite memories is from wild camping in Northern Canada. Sitting there in the dark around a campfire and listening to the wolves howl. Every now and again there was a series of yelps and partial howls, which puzzled all of us. When we finished the canoe trip I decided to call in to a local ranger station who reliably informed us that the noise was from the pups trying to copy the adults!! Absolutely Fantastic.

I would love to hear that in the UK as I have also heard wolves howl in Europe but unfortunately I can never see them return to the UK, just look at the hysteria that a fox can cause in this country!!

In reply to Alan M:

That's mostly just that, hysteria. I live in a small town in Central Scotland. There are foxes everywhere all day. I love it, rather than be upset about it, most other people don't seem to notice them.

In reply to aln:

Exactly it is just hysteria but the bad press sticks. I love watching foxes we have them in and out of our garden every day. The problem is if you speak to people you hear all kind of scare stories about foxes from attacking kids, to killing cats to just generally being evil (the stories even end up in the national press). In reality a fox is about as much of a risk to a human as a Chihuahua. The problem is the bad press sticks, just look at the hype over the false widow spider!! I know people who are killing every spider they come into contact with.

I think it would take something radical to get the general public, the hill farming and the general farming sector to agree to wolves in this country. However, if lowland France can show positive effects and little negative human/wolf interaction then that may be our time to press ahead with reintroductions here.

In reply to Alan M:

I notice on the feature & analysis of BBC Scotland there is a report on the plan to release bears and wolves in to a 50,000 acre enclosure. Isnt that a zoo/safari park?

Surely a pen so small will create animal welfare issues for both predator and prey especially the prey not being able to escape beyond the fences. A bit like throwing a few foxes in a chicken coop. Though if its given permission there is nothing to stop the same trick being used up and down the UK.

In reply to John Burns:

I don't think bringing back the wolf is a good idea but I agree there are too many deer. The solution to this is reform of land ownership so that sporting estates are not allowed to increase numbers.

There are more than 350,000 deer in Scotland and this won't be lowered by introducing a few wolves.

Talking about wolves avoids the real issues.

In reply to Alan M: Lister needs to take control of neighbouring estates - and protect many kilometres of fence from the weather and munro baggers (He will probably need to expand into the Beinn Dearg area). One neighbouring estate is heavilly into wind farms and dams - so probably no joy Kildermorie way. Coiremulzie? Glen Calvie?

Sorry to see this idiot back in the headlines.

In reply to John Burns:

Bringing back the wolf is a brilliant idea. The problem is that those that do not want it (for fear of affecting their shooting) are also those that control the press. So hammer-horror stories a plenty can be expected from that quarter.

There's few attacks on humans by wolves in Europe over the years. A few sheep are lost each year, but you can mitigate against that quite easy. Wolves will generally avoid contact with humans, especially if they fear them. To satiate the blood lust of a certain sector the Estates could 'cull' a quota of them after a few years.

Wolves would control deer a lot better than most people think. Especially if coupled with banning practices such as supplementary feeding deer in winter. Lots of weak deer would mean easy prey for wolves. More carrion means more golden and white-tailed eagles. More food for ravens and kites. Less deer equals more trees. More trees equal more niches for other species. You end up with a cascade of positives from the reintroduction of a species. Any losses to the shooting/farming industry will be more than made up by tourism.

Lynx should be released too. They would also prey on the deer, especially the roe and the non-native sika. They are ambush predators that also avoid human contact, in fact positively move away from it.

Macropredators would restore a balance that has been lost in the ecosystems of our uplands. Once rebalanced who knows what our upland environment would look like. A bit of a dream, but it wouldn't take much to do.

In reply to brokenbanjo:

I don't recognise the situation you are referring to. Which landowners do you mean and where?

I was on Rannoch Moor on Friday night and at Loch Cuaich on Saturday. Both of these landscapes are devastated by deer overpopulation.

The capacity exists to alter things pretty quickly but that involves changes to the landowning establishment.

I'd rather see resources spent on this sort of stuff and securing current endangered species such as the Scottish Wildcat before we embark upon a victorian rewilding plan which there is no need for.

In reply to John Burns: The problem with urban foxes is that people feed them by hand and they lose their fear of humans.

The idea of Londoners coming up to feed the wolves is an interesting one to explore...

Especially when they find out the wolves are eating the cuddly Bambis.

In reply to brokenbanjo:

Hmmm. Not sure about that.

I'm afraid that big predators and man just don't mix and the big predators always come off worst. Scotland just isn't big enough for the both of us and in the past when individuals have planned to bring wolves back into Scotland they've met vociferous resistance from the locals.

Mind you as I type this a plan is hatching in my mind to put wolves back onto Rhum, somewhere with lots of deer, not many people and no way of escaping...

In reply to Saor Alba:

Pretty much any that have a deer stalking 'business'. It is a hypothetical situation, but the Allerdale plan was jumped on at an instant by the neighbours re introducing wolves with no fences.

I was up on Rannoch this summer and it is hammered by deer. The Corrour Estate are making some progress, but most regeneration is still in exclosures due to the requirement to maintaining viable (read easy) shooting. Deer could be controlled with natural predators and stalking, rather than stalking alone, which only serves as pseudo income for the Laird.

The wildcat is a conundrum to solve. If you ask me, they probably do not exist genetically anymore given their mixing with household moggies. Domestic cats need banning, or neutering at birth if the wildcat is to have a chance. What chance have we got at enacting that? Red deer are on their way too, a lot have sika genes in them. These could be bred out over time if the source of the dilution is eradicated or reduced to an insignificant number. You either do that with man power, which is costly and then you have the landowners to deal with. Or you use something more natural, say lynx or wolf.. or better yet, wolverine!

I disagree with your 'no need' comment. As I said earlier, the ecological balance and niches that are fortified and created will mean it is boom time for Scottish wildlife. We only think there is no need because we are told that this is how it is and has always been. Just a few changes and you can make a world of difference. It is a case of having the vision and then acting on it.

Look at the expense of Creag Meagaidh (sorry if spelling wrong) and Glen Feshie, trying to get regeneration of Caledonian Pine Fporest. The high stalking levels costs a fortune. Wolves have been shown to do something similar, for free in Yellowstone. There is no reason why they wouldn't here.

Eric - People believe the hype about wolves, because we are told from a young age that the wolf is evil and will dress like your Nan. I mean some people vote Tory and they are far more dangerous than any animal The vast majority of wolf attacks on the continent are from rabid animals. Those others have lost their fear of people. Keep the animal in fear and it will avoid human contact.

There is another predator missing from the furthest reaches of Glen Alladale and Glen Mor.

Clearances anyone? Especially emotive in that bit of Easter Ross.

In reply to John Burns: I've added a poll to this post on my blog now so you can vote on the issue. So far everyone is in favour.

In reply to John Burns:

Of course they are in favour, romantic, victorian notions appeal to people with a recreational view of the land.

In reply to brokenbanjo:

Good use of inverted commas. There is no business in many of these areas to speak of. Sporting estates keep the deer numbers high to justify the stalking and there is also the bizarre notion of the more deer the better.

Glenfinnan Estate had 2-30 deer on it in 1971. It now has 900+ and that is nothing to do with lack of predators and everything to do with the management employed.

If deer numbers are to be reduced, they should be as they are by far the biggest threat to the Scottish hills, then the first stop should be to stop the management practices that increase and maintain high numbers. The wolf is an irrelevance in that.

Corrour is doing no better than ok. If it changes hands then it could be decimated again.

Have you been speaking to SP re the wildcat? If you have you will know who I mean. Habitat and interbreeding are the main issues and again we avoid dealing with landowners on this. The recent, as yet unpublished, research into a genetic standard only goes back 150 years and cats have been on this island for 9,000+ years. There is a lot of exaggeration on the wildcat front and a fair amount of misinformation.

We are avoiding our responsibility to the environment and communities by allowing land owners to do anything they want with no consequences to them.

So in summary, we should deal with the most important challenges first which are Capercaillie, Wildcat, red squirrel, deer numbers and a multitude of other species in difficulty as well as reforesting. All of this can be done through tackling landowners but that involves some scary (for some) changes to the British Establishment.

In reply to brokenbanjo:


I'm not sure that people's objections to wolves are simply because they think they will eat their children. Apart from the obvious objections raised by sheep farmers I'd imagine they could be a serious nuisance for Highland communities if they started raiding bins, eating cats etc...

Can you think of any examples anywhere else in the world of peaceful co existence between man and wolf? I'm genuinely interested.

In reply to John Burns: I live in East Yorkshire, close to the largest council estate in Europe and I'm very much in favour of the reintroduction of the wolf.

There would be numerous benefits for the overall community including thinning down the largely obese and unfit residents. Especially, if the local benefits agency combined the reintroduction with the requirement to collect your benefits from the post office.

A good return to Darwinism!

In reply to Saor Alba:

I don't disagree with a word you are saying. The problem lies with the fact that those that make the rules, have the land. My friend works on Corrour and told me how they have got to where they are today, very scary given the good work that is happening, at how ephemeral a 'good' ownership is. Not fantastic, not to Feshie or Craig Meagaidh (apologise for the spelling again) standards, but better than most.

I haven't spoken to anyone re the wildcat, more just inferred from available evidence. I tend to have a very precautionary approach to conservation, it serves me well. If I am wrong, then I will happily be proved as such! But yeah, without habitat, we may as well not bother with the genetic work. Deer control will assist that, be it naturally mediated or by man.

So how do we go about the wide ranging changes that are necessary. European Directives have served no help on getting the changes required. We may have beavers in the UK again (you read Scotland given your separatist leanings ), which seemingly only caused an issue when the Knapdale trial began. There is still reams of misinformation printed off by the landed classes about threats to salmon stocks, as though the Atlantic salmon didn't evolve with the beaver!

Our wild places need the right balance of predators and prey to function properly without daily human intervention. At the minute we do not have that, which needs addressing. As you say there is a list of enigmatic animals that require protection, but there are also countless plants and more mundane beasts that require the same.

So how do you propose we get the landed class, the minority that own the majority of the land, to do the 'right' thing?

In reply to Removed User:

They could be, but any incidence of them raiding bins would mean that they had no fear of humans, which is easy to instil in a species. I think peaceful is a misnomer for an predatory species and man. But in most Countries where they reside they can get along in relative harmony. Poland and Romania have high numbers of wolves, which seemingly cause no major problems.

We as a species just have to accept that we will lose a few sheep, or will have to protect them adequately. And losing a few sheep wouldn't be the worst thing to happen!

You mention cats, but there is never really any acknowledgement of the ecological disaster caused by so many feral and house moggies. They kill an inordinate number of small rodents and birds, herptiles and invertebrates. So perhaps losing a few of them would be good too!