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Check this out - http://www.everestnews.com/stories2005/everestcopter05232005.htm
What next - a cafe at the top for the tourists!
What next - a cafe at the top for the tourists!
In reply to 'Hilda':
"This tremendous achievement breaks the World Record for the highest altitude landing and take-off ever, which sets an ultimate milestone in the History of Aviation. Fabrice Brégier, President and CEO of the EUROCOPTER Group, world leading helicopter manufacturer, immediately congratulated the pilot and his team for this extraordinary feat."
thats going to be a hard one to beat, how highs everest now, is it about 2ft shorter
P
"This tremendous achievement breaks the World Record for the highest altitude landing and take-off ever, which sets an ultimate milestone in the History of Aviation. Fabrice Brégier, President and CEO of the EUROCOPTER Group, world leading helicopter manufacturer, immediately congratulated the pilot and his team for this extraordinary feat."
thats going to be a hard one to beat, how highs everest now, is it about 2ft shorter
P
In reply to 'Hilda': Well, THAT's news. A chopper with a ceiling over 30K feet...
Pity they chose to park it up there though.
Pity they chose to park it up there though.
In reply to 'Hilda':
might encourage even more rich fools to try and climb it, knowing they may be able to be rescued whatever altitude their at?
might encourage even more rich fools to try and climb it, knowing they may be able to be rescued whatever altitude their at?
In reply to nz Cragrat:
Stepping out of his helicopter, Didier Delsalle commented: « To reach this mythical summit definitively seemed to be a dream; despite the obvious difficulties of the target to be reached, the aircraft demonstrated its capability to cope with the situation (…), sublimated by the magic of the place”.
Would you have got out??? lol
imagine it fell? he's be stuffed then.
Stepping out of his helicopter, Didier Delsalle commented: « To reach this mythical summit definitively seemed to be a dream; despite the obvious difficulties of the target to be reached, the aircraft demonstrated its capability to cope with the situation (…), sublimated by the magic of the place”.
Would you have got out??? lol
imagine it fell? he's be stuffed then.
In reply to paulguy:
You cannot beat the ultimate, the highest landing unless you pile something up even higher for it to land on.
If you read the link it says they have flown to 33000 ft but they had nowhere to land that high up.
You cannot beat the ultimate, the highest landing unless you pile something up even higher for it to land on.
If you read the link it says they have flown to 33000 ft but they had nowhere to land that high up.
In reply to Alan:
Why bother, when they can just go in the helicopter? They can have their summit photos taken with a token sherpa and be back in Lukla for champagne lunch...
> might encourage even more rich fools to try and climb it, knowing they may be able to be rescued whatever altitude their at?
Why bother, when they can just go in the helicopter? They can have their summit photos taken with a token sherpa and be back in Lukla for champagne lunch...
In reply to 'Hilda': I'm not convinced. There are no pictures of it and the technical manual for said helecopter only rates it good to 7,010m and -40 degrees c. Admittedly, this is what it is cleared to, but there is a huge difference between 7010m and 8828m!
http://www.eurocopter.com/site/doc_wsw/350B3-05-101-01-E_with%20cover.pdf Page 27.
There is also no mention on the Eurocopter website - something I would rave about if my helecopter had done it.
Also, where did it land? There is no flat space on the summit of Everest. Even if there was, his margine for error is about 0 and even less given the thin atmosphere. I find it hard to believe that the pilot landed, swaggered out for a quick leak before hopping back in and home for a horlex.
http://www.eurocopter.com/site/doc_wsw/350B3-05-101-01-E_with%20cover.pdf Page 27.
There is also no mention on the Eurocopter website - something I would rave about if my helecopter had done it.
Also, where did it land? There is no flat space on the summit of Everest. Even if there was, his margine for error is about 0 and even less given the thin atmosphere. I find it hard to believe that the pilot landed, swaggered out for a quick leak before hopping back in and home for a horlex.
In reply to Jon Dittman:
the pictures been taken off the eurocopter site i guess to save their bandwidth. I've not seen it myself yet. The press release is on all the everest sites and is also on eurocopters site. The everest sites are saying that theres video footage of it but i couldn't find it. Theres also reports ther of a helicopter being seen to land on the top 2 days running
p
the pictures been taken off the eurocopter site i guess to save their bandwidth. I've not seen it myself yet. The press release is on all the everest sites and is also on eurocopters site. The everest sites are saying that theres video footage of it but i couldn't find it. Theres also reports ther of a helicopter being seen to land on the top 2 days running
p
In reply to Hotbad Peteel: So... So far, all we have in evidence is the promise that video and photos exist - but no one seems to know where they went.
I will still believe it when I see it. Most planes can't operate at that height let alone helecopters - I wait to be convinced.
I will still believe it when I see it. Most planes can't operate at that height let alone helecopters - I wait to be convinced.
In reply to Jon Dittman:
i can't find anything either. Theres a few articles saying theres videos but when you go to look theres nothing. Still i probably believe it mainly because it doesn't matter to me one way or the other and i'm the trusting type when it comes to this sort of thing
p
i can't find anything either. Theres a few articles saying theres videos but when you go to look theres nothing. Still i probably believe it mainly because it doesn't matter to me one way or the other and i'm the trusting type when it comes to this sort of thing
p
In reply to Jon Dittman:
Checked my calander to see if is wasn't April 1st. Dubious lack of photos and no mention on any of the major news websites (BBC etc) make me skeptic.
> (In reply to Hotbad Peteel) So... So far, all we have in evidence is the promise that video and photos exist - but no one seems to know where they went.
>
> I will still believe it when I see it. Most planes can't operate at that height let alone helecopters - I wait to be convinced.
>
> I will still believe it when I see it. Most planes can't operate at that height let alone helecopters - I wait to be convinced.
Checked my calander to see if is wasn't April 1st. Dubious lack of photos and no mention on any of the major news websites (BBC etc) make me skeptic.
In reply to Hotbad Peteel:
BUT IT DOES MATTER!!!! It errr... just does.
> Still i probably believe it mainly because it doesn't matter to me one way or the other and i'm the trusting type when it comes to this sort of thing
BUT IT DOES MATTER!!!! It errr... just does.
In reply to 'Hilda': There's info on the eversest news site saying
"Experimental flight up to 10.211 meters (33.500 ft) on April 14, 2005".
If they managed that I'm very impressed, but this would mean that landing on the summit was perfectly feasible.
"Experimental flight up to 10.211 meters (33.500 ft) on April 14, 2005".
If they managed that I'm very impressed, but this would mean that landing on the summit was perfectly feasible.
In reply to Andrew Barker: I've sent an e-mail to Eurocopter asking for photographic proof....
No response yet"
No response yet"
In reply to 'Hilda': Did you give them the manditory 28 days to reply? There are no press releases on their web site that I could find.
I reckon it is the Everest web sites having a hearty laugh!
I reckon it is the Everest web sites having a hearty laugh!
In reply to Jon Dittman:
i found the press release. Can't be bothered going back to find the url though so you'll have to believe me. The article linked by the OP is the eurocopter press release but i don't think its quoted as such
p
i found the press release. Can't be bothered going back to find the url though so you'll have to believe me. The article linked by the OP is the eurocopter press release but i don't think its quoted as such
p
In reply to Jon Dittman:
http://www.eurocopter.com/publications/FO/scripts/newsFO_accueil.php?arbo=1...
> There are no press releases on their web site that I could find.
http://www.eurocopter.com/publications/FO/scripts/newsFO_accueil.php?arbo=1...
In reply to Jon Dittman: No - just an hour! Maybe they'll get back to me later!
By the way, I'm curious to know how they managed to land a helicopter on top of Everest, when its been too windy for hardly any summit attempts (only two so far, done last weekend!)
During the '96 Everest disaster, when they airlifted Beck Wethers off the top part of the Khumbu Icefall, the pilot had great difficulty in taking off after landing because their was no air for the rotor blades to 'hook' into...
Mind you I don't know that much about physics, maybe they've invented 'super-roater-blades'!
By the way, I'm curious to know how they managed to land a helicopter on top of Everest, when its been too windy for hardly any summit attempts (only two so far, done last weekend!)
During the '96 Everest disaster, when they airlifted Beck Wethers off the top part of the Khumbu Icefall, the pilot had great difficulty in taking off after landing because their was no air for the rotor blades to 'hook' into...
Mind you I don't know that much about physics, maybe they've invented 'super-roater-blades'!
In reply to 'Hilda':
As far as I understand, the problem with generating lift at high altitudes is that the air is less dense, so the blades or wings need to be moving faster, relative to the air, in order to generate the same lift. I can't see why they couldn't manage to fly at higher altitudes if they could get the rotors spinning faster - it's just overcoming that engineering challenge.
Any helicopter pilots care to add anything?
> (In reply to Jon Dittman)
> During the '96 Everest disaster, when they airlifted Beck Wethers off the top part of the Khumbu Icefall, the pilot had great difficulty in taking off after landing because their was no air for the rotor blades to 'hook' into...
> During the '96 Everest disaster, when they airlifted Beck Wethers off the top part of the Khumbu Icefall, the pilot had great difficulty in taking off after landing because their was no air for the rotor blades to 'hook' into...
As far as I understand, the problem with generating lift at high altitudes is that the air is less dense, so the blades or wings need to be moving faster, relative to the air, in order to generate the same lift. I can't see why they couldn't manage to fly at higher altitudes if they could get the rotors spinning faster - it's just overcoming that engineering challenge.
Any helicopter pilots care to add anything?
In reply to Dominion: That certainly puts it into a different light, but they could just be plugging for publicity. It does beg the question - "Why would you want to buy a helecopter that can fly that height?" After all, most helecopters are used for short trips to areas which don't have a runway.
In reply to Jon Dittman:
greater radar range and out of range of surface to air missiles at a guess
p
greater radar range and out of range of surface to air missiles at a guess
p
In reply to Jon Dittman:
Don't know why you'd want to "buy" one but I reckon that there'd be a lot of benefit from "developing" one.
Look at it this way: you develop a rotor/blade combo that can lift weight in thin atmospheres. This also means that it can lift more in normal density atmospheres or do so with less fuel (= longer range and/or lower operating costs). Also, helicopters are susceptible to air temperature which also affects air density ( Boyle's Law (PV/T = k) ) so such a blade can improve operations in hot climates.
Bob
Don't know why you'd want to "buy" one but I reckon that there'd be a lot of benefit from "developing" one.
Look at it this way: you develop a rotor/blade combo that can lift weight in thin atmospheres. This also means that it can lift more in normal density atmospheres or do so with less fuel (= longer range and/or lower operating costs). Also, helicopters are susceptible to air temperature which also affects air density ( Boyle's Law (PV/T = k) ) so such a blade can improve operations in hot climates.
Bob
In reply to 'Hilda':
A couple other news sources have picked it up now:
http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&ned=us&q=eurocopter+everest&b...
A couple other news sources have picked it up now:
http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&ned=us&q=eurocopter+everest&b...
In reply to Bob:
but you cant spin a high altitude blade in denser air to the same speed as you'll have greater friction and the dynamis will de different too. Its got to be valuable to the indian and pakistanis so they can fight each other in the himalayas
p
but you cant spin a high altitude blade in denser air to the same speed as you'll have greater friction and the dynamis will de different too. Its got to be valuable to the indian and pakistanis so they can fight each other in the himalayas
p
In reply to 'Hilda': It will be a long time before they will be able to carry passengers up there, it's a French helicopter, the blades go round the wrong way and it does not have the power to carry a load at that altitude. Someone should have used the Agusta A109K2 which REGA use in Switzerland, that’s a hot and high machine.
In reply to MeMeMe:
Must be true then... quotes sourced from the Associated Press
Still - I would like to see a photo, afterall he was up there for two minutes, surely enough time to whip out a camera and reel a couple off... self portrait of pilot, with Tibet/Nepal/China in the background and a couple of rotor blades for good measure...
> (In reply to 'Hilda')
>
> A couple other news sources have picked it up now:
>
> http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&ned=us&q=eurocopter+everest&b...
>
> A couple other news sources have picked it up now:
>
> http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&ned=us&q=eurocopter+everest&b...
Must be true then... quotes sourced from the Associated Press
Still - I would like to see a photo, afterall he was up there for two minutes, surely enough time to whip out a camera and reel a couple off... self portrait of pilot, with Tibet/Nepal/China in the background and a couple of rotor blades for good measure...
In reply to Hotbad Peteel: Pretty much the only dynamics difference I can see is in the gearbox. Whilst you may be correct in asserting the blades wouldn't necessarily be rotated as fast at lower altitude, all the aerodynamics can be adapted very easily to varying air pressures at different altitudes (a lot of aircraft is designed using parameters non-dimensionalised relative to sea level values, including air density).
I'm not necessarily convinced though that they would speed up the rotor considerably just to achieve higher altitude. A very heavy lift helicopter (sort of crane of the sky) probably produces sufficiently high lift in normal operating conditions that it can achieve these altitudes when lightly loaded without significant modification. So it probably didn't cost that much to an adapt a helicopter for this role. And Eurocopter can probably afford to play stunts like this being the worlds largest helicopter manufacturer.
I'm not necessarily convinced though that they would speed up the rotor considerably just to achieve higher altitude. A very heavy lift helicopter (sort of crane of the sky) probably produces sufficiently high lift in normal operating conditions that it can achieve these altitudes when lightly loaded without significant modification. So it probably didn't cost that much to an adapt a helicopter for this role. And Eurocopter can probably afford to play stunts like this being the worlds largest helicopter manufacturer.
In reply to psd:
The small engineering challenge of the blade tips approaching the speed of sound!
> (In reply to 'Hilda')
>
> I can't see why they couldn't manage to fly at higher altitudes if they could get the rotors spinning faster - it's just overcoming that engineering challenge.
>
> I can't see why they couldn't manage to fly at higher altitudes if they could get the rotors spinning faster - it's just overcoming that engineering challenge.
The small engineering challenge of the blade tips approaching the speed of sound!
In reply to djgrasssnake: Just use BERP blades (if its out of patent) or come up with an equivalent. Increasing the speed of blades is a tricky but achievable challenge. In fact I'm sure one of the last few helicopter related things I glanced at during my degree was referring to ideas for supersonic blades - how insane is that!
In reply to 'Hilda': Well it's certainly going to be a better challebge than the 3 peaks challenge. Everest, K2 and Kangchenjunga in a day rather than snowdon, scafell and the ben!
Kind of ironic.
a helicopter that can fly to top of everest, pumping out greenhouse gases as it goes above the ever depleating glacier below!! What an achievement for man!
a helicopter that can fly to top of everest, pumping out greenhouse gases as it goes above the ever depleating glacier below!! What an achievement for man!
In reply to dshearer:
Quite! Technology over the environment - again!
Next some bright spark will think of putting a wind farm on the top!
Quite! Technology over the environment - again!
Next some bright spark will think of putting a wind farm on the top!
In reply to dshearer:
If this is true surely there are 2 quite large points
1. it now makes one of the larger tests of human endurance that was wasn't possible by machine now possible - end of an era
and
2. you can now be rescued from pretty much most of everest (this is probably worthy of most debate because it completely changes the face of climbing everest)
If this is true surely there are 2 quite large points
1. it now makes one of the larger tests of human endurance that was wasn't possible by machine now possible - end of an era
and
2. you can now be rescued from pretty much most of everest (this is probably worthy of most debate because it completely changes the face of climbing everest)
In reply to 'Hilda': I am still not convinced. I was talking to an aeronautical engineer last night who swore that it was not possible. Having said that, he was in his final year and no doubt knows jack about the real world. I also spoke to my collegue at work who summitted Everest a couple of years ago and he says there is room to land, but not much!
In reply to Jon Dittman:
mounteverest.net started reporting this last week.
http://www.mounteverest.net/story/EverestrecordChopper-MysterysolvedMay1220...
mounteverest.net started reporting this last week.
http://www.mounteverest.net/story/EverestrecordChopper-MysterysolvedMay1220...
In reply to Sales:
I wouldn't panic just yet. Helicopters still don't fly in the conditions people typically need rescuing from.
>
> 2. you can now be rescued from pretty much most of everest (this is probably worthy of most debate because it completely changes the face of climbing everest)
> 2. you can now be rescued from pretty much most of everest (this is probably worthy of most debate because it completely changes the face of climbing everest)
I wouldn't panic just yet. Helicopters still don't fly in the conditions people typically need rescuing from.
In reply to 'Hilda': ExplorersWeb showed video footage of the helicopter over the summit on may 11th, though unfortunately they don't seem to have a link to their previously shown Webcasts so I can't find it now. The footage was taken by climbers on Everest at the time and though not high definition it did clearly show the chopper.
In reply to Sales:
I think this is hugely significant for HA mountaineering. I think commercial companies will attempt to use the heli to put supplies on the mountain. This would save a lot of human effort and logistical problems - but i'm sure the Nepali / Tibetan authorities will attempt to ban it's use because it will take away porter / sherpa livelihoods.
It is very significant in terms of rescue. Although it is true that you usually want rescuing when the weather doesn't allow it, the will be a much higher safety margin in amounts of tents / gas / food / clothing etc higher on the mountain. i.e. if you get ill/injured there will be enough in reserve till the chopper can come and get you.
There is no doubt that eventually there will be tourist rides to the top of the mountain - the local authorities will be able to charge through the nose for the permits.
I think it will make the mountain much less of a challenge and less beautiful place. The commercial operators will probably be looking into the future and be realising that the demands from their normal customer (rich, middle-aged, not much experience) are going to change - there will be a big demand for the back-up of the chopper and for rides to the top.
Makes it all less attractive huh?
I think this is hugely significant for HA mountaineering. I think commercial companies will attempt to use the heli to put supplies on the mountain. This would save a lot of human effort and logistical problems - but i'm sure the Nepali / Tibetan authorities will attempt to ban it's use because it will take away porter / sherpa livelihoods.
It is very significant in terms of rescue. Although it is true that you usually want rescuing when the weather doesn't allow it, the will be a much higher safety margin in amounts of tents / gas / food / clothing etc higher on the mountain. i.e. if you get ill/injured there will be enough in reserve till the chopper can come and get you.
There is no doubt that eventually there will be tourist rides to the top of the mountain - the local authorities will be able to charge through the nose for the permits.
I think it will make the mountain much less of a challenge and less beautiful place. The commercial operators will probably be looking into the future and be realising that the demands from their normal customer (rich, middle-aged, not much experience) are going to change - there will be a big demand for the back-up of the chopper and for rides to the top.
Makes it all less attractive huh?
In reply to 'Hilda':
Just received this email from Eurocopter - see what you think...
Dear all,
Very sorry for the delay but the pics and video wasn’t already arrived in France.
Please find here the link on Internet with 50 high resolution pictures.
http://www.eurocopter.com/everest
This link will be operational within 30 minutes..
A low resolution video will be available tomorrow around 11h00 am (Paris time) through the same link.
www.eurocopter.com/everest
Best regards,
Jean-Louis Espes
Head of the Press-Information Dpt.
jean-louis.espes@eurocopter.com
Just received this email from Eurocopter - see what you think...
Dear all,
Very sorry for the delay but the pics and video wasn’t already arrived in France.
Please find here the link on Internet with 50 high resolution pictures.
http://www.eurocopter.com/everest
This link will be operational within 30 minutes..
A low resolution video will be available tomorrow around 11h00 am (Paris time) through the same link.
www.eurocopter.com/everest
Best regards,
Jean-Louis Espes
Head of the Press-Information Dpt.
jean-louis.espes@eurocopter.com
In reply to 'Hilda':
#obscene rant
Whoopee, fricking airwolf on everest! Shoot them, shoot everyone else, shoot me.
Tourist trips to the summit of everest- nice.
There's a universe out there and all we do is land a whirligig up there.
Massive wankers!
#obscene rant
Whoopee, fricking airwolf on everest! Shoot them, shoot everyone else, shoot me.
Tourist trips to the summit of everest- nice.
There's a universe out there and all we do is land a whirligig up there.
Massive wankers!
In reply to Lbos: When is Apoo's cousin going to put his corner shop up on everest? You never know, BP may put a servo up there to re-fuel the chopper!
video link here - quite amazing
http://www.mounteverest.net/story/FrenchEverestMysteryChoppersUtopiasummit-...
http://www.mounteverest.net/story/FrenchEverestMysteryChoppersUtopiasummit-...
In reply to Sales:
2. you can now be rescued from pretty much most of everest (this is probably worthy of most debate because it completely changes the face of climbing everest)
Only in ideal weather conditions, I would imagine, and it's generally when the weather isn't ideal that people need rescuing.
2. you can now be rescued from pretty much most of everest (this is probably worthy of most debate because it completely changes the face of climbing everest)
Only in ideal weather conditions, I would imagine, and it's generally when the weather isn't ideal that people need rescuing.
In reply to Anonymous:
Not necessarily true: Would it be able to fly at that height with a passenger *as well as* the pilot? I expect they stripped every bit of unnecessary gear out of the chopper before it took off.
I know that when the chopper rescued Beck Weathers, the pilot had to dump his co-pilot, seats, a bunch of his fuel and everything else that he could...even then he couldn't get 2 people in and still take off, when it became apparent that Makalu Gau needed evacuating as well as Weathers. Two trips were required.
Not necessarily true: Would it be able to fly at that height with a passenger *as well as* the pilot? I expect they stripped every bit of unnecessary gear out of the chopper before it took off.
I know that when the chopper rescued Beck Weathers, the pilot had to dump his co-pilot, seats, a bunch of his fuel and everything else that he could...even then he couldn't get 2 people in and still take off, when it became apparent that Makalu Gau needed evacuating as well as Weathers. Two trips were required.
God there's some bitter punters on here. Some Frenchies in the business of making helicopters made one that overcame a major limitation of operation at altitude - and to prove the point they landed it on the highest point on earth.
Regarding rescues, load carrying and lazy sods hitching a ride instead of climbing, Everest got prostituted years ago so cut your whining.
And as one correspondent already pointed out, like existing high altitude heli ops, it wouldn't operate in anything but perfect conditions.
Matt
Regarding rescues, load carrying and lazy sods hitching a ride instead of climbing, Everest got prostituted years ago so cut your whining.
And as one correspondent already pointed out, like existing high altitude heli ops, it wouldn't operate in anything but perfect conditions.
Matt
In reply to Matt Schofield: I still want to know when i can grab a pack of crisps off appo's cousin! I know there's a shop up there somewhere, it was on the simpsons! ! !
In reply to 'Hilda':
Having been in a light helicopter around mountain tops though at approx 3000m max, I wouldn't fancy their chances in anything more than a gentle breeze. How they did that in the Jet Stream is unexplained!
Still it means that more people can get to the top I suppose and make it even easier than be carried up by the Sherpas. I wonder if they used supplemental oxygen for the engines? How did they get FAA etc clearance to operate at that level?
Pity they didn't bring down all the rubbish at the same time.
Having been in a light helicopter around mountain tops though at approx 3000m max, I wouldn't fancy their chances in anything more than a gentle breeze. How they did that in the Jet Stream is unexplained!
Still it means that more people can get to the top I suppose and make it even easier than be carried up by the Sherpas. I wonder if they used supplemental oxygen for the engines? How did they get FAA etc clearance to operate at that level?
Pity they didn't bring down all the rubbish at the same time.
The AS350-B3 is an amazing machine. I have time in the AS350-B2 version which is the same model with a slightly less powerful engine. The video tells the story...Those that have stated that this could only be done in perfect conditions with a very lightly loaded chopper are right. If he tried to pick up three more people at the summit, he'd most likely still be there. As a airplane and heli pilot with an aero engineering background, I appreciate how close to the edge this feat was.
What we should appreciate as climbers is that a lightly loaded B3 is capable of rescues previously thought impossible.
BTW, we don't speed up the rotor RPM at high altitudes, we increase the angle of of attack of the of the main rotor blades by pulling more collective.
RH
What we should appreciate as climbers is that a lightly loaded B3 is capable of rescues previously thought impossible.
BTW, we don't speed up the rotor RPM at high altitudes, we increase the angle of of attack of the of the main rotor blades by pulling more collective.
RH
In reply to Flynall:
The video does not tell the story. What you see, are a few pictures of a helecopter flying around with Everest in the background and then a very distorted picture from the undercarage of a landing on "a summit". What is missing, is the telephoto video footage from base camp of a helecopter landing on the summit of Everest. The pictures with the copter in the foreground show a massive white trail coming off the summit. Am I right in thinking that these are caused by winds of +50mph? Surely difficult to land in these condition let alone at nearly 9000m!?
> The video tells the story...
The video does not tell the story. What you see, are a few pictures of a helecopter flying around with Everest in the background and then a very distorted picture from the undercarage of a landing on "a summit". What is missing, is the telephoto video footage from base camp of a helecopter landing on the summit of Everest. The pictures with the copter in the foreground show a massive white trail coming off the summit. Am I right in thinking that these are caused by winds of +50mph? Surely difficult to land in these condition let alone at nearly 9000m!?
In reply to Nick Cole:
I doubt it. Supplying sufficient oxygen to the engine isn't the issue at altitude, it's getting enough lift (as I said on the other thread; airliner engines have no trouble operating at much higher).
Mark
> I wonder if they used supplemental oxygen for the engines?
I doubt it. Supplying sufficient oxygen to the engine isn't the issue at altitude, it's getting enough lift (as I said on the other thread; airliner engines have no trouble operating at much higher).
Mark
That was a rhetorical question, not serious. The weight of the canisters would have probably meant it couldn't have got to base camp let alone the top.
It was a referral to 'artificial aids'!
It was a referral to 'artificial aids'!
In reply to 'Hilda':
Helicopter crashed at Base Camp today, a Mil-17. Fortunately. no-one injured. More junk on Everest...
Helicopter crashed at Base Camp today, a Mil-17. Fortunately. no-one injured. More junk on Everest...
In reply to Flynall: As you say “this is a feat”. But I too work in the helicopter industry, not as a Pilot so you have one up on me, but how realistic would it be for a B3 to carry out a rescue at such altitude? If a B3 can fly up there, why don't they use a machine like an Agusta A109K2, that is a hot and high machine for rescues in that region. I bet the pilot had his collective, if he put it in a hover up there, near through the roof pulling in the power.
In reply to Jon Dittman:
Actually, it tells quite a bit of the story. To be honest, it is apparent that he never lowers the colective all the way. If the wind was 50 mph, then he was never actually hovering. Flying a helicopter above its translational lift velocity requires much less power than hovering. This is probably what made it possible. The trail of snow visible from base camp supports this assertion. I appreciate your clarification. The whole thing makes perfect sense at this point.
There are ways to get even more power out of a turbine if they were willing to use a few tricks from the turbine powered drag racers...
RH
Actually, it tells quite a bit of the story. To be honest, it is apparent that he never lowers the colective all the way. If the wind was 50 mph, then he was never actually hovering. Flying a helicopter above its translational lift velocity requires much less power than hovering. This is probably what made it possible. The trail of snow visible from base camp supports this assertion. I appreciate your clarification. The whole thing makes perfect sense at this point.
There are ways to get even more power out of a turbine if they were willing to use a few tricks from the turbine powered drag racers...
RH
In reply to Richard Smith:
The stated max elevation for hovering IGE for the B3 is actually 1,700ft higher than the K2.
I also agree with the other poster who stated that since he was in air travelling at roughly 50mph then he wouldn't be actually hovering but would be above the translational speed so would need much less power. He would also be benefitting from the ridge lift of the mtn.
The stated max elevation for hovering IGE for the B3 is actually 1,700ft higher than the K2.
I also agree with the other poster who stated that since he was in air travelling at roughly 50mph then he wouldn't be actually hovering but would be above the translational speed so would need much less power. He would also be benefitting from the ridge lift of the mtn.
In reply to 'Hilda':
KATHMANDU, June 3 - The Civil Aviation Authority of Nepal Thursday said that the landing of the Eurocopter helicopter on the peak of Mt. Everest has not been confirmed.
Earlier, international media had reported that the Eurocopter’s Ecureuil chopper had landed on the top of the Everest creating the world record for the highest altitude landing.
CAAN, in a statement yesterday, clarified that the news carried by the international media was false.
Eurocopter, issuing a statement on May 24 in Paris, had said its chopper Ecureuil A Star AS 350 B3 piloted by Didier Delsalle, achieved the feat of landing on the top of the world’s highest peak on May 14.
The CAAN had formed a committee to investigate of the said landing when it was only permitted to test fly over the Everest region.
Upon inquiry, the captain of the flight Didier Delsalle in a written explanation has said that it was impossible to land because of the adverse topography, the CAAN said.
“Delsalle had only made emergency landing some 1000 metres below at the South Col due to bad weather and therefore the landing cannot be confirmed,” the statement said.
“The helicopter had not demanded permission for landing on the peak,” said the CAAN “and therefore no permit had been given and such imaginary publicity by the Eurocopter is regretted.”
The permission for the test flight has been withdrawn in view of the sensitivity from the available information as the conditions of the flight were violated, and the helicopter has been returned to Kathmandu, said the statement. (dds)
KATHMANDU, June 3 - The Civil Aviation Authority of Nepal Thursday said that the landing of the Eurocopter helicopter on the peak of Mt. Everest has not been confirmed.
Earlier, international media had reported that the Eurocopter’s Ecureuil chopper had landed on the top of the Everest creating the world record for the highest altitude landing.
CAAN, in a statement yesterday, clarified that the news carried by the international media was false.
Eurocopter, issuing a statement on May 24 in Paris, had said its chopper Ecureuil A Star AS 350 B3 piloted by Didier Delsalle, achieved the feat of landing on the top of the world’s highest peak on May 14.
The CAAN had formed a committee to investigate of the said landing when it was only permitted to test fly over the Everest region.
Upon inquiry, the captain of the flight Didier Delsalle in a written explanation has said that it was impossible to land because of the adverse topography, the CAAN said.
“Delsalle had only made emergency landing some 1000 metres below at the South Col due to bad weather and therefore the landing cannot be confirmed,” the statement said.
“The helicopter had not demanded permission for landing on the peak,” said the CAAN “and therefore no permit had been given and such imaginary publicity by the Eurocopter is regretted.”
The permission for the test flight has been withdrawn in view of the sensitivity from the available information as the conditions of the flight were violated, and the helicopter has been returned to Kathmandu, said the statement. (dds)
In reply to Richard Smith:
It sounds a bit like when Lydia Bradey climbed Everest without a permit and then withdrew the statement as she was going to get banned for the illegal ascent
It sounds a bit like when Lydia Bradey climbed Everest without a permit and then withdrew the statement as she was going to get banned for the illegal ascent
In reply to 'Hilda':
If you read the press release you will realise that he did NOT get oout of the aircraft at the summit. It says ..."Stepping out of his helicopter, Didier Delsalle commented..." i.e. this is what he said as he stepped out of his helicopter on the ground!
Therefore NO PHOTOS.
My best mate is a helipcopter pilot and instuctor and suggests the big issue is not the blades but the engine developing enough power at that altitude to drive them. He seems to think that this is all possible but said that there is no way you would switch of the engine at that altitude - risk of it not restarting is just too high. As for getting out... well you just wouldnt - would you?
If you read the press release you will realise that he did NOT get oout of the aircraft at the summit. It says ..."Stepping out of his helicopter, Didier Delsalle commented..." i.e. this is what he said as he stepped out of his helicopter on the ground!
Therefore NO PHOTOS.
My best mate is a helipcopter pilot and instuctor and suggests the big issue is not the blades but the engine developing enough power at that altitude to drive them. He seems to think that this is all possible but said that there is no way you would switch of the engine at that altitude - risk of it not restarting is just too high. As for getting out... well you just wouldnt - would you?
In reply to JohnnyJ: keep up mate the thing didnt even land on the summit! the guys who built the thing came clean in there own press relece
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