Windows (11) backup

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 elsewhere 17 Sep 2022

Laptop is 1TB (far from full) and I've ordered an external 1TB SSD to go in a USB caddy.

What's good software to backup (clone) up entire laptop drive (system plus data) so it can be reconstructed (bootable?) from external SSD on another PC/laptop if the laptop dies?

Thanks.

 Luke90 17 Sep 2022
In reply to elsewhere:

You can't really back it up in such a way that you can just boot the operating system and all your programs etc. on another PC if your laptop dies. Though you might get away with it if you got the same laptop and copied the backup image onto it.

The advantage a full drive image would give you is that if your internal hard drive (or SSD) failed, you could get a replacement drive, copy the image onto it and be back up and running. But that's not going to work all that quickly unless you've got easy access to a replacement for the failed drive. I suppose it would also be the quickest way to get operational again if you got infected by ransomware or similar.

The disadvantage of a drive image is that it's not generally as convenient for restoring files and data, especially if it's just a matter of grabbing a few accidentally deleted files or something. And most of the time, it's the data that really matters. In a pinch, a new or borrowed laptop would probably get you through as long as you had a good backup of your actual data. The drive image would give you that but not as easily as a backup option specifically focussed on the data.

So full drive images have their place, but it's worth considering whether it's the best option for your needs.

 Hooo 17 Sep 2022
In reply to elsewhere:

I use Veeam free version. It creates a regular backup file that you can open and restore individual files from, but you can also create a boot drive on any USB stick. To restore your laptop, you boot from this USB, plug in the backup drive and it restores the full image onto the laptop drive.

OP elsewhere 17 Sep 2022
In reply to Luke90 & Hoo:

Thanks!

I have backup of personal data onto usb pen drive and onedrive for work data.

I'm looking for disaster recovery of data, installations & account details/passwords to get up and running asap.

I've been to you can install disk clone software onto laptop to make backup, then if the worst happens use the same software on new hardware to recover from external usb drive (with updates to drivers for different hardware).

Post edited at 18:20
 cezza 17 Sep 2022
In reply to elsewhere:

Macrium Reflect (free) Home Edition 

does exactly what you’ve asked for - complete clone of one drive to another. Happily works while system is running. And the cloned image is bootable. 

Post edited at 18:23
 Marek 17 Sep 2022
In reply to elsewhere:

You need to be clear on what problem (failure) you are trying to protect yourself from. Not all 'backups' are the same and 'clones' are something else...

If your laptop is stolen or destroyed, a clone image won't be much use 'cos you can only restore it to the original (or identical) machine. Fine if you're worried about a drive failure, but less so otherwise.

A proper back utility will give you data protection for all sorts of failures from finger trouble ("Oop, didn't mean to delete that!") to lost/destroyed/stolen laptop, but obviously won't be bootable. You should then consider *where* you backup data lives: If you back up to a local USB drive, you are protected against laptop failure, but not if your house get burgled or burns down. For that you need to consider 'off-site' backup of some form or other. You can store a USB drive off-site or you can upload the data to a 'cloud' service. Different pro and cons.

You might also want to consider just how important your data is. Not all data is the same: Some may be critical-must-not-lose (back it up multiple ways in multiple off-site buckets) but most of it is likely to be much less important and you might just be happy with an on-site USB drive.

Finally, a big trap with 'simple' backups is people don't test how data gets restored until it's too late and find out the backup worked fine but the restore doesn't. Test it! And watch out for silent failures (e.g., your backup USB drive has a fault and you didn't realise till too late.

Bottom line is: Define the problem you're trying to solve before worrying about the solution; and TEST! Good backup is not simple.

OP elsewhere 17 Sep 2022
In reply to Marek:

> Bottom line is: Define the problem you're trying to solve before worrying about the solution; and TEST! Good backup is not simple.

Quick recovery if laptop fried.

I'm aware a backup is not a backup until you've restored from it, but I probably won't as I don't have spare laptop. Although Macrium Reflect (free) Home Edition mentions boot up into a VM so I could boot into VM on current laptop. And VM should be hardware agnostic.

Post edited at 19:11
 Hooo 17 Sep 2022
In reply to Marek:

While you used to only be able to restore onto an identical machine, I've found that Windows 10 is pretty forgiving about this. I've restored backups onto completely different machines before, from a Lenovo laptop to a Dell for instance. I think you'd probably need to have the same brand of CPU though.

Edit: Thinking about it, this isn't really very helpful to the OP. Because you can't guarantee it will work, and you won't find out until it's too late. What you need to do is ensure that your clone backup can also be accessed to retrieve individual files. Then if you can't find a machine that will boot it, you can still get your files.

Post edited at 19:49
 Hooo 17 Sep 2022
In reply to elsewhere:

I seem to recall using Macrium to take an image of a hardware machine and convert it to a VM. So this would be a good choice if does do this. Worth having a go to see if it works.

 CantClimbTom 17 Sep 2022
In reply to elsewhere:

There is a free utility just a little exe file no bloatware, from sysinternals (now absorbed into Microsoft) called disk2vhd.exe. You'll have to Google it to find it just make sure you download from a reputable site like Microsoft/sysinternals etc not some dodgy free download site or Russian .edu etc

It does exactly what the name suggests, it creates an image (as a .vhd file) of your C: drive (or whichever disk you select) and works even while you are using C: so you can make an image of the running system - pretty clever. Just copy to desktop or wherever and run it to make a vhd onto your external disk.

Enjoy...

Post edited at 20:01
 Marek 17 Sep 2022
In reply to elsewhere:

... And VM should be hardware agnostic.

If it was my 'critical-must-not-lose' data then "... should ..." wouldn't cut the mustard.

OP elsewhere 17 Sep 2022
In reply to Marek:

> ... And VM should be hardware agnostic.

> If it was my 'critical-must-not-lose' data then "... should ..." wouldn't cut the mustard.

A VM means I can test that.

 Marek 17 Sep 2022
In reply to CantClimbTom:

disk2vhd is very much a tool for people who know what they're doing around Windows and virtualisation. It's a good tool, but there are plenty of pitfall if you do something wrong which end up which... nothing. I certainly wouldn't recommend it lightly to someone who just want to backup their data!

As I suggested earlier, a critical backup tool/process needs to be foolproof (because anyone can be a fool sometimes). As far as possible. This doesn't fit that criterium.

 Marek 17 Sep 2022
In reply to elsewhere:

> A VM means I can test that.

Up to a point. Do you have another machine that supports VMs? Most hypervisors are pretty picky about client support. Frankly, if you had enough experience to manage virtual machine environments (reliably) then you probably wouldn't have been asking the original question. Restore-time is not the time to have to learn.

On the other hand, I have no experience of Macrium Reflect, so perhaps it's all good.

Good luck.

OP elsewhere 17 Sep 2022
In reply to Marek:

Me being a fool (coffee+laptop) prompted my OP.

I've used/use VMs but not managed them.

Post edited at 21:13
In reply to elsewhere:

If the new SSD is made by Crucial then Acronis True Image is free.

I upgraded from HDD to SSD last weekend, and have been running off the SSD since last Sat.

Here’s the process if Crucial

1. boot up your laptop

2. Plug in usb caddy with SSD in place

3. Download and install Acronis True Image

4. Start up True Image and go to Tools -> Create bootable recovery usb

5. Boot from USB stick, you may need to change UEFI or BIOS boot order to boot usb before internal boot drive.

6. Select backup and select the partitions on internal boot disc you want to back up, if UEFI with GPT them ensure to include the UEFI partition as well or result won’t be bootable. UEFI partition will be around 100Mb ball park

7. Select back up destination, not the boot disc being backed up nor the new SSD. Let the backup complete.

8. Once that is complete, select restore from tools (off Acronis options) and destination disc your new SSD

9. Once restore complete, update boot order to boot from new SSD.

10. Restart, and if successful it’ll boot from your new SSD and you’ll know it’s all good at that point in time.

I’ve actually replaced the original boot internal drive with my new SSD. Though original HDD internal drive still in place just not plugged into power or SATA connector at present.  

Post edited at 22:36
 Marek 17 Sep 2022
In reply to Currently Resting:

Windows these days has a badly documented tolerance for hardware changes. Changing the disk is generally OK. Changing other bits might be OK. Eventually Windows will spit its dummy and fail to boot. The OP was looking for a solution "... if the laptop dies." In this scenario where you replace the dead laptop with an unrelated one you're really just rolling dice as to whether your image 'backup' is recoverable. That's OK if you're just trying to avoid the inconvenience of a full system install plus file-level recovery, but hardly sensible if it's your only remaining repository of 'must-not-lose' data.

OP elsewhere 18 Sep 2022
In reply to Marek:

That's it. USB pen drive and one drive for must not lose. Disk clone/VM for convenience but hopefully never needed.

In reply to Marek:

Its really not as bad as you make out. You should try it, it’s far more tolerant than you are making out and you should not let your poor experience colour your views,

OP elsewhere 18 Sep 2022

Wandering off on a tangent,  laptop had both work and free personal OneDrive set up which was a mess as both attempted to backup the same stuff. Not happy that work cloud copy included non-work or personal files.

However now work OneDrive backs up documents folder only and I put personal files (not much if I exclude photos) in a folder on desktop. I should be able to restart  personal (free) OneDrive and set to back up desktop only without conflict.

Post edited at 17:05

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