UKH

I have missed out on the UTMB CCC ballot for the last three years, but yesterday I received an email from the organisers saying I was a 'lucky loser'. I have now been offered and have taken a place to run the 100km CCC on the 9th of September. I also have a entry to run the Ultra trail Snowdonia 100km race on the 15th of May, which I would still like to run. Is this enough time for me to recover and get fit enough between the two events?

I've never ran a 100km race before although I have been running injury free for over 6 years and have completed several mountain 50km races. My training for UTS is going well and I'm handling the back to back runs well. If you were in my position would you sacrifice the UTS in order to be in top condition for the CCC, or run both?

Thanks,

Alex

I would do both. If the CCC is your goal race for the year, then I'd use the UTS as training to dial in the nutrition and pacing. I wouldn't push hard in the UTS but I think the race experience will be valuable. I'd be happy with almost 4 months between them.

How well have you recovered after your 50K races? I've generally been able to get back training normal loads within a week of a 50K. I've done two 50K events with 6 weeks between and that felt perfectly fine.

Edit to add I am not an expert, coach or anything resembling someone you should listen to other than I've been running a lot! I'm just saying what I would do. I'm also envious of your successful entry to the CCC!

I too got a lucky loser slot See you there! Or before if you're in the area and fancy a run/panic.

UTS is a great race. Should be enough time between the two.

I would do both. You never know what is going to happen and there is enough time between. If you end up injured or something else occurs before the second race you will have done a good race this year. I dropped a race as I was so focused on my 'A' race a few years ago and ended up getting flu and not doing very much at all.

Congrats, it’s a nice problem to have, and one I was also lucky to find myself with after the January draw. I wrestled with whether doing both races was sensible. I have a similar race background to you, and I’ve done a few 75/80km’s. I’ve decided to go with both, and treat UTS as a fairly serious tune-up/systems test (100k in the mountains will always be a serious undertaking). I’ve cut back on all other planned races (50k’s) in the summer/spring and will just focus on UTS/CCC.

Also, CCC is Sept 1st, not the 9th.

Best of luck for them both.

Would echo the sentiment and do both, three months should be enough to recover and you will learn a lot during UTS. 

I did CCC in 2017 and it was my first step up from 80k one-day ultras which doesn't sound much difference but although not technical, the CCC course is a decent challenge.

It also starts late, about 9am I think whereas most shorter ultras are one (long) day affairs that start much earlier, which means for the CCC most average runners will be running through the night (I finished at about 6am) which is a big psychological hurdle if you've not done it.

It was also snowing up high and subzero most of the night with mud and tricky descents but you could easily be dealing with heatwave conditions and dehydration so having an adaptable race plan and lots of experience to call on really helps. 

It's a great event, crowded as hell but that means you will rarely be running alone and finishing in Chamonix is awesome (especially if you finish mid morning as I have for the TDS and UTMB, 6am in the rain for CCC was a bit more low-key). 

Thanks for all the replies, I'll definitely do both now. I did the UTS 50 last year which was a brilliant event and I genuinely feel that the UTS 100 will be a tougher race than the CCC. I have no time ambitions for either and just want to get round and enjoy the day.

Great! Can you let us know how you get on? It would be good to hear about it. Maybe it's just me but I enjoy write-ups (from anyone - doesn't have to be the elite). Plus we can all have another debate about whether our advice was correct or not!

Will do, I'll do a little report for both the uts and the CCC, although I might have to make a new thread as I imagine this will be closed by the time I run them.

I always find them interesting to get a bit of beta about the course and learn from other people's experiences. The thing with long ultras is fitness only takes you so far and the rest is about race management and mental preparedness. 

Anyway here's my writeup from the 2017 CCC in case it helps. 

https://mountaintrailrunning.com/race-report-utmb-ccc-2017

Is it standard width? 

Thanks, I enjoyed reading that.

My biggest problem is eating. I noticed you had hot soup (with bread I presume) etc. I usually don't fancy anything at aid stations in all events I do. I have to force myself to eat mostly. Were you actually hungry and enjoying the food? I see people around me scoffing cake, nuts and all sorts but I'm never keen and I'm wondering what I can do to fix that. Perhaps I'm pushing too hard or I need more fluid than most and I'm just not drinking enough.

That was a great report thanks. Do you have any recommendations of things to do around Chamonix? I'm going with my other half for a week before the race and we're treating it as a holiday.

Eat crepes, bread and cheese

I find that after maybe the first 8-9 hours of an ultra, especially a hot one, then I really struggle to eat anything for about the next 6-7 hours while things settle down so I make a conscious effort to take the soup when I can and we're not talking massive amounts- its actually quite nice at night - its salty and has little pasta bits in it so you're not replenishing all the lost calories, but it helps and especially the hydration. You'll never replace the calories you use in an ultra during the race, its a just a question of hanging on until the end.

Don't get hung up on what you see other people doing. They might be scoffing cake but they might as easily be chucking it up an hour later just before a DNF. Same with pacing - listen to your own body.

I heard an old adage of ultras once "If you're think you're going to slow, slow down some more". I found that I finished my longest races (UTMB and TDS) strongly ('sprint' finish both of them, and felt 'great') and its probably because of the serious distance (and time) involved. 

The added benefit of not pushing too hard is you simply don't need as much water and as many calories so you're less likely to make yourself sick. Although you really need the fuel, those 6-7 hours basically starving through an ultra have taught me that we don't suddenly conk out at the side of the trail if we don't get the ideal amount, and that you can go a long way on nothing especially at low intensity. Recovering from bonking is easy, you just need sugar (short term) but dehydration is a game-killer - and if you make yourself sick scoffing too much, you likely won't want to take on more fluids (and will lose a load being sick).

*usual disclaimer that I'm not an expert, just the findings from an experiment of one.

Thanks, glad it was helpful. I'm not the best person to ask as since we live down the road (couple of hours but still in the alps) from Chamonix I've never spent too much time there doing extra curricular stuff during UTMB week - have concentrated on resting and getting organised but then maybe that was more of an issue for me turning up the night before sometimes so you might have a more leisurely time at the expo, getting bib etc.

Obviously it depends on your OHs mountain experience and likes - a ride up the Aiguille du Midi of course and you can do some nice easy undulating walks along the balcon routes as the lifts are still open so you can save your legs but stretch a bit.

Its definitely worth as a runner going and clapping in a few others from other races to return the karma - its genuinely heartwarming and the races are staggered so that there's a week long stream of finishers coming through town but it depends on the race you're doing of course. Seeing the last of the UTMBers at midday on a Sunday is superb - I never forget seeing a 60-odd year old Swiss bloke chugging in just under the cut off point.