Plymouth half marathon numpty

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 Big Ger 23 May 2018

This is the shocking moment a woman defies road restrictions and brazenly drives her car into the path of dismayed Plymouth half marathon runners.

Footage taken by eyewitness Rob Bricknell shows the driver turning out of Hawkers Avenue on Bretonside, knocking over a cone and almost injuring a man as he attempts to block the vehicle ploughing into participants in Britain's Ocean City Half Marathon.

The woman then turns right in the direction of Exeter Street - despite the fact the route is shut until 3pm today for the spectacle - entered by thousands across the region.

Video on page here;

https://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/news/plymouth-news/woman-drives-car-path-p...

This idiot should be prosecuted to the max. Your thoughts?

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 Rampikino 23 May 2018
In reply to Big Ger:

As a very regular runner and Event Director for my local parkrun I know that we have to deal with all kinds of people who are simply not interested in anybody but themselves.  I could give you a list as long as my arm of incidents whereby non-runners have acted selfishly and put runners at risk.

However, "prosecuted to the max"?

No.  Despite everything she didn't actually injure anybody.  She needs to understand that the rest of the world does not revolve around her, but she does not need to have the book thrown at her.  She will be getting enough grief as it is through the usual "trial by social media."

Keep in mind that media reporting always takes a dramatic line.  You cannot "almost" injure someone - you either did or you didn't.  But the act of a near miss and using the term "almost injuring a man" is used to allocate some kind of criminal outcome. 

 yorkshire_lad2 23 May 2018
In reply to Big Ger:

I would tend to agree with your sentiments.  However, for the other side of the coin:

 

I have a mate who lives with his wife in Grassington, and she has just given birth to their second son.  The Tour de Yorkshire passed through Grassington at around the same time.  As a precaution, he and his wife moved out to stay with friends out of the valley to prevent not being able to get to the hospital at the critical moment.

I ive in a small town in the Yorkshire Dales when the Tour de France came through last year.  The roads were shut most of the day, steel barriers were put along all the pavements in the town preventing residents (& their cars) getting out.  No-one asked us if we wanted it or not, although the information on closures was well trailed, but very little provision was made for local residents at the time of the closures (e.g. the local vets had difficulty with access, and many workers in the town were told not to come in to work on the day in question).

 

Before castigating the lady who drove through the route of the half maraton, maybe we should know what her reasons were?

 

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 timjones 23 May 2018
In reply to Big Ger:

So her reasons are not unreasonable and the race organisers failed to have any form of contingency plans for residents that were trapped inside the race route?

How hard is it to have a marshalled crossing point or two where they could stop runners for a few seconds in order to allow residents to cross in their vehicles?

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 Rampikino 23 May 2018
In reply to timjones:

> So her reasons are not unreasonable and the race organisers failed to have any form of contingency plans for residents that were trapped inside the race route?

> How hard is it to have a marshalled crossing point or two where they could stop runners for a few seconds in order to allow residents to cross in their vehicles?


If it's being run under UKA then you don't want to be stopping runners.  But you could have a marshal to allow cars to pass through when there is a gap.

OP Big Ger 23 May 2018
In reply to timjones:

> So her reasons are not unreasonable and the race organisers failed to have any form of contingency plans for residents that were trapped inside the race route?

> How hard is it to have a marshalled crossing point or two where they could stop runners for a few seconds in order to allow residents to cross in their vehicles?

That's her story, I'm awaiting further evidence.

ETA: 

Let's face it, ignoring the fact Ms Pine has lived in this flat since 2014 and this will therefore be her third or fourth half marathon, it's perfectly plausible that a busy 66-year-old woman may have misplaced a leaflet she thought was junk mail.

I also live in the area and we did receive letters from the council with dates of pirate weekend, the marathon and I think also armed forces day. It also contained a map to show which roads were going to be closed and for how long. 

Post edited at 11:33
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 timjones 23 May 2018
In reply to Big Ger:

In my experience one of the problems with road closures such as this is that they often seem to close the road hours before the event is due to start and are pretty tardy when it comes to opening it back up after it has finished.

When Velo Birmingham tried pushing through their chosen route in our neck of the woods they wanted to close the roads a full 3 hours before the first cyclist was due.

 

1
 timjones 23 May 2018
In reply to Rampikino:

> If it's being run under UKA then you don't want to be stopping runners.  But you could have a marshal to allow cars to pass through when there is a gap.

It might not be ideal to have runners easing off or pausing for a few seconds but is it really such a hardship to tail end runners when they are otherwise enjoying the ability to run on closed roads?

4
 The New NickB 23 May 2018
In reply to timjones:

> So her reasons are not unreasonable and the race organisers failed to have any form of contingency plans for residents that were trapped inside the race route?

> How hard is it to have a marshalled crossing point or two where they could stop runners for a few seconds in order to allow residents to cross in their vehicles?

As a race organiser, who has only this morning had a meeting with Highways to discuss road closures, I don’t believe her.

As to your second point, apart for being terrible for the race, it wouldn’t be allowed by Highways, a Road is closed or it isn’t.

 Rampikino 23 May 2018
In reply to timjones:

Because runs these days are expensive and you don’t expect to have to stop!

 fred99 23 May 2018
In reply to Rampikino:

Of course, "when I was a lad" runners were much faster, so roads weren't blocked by runners for so long.

 

 DancingOnRock 23 May 2018
In reply to Rampikino:

It’s a bit of a non story. 

That sort of idiot behaviour happens all the time. People in cars think they have priority over all other road users. 

Social Media will try her. Maybe next year she’ll remember not to park her car inside the road closures or organise important workshops on a different day. 

We had a guy try to drive through a road where about 350 people were standing. This was about 2mins before the start of a race and would have been clear within 5mins. We had only just moved into the road ready for the start. 

You can’t fix people who are like that. 

 beardy mike 23 May 2018
In reply to Big Ger:

Have you taken the 30 seconds or so to verify what she's saying? Her house seems to be completely cut off from the rest of the road system. She's disabled i.e. she can't leave her car a few streets away and walk to get past the obstruction. I don't see why a resident should be trapped in their street because the organisers of the event couldn't be arsed to work out a way of getting those residents out of their street if they need to. But by all means exert your moral outrage. All you've got to do is compare the road map to the route map an you will see that she was cut off.

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 beardy mike 23 May 2018
In reply to Rampikino:

By the same token, because you've paid money to run along a road, do you expect residents to stay put while you enjoy your run?

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 summo 23 May 2018
In reply to fred99:

> Of course, "when I was a lad" runners were much faster, so roads weren't blocked by runners for so long.

>

I guess to her trained eye she could tell they were only averaging 5min/miles and were mere joggers out for a fun run or warming up before the actual event. 

 DancingOnRock 23 May 2018
In reply to beardy mike:

Yes. 

The local police and council have agreed to closing the road. For whatever that reason is. The race organisers have paid for that privellidge. 

Its no different to any other road closure. 

 timjones 23 May 2018
In reply to The New NickB:

> As a race organiser, who has only this morning had a meeting with Highways to discuss road closures, I don’t believe her.

Which bit don't you believe?

If you don't believe that someone may have failed in the basic local PR then you must a better man than I am. I know that sadly it sometimes go wrong.

> As to your second point, apart for being terrible for the race, it wouldn’t be allowed by Highways, a Road is closed or it isn’t.

In that case maybe better route planning is needed in order to leave some exits?

 

2
 DancingOnRock 23 May 2018
In reply to fred99:

Surely there were less runners, less car drivers and fewer closed roads races. 

Although the majority of races used to be on a Saturday. 

 timjones 23 May 2018
In reply to Rampikino:

That's not the sort of shoddy attitude that I can identify with. If I'm fell racing and the route crosses a public road then I know that there will be occasions when I need to give way, it's not exactly hard.

 

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 timjones 23 May 2018
In reply to fred99:

Are you sure it wasn't just a case of the slow coaches at the back not being so full of themselves that they wouldn't wait a few seconds to let a resident pass

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 Phil79 23 May 2018
In reply to Big Ger:

I ran this on Sunday, and know the area that was closed off well. 

The route wraps around Sutton Harbour and cuts off a fair few residential blocks, theres limited roads in and out of that area anyway, and all vehicle access would have been cut off by the closure.

She wasn't the only one driving on the closed route as just before this section I saw a bloke in a mini trying to pull out of a side road into a stream of runners. Not sure if he pulled out or if he saw sense.

Obviously what she did was rather stupid, but I've got some sympathy with her as the road closure was in place from 4am to 3/4pm I believe. It was an 8:30 start so even at walking pace I cant imagine anyone was on the course after 12:30 or so.

If I lived there I'd put up with it, its only once a year and only for one day, but I can see why local residents are getting annoyed by it. I would think it would be possible to have some system in place to let cars in and out of the closed off area without disrupting the race,  but dont know the legality of that in terms of road closures etc. 

 Rampikino 23 May 2018
In reply to beardy mike:

Not sure where you think I said that. I’m NOT one of the people advocating throwing the book at her.

Better communication and an option for residents to be able to get out as well keeping traffic and runners separate...

 Rampikino 23 May 2018
In reply to DancingOnRock:

I agree - hence my original post!

 Rampikino 23 May 2018
In reply to timjones:

You are trolling, surely.

comparing a fell race with a city half marathon?

For runners it’s about expectations. If you have paid £30-40 for a “closed roads” half marathon then why shouldn’t you get it?

If you have paid £5 for a fell race with limited marking and marshals and been briefed that the roads are not closed then you should take care.

 timjones 23 May 2018
In reply to Rampikino:

> You are trolling, surely.

Ah the good old stock brush off for anyone that doesn;t share your world view

> comparing a fell race with a city half marathon?


Well I agree that city half marathons are a bit soft and full of gimmicks like naff medals, goody bags and "look at me aren't I great" t-shirts, but each to their own
 

> For runners it’s about expectations. If you have paid £30-40 for a “closed roads” half marathon then why shouldn’t you get it?

Of course they should get what they pay for but it is the organisers responsibility to deliver what they have charged for without upsetting the local residents. The residents are't the ones charging silly money for closed road races.

> If you have paid £5 for a fell race with limited marking and marshals and been briefed that the roads are not closed then you should take care.

Sorry I really don;t buy into the theory that you can pourchase the right to piss local residents about.  If you're an also ran at the arse end of the field it really won't hurt you to pause for a few seconds regardless of how much you have paid to enter or where you are running.

Looking at marshalling and marking, it would appear that the organisers of this particular half might just have been a bit lax

 

 

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 Dave Hewitt 23 May 2018
In reply to Phil79:

> If I lived there I'd put up with it, its only once a year and only for one day, but I can see why local residents are getting annoyed by it. I would think it would be possible to have some system in place to let cars in and out of the closed off area without disrupting the race,  but dont know the legality of that in terms of road closures etc. 

I'm in Stirling, and we've recently had the second running of quite a large marathon. As far as I'm aware there's not been any problem along the lines of the one in Plymouth, but the road closures both last year and this have been extensive and lengthy and a considerable number of people in the area are less than impressed with how it's been handled. There are always going to be those who object to any event of this kind, just as there are those who think it's an unequivocally good idea, but a substantial number of middleground people around here - those who support the race in principle - do seem to be dreading marathon day even though it's a fairly new event.
 
Part of the problem here is the awkward geography of the area, with the castle, a big meandering river and a couple of railway lines making getting across town quite fiddly even on non-marathon days. Stirling's not really suited to a mass event of this sort, despite the scenic benefits. It also hasn't helped this time round that one of the main roads out of Stirling is closed for about a year for railway bridge replacement work, so various bits of the local traffic system are already fairly clogged and limited.
 
Our house is in a community of a couple of hundred people at the end of a long (3/4s of a mile) dead end - just the one road in/out. That road doesn't feature in the marathon but the main road across the T-junction at its end does, and last year the village was completely blocked off in road terms for about ten hours. There was said to be "emergency access" if required, but no one here seems to really know what that meant, and there was even vague talk of helicopters if need be. This year was somewhat easier in local terms: we were allowed out by road provided we turned left and then left again, into town (from where there were various options), but again for ten hours or so we weren't allowed back in by car. Our slight improvement in that regard had a knock-on effect elsewhere however: the race route was changed to extend out to Menstrie, and as far as I can gather this had a pretty drastic effect on travel by road in that direction - eg to get from Stirling to Alva (just beyond Menstrie) by road is about six miles, but on marathon day for a good few hours the only options seemed to be either by the A9 and then back through Glen Eagles, or along the south side of the Forth and across the Clacks Bridge - either of which would make it something like a 30-mile journey.  With restrictions of that extent, plus the more local ones, I can see why people start to get annoyed. At least this year the stewards seemed friendlier - last year the ones closing off our village included some surly types who seemed to think they were maintaining order at a rock gig.
 
I believe the Stirling race route is being discussed at both community council and full council level, and while many people, me included, wish the event well, it clearly does have issues as it were, and these do seem to be echoed in other places across the country. One particular issue that I've heard about from neighbours, and also second-hand from one of the more sensible and thoughtful councillors, is that the local churches are pretty unhappy about the way the race is run. It's held on a Sunday and there's a lot of talk about improving wellbeing etc, but plenty of local people - for whom getting to church each week is an important part of their own wellbeing (particularly the more elderly ones who might well not have much other contact through the week) - have been finding it either very difficult or near-impossible to get to church on marathon day. Whether they're a sufficiently strong and coherent lobby to get any changes made to the race route and to the closures isn't clear, but there are lots of quietly unhappy people and groups like them and overall the jury here seems to still be out on whether the marathon is a good thing or a complete nuisance.

 

 Rampikino 23 May 2018
In reply to timjones:

Tim, I think we are in agreement though it may not seem that way.

I’m Event Director for the local parkrun but also run events from 5k to marathons and also fell races. To me it’s about understanding what the event entails and what are the expectations.

I don’t know anyone who advocates annoying the local residents! With the parkrun we constantly have to remind the runners that we don’t have exclusive use of the park. When a bunch of dog walkers opts to walk right through the course in the middle of the run we just have to deal with it.

When you pay your £30-40 for your closed-roads events you are entitled to have that. The work should have been done behind the scenes to minimise the impact on residents. Runners don’t pay to piss people off!

 DancingOnRock 23 May 2018
In reply to Rampikino:

I know. I wasn’t disagreeing with you. Just engaging in conversation. 

 DancingOnRock 23 May 2018
In reply to timjones:

This kind of event brings large numbers of people into the area with money to spend in local bars and restaurants.

There’s a balance to be had with the road closures.

Being cynical, if this lady was disabled, it may have a bearing on her attitude towards able bodied people out enjoying themselves. 

If it’s a closed road race, then it’s a closed road race. Most races I’ve done have only closed to the roads from an hour before the start of the race to the end of the race. Not sure why this wasn’t or if it was followed here. 

1
OP Big Ger 23 May 2018
In reply to Big Ger:

I don't know if anyone noticed, but the woman driver is also one of the organisers of Plymouth Pride parade.

 timjones 23 May 2018
In reply to Rampikino:

> Tim, I think we are in agreement though it may not seem that way.

 

I don't think we are too far apart in our views either.

I have in the distant past been involved in the organisation of good old-fashioned road rallies and IME wherever you find an issue like this one you will very often find an error on behalf of the event organisers. The answer was always to go cap in hand and aplogise in the hope of preserving good relations for future events, sadly that isn't so likely to be so easy with social media lynch mobs rushing to condemn others these days!

Witht the growing demand for big glitzy, organised events I suspect that it isn't going to get any easier in the future ;(

 

 EarlyBird 23 May 2018
In reply to Big Ger:

I take it that Plymouth Pride is a closed road event?

 

 Wainers44 23 May 2018
In reply to timjones:

Dont disagree with all of your comments. Thought your dismissal of the competitors taking part in a hey look at me race was a huge and sweeping generalisation.

Whatever you think you might challenge yourself with, some need the objective of a set piece urban run for motivation. I don't think that makes them bad people.

Seeing the full film clip on local news the really bad bit was the driver pushing a cone and then a runner aside. The argument which followed was a sideshow. On a different day and with a slip of her foot on the pedal she could have killed someone. 

 Wainers44 23 May 2018
In reply to timjones:

And "glitzy"? Have you been to Plymouth? 

 Rampikino 23 May 2018
In reply to Wainers44:

I think the whole evolution of running deserves a thread away from here.  I’m going to start one.

 ClimberEd 24 May 2018
In reply to Big Ger:

> This is the shocking moment a woman defies road restrictions and brazenly drives her car into the path of dismayed Plymouth half marathon runners.

> Footage taken by eyewitness Rob Bricknell shows the driver turning out of Hawkers Avenue on Bretonside, knocking over a cone and almost injuring a man as he attempts to block the vehicle ploughing into participants in Britain's Ocean City Half Marathon.

> The woman then turns right in the direction of Exeter Street - despite the fact the route is shut until 3pm today for the spectacle - entered by thousands across the region.

> Video on page here;

> This idiot should be prosecuted to the max. Your thoughts?

I missed this thread, and it is an issue close to me as the local 'big' triathlon (full IM distance) was driven away by objections and complaints over road closures.

She should be prosecuted, and be made an example of. If a road is closed it is closed, you can't just 'decide' that you are going to drive along/across it anyway. Particularly for closed road cycling events it is incredibly dangerous to do so.

If you don't like the road closures then you need to complain/address the closure itself.

Ideally don't be such a NIMBY and let the world get on with using infrastructure for positive purpose. ( 'oh yes, we love the triathlon, just so long as they don't close the road near our house')

OP Big Ger 24 May 2018
In reply to EarlyBird:

> I take it that Plymouth Pride is a closed road event?

That's what I was wondering.

http://prideinplymouth.org.uk/plymouth-pride-parade/

 Ridge 24 May 2018
In reply to Big Ger:

> That's what I was wondering.

I wonder how the police, and the woman in question, would react to anyone trying to drive a vehicle through a potential high profile target like that?

 timjones 24 May 2018
In reply to Wainers44:

> Dont disagree with all of your comments. Thought your dismissal of the competitors taking part in a hey look at me race was a huge and sweeping generalisation.

It was a lighthearted response to the accusation that comparing a half marathonto a fell race was trolling.

> Whatever you think you might challenge yourself with, some need the objective of a set piece urban run for motivation. I don't think that makes them bad people.

See above, where did say that that they were bad people?

> Seeing the full film clip on local news the really bad bit was the driver pushing a cone and then a runner aside. The argument which followed was a sideshow. On a different day and with a slip of her foot on the pedal she could have killed someone. 

We trust hundreds of drivers not to suffer from a slip of the foot every time we walk into a town centre, most of us appear to have survived OK?

 

 timjones 24 May 2018
In reply to Wainers44:

> And "glitzy"? Have you been to Plymouth? 

Only once, I've never been back

But I'm guessing that it has very likely improved since my visit as many other towns and cities have.

 fred99 24 May 2018
In reply to Rampikino:

> For runners it’s about expectations. If you have paid £30-40 for a “closed roads” half marathon then why shouldn’t you get it?

If you've paid £30-40 for a race of any sort you've got more money than sense. The only reason some races charge such an astronomical entry fee is so that the organisers can live in the manner to which they'd like to be accustomed.

(And this time there's no smiley face as I'm fed up with the rip-off merchants who've taken over road running at the expense of the sport).

 DancingOnRock 24 May 2018
In reply to fred99:

Do you have any idea how much it costs to close a road? 

 DancingOnRock 24 May 2018
In reply to timjones:

Driving a car at a pedestrian is not trusting someone not to have a slip of the foot. 

That’s a deliberate act which could be considered both as assault and dangerous driving. 

 fred99 24 May 2018
In reply to DancingOnRock:

> Do you have any idea how much it costs to close a road? 

Yes I do - was on my clubs' committee for over 30 years, so know a hell of a lot about organising road races etc..

The major problem nowadays is not that local clubs are organising these races, but that companies are organising them, and in doing so they make money for their personal income. When you see the organisations that they have built up it's no wonder races cost so much.

When local clubs organise a race then volunteers do the jobs, with a small (but useful) profit going to the club so that it can keep going with the rest of its activities (i.e. hiring a track for the youngsters).

The other feature is that local clubs generally organise races in areas without traffic problems, so as to minimise disruption. These companies however want maximum exposure, so head straight for town centres - hence maximising disruption.

My own club investigated a course utilising the 2 river crossings, but threw it out as being a downright nuisance to the population of my city. Along comes Steve Cram Enterprises (or whatever their proper name is) and basically used the worst of the two bridges TWICE. he then had the nerve, after arranging all this, to ask us for volunteers to do all the "awkward" jobs (finishing funnel, timekeepers etc.) for free, to which our answer was a resounding NO as you could have guessed.

Deadeye 24 May 2018
In reply to Rampikino:

> Because runs these days are expensive and you don’t expect to have to stop!


Surely you'll get more minutes/£ that way?

 DancingOnRock 24 May 2018
In reply to fred99:

How much were the local council charging to close that bridge and provide police for the day?

 Wainers44 24 May 2018
In reply to timjones:

> It was a lighthearted response to the accusation that comparing a half marathonto a fell race was trolling.

> See above, where did say that that they were bad people?

> We trust hundreds of drivers not to suffer from a slip of the foot every time we walk into a town centre, most of us appear to have survived OK?

If your reference to the type of person who entered these city events was meant to be light hearted that passed me by.

On the driver issue I take it you haven't seen the start of the clip? The front of the drivers car is in direct contact with a runner who is being pushed back as she revs the engine. If that's standard city driving near you then you live in a place even scarier than Plymouth, so stay safe out there!!

Moley 24 May 2018
In reply to Big Ger:

I'm guessing she was never breathalized, just a thought.

1
SanchoPascoe 25 May 2018
In reply to beardy mike:

Yes because you have paid your entry fee to an event that entails road closures which the race organisers have paid Plymouth City Council to authorise and implement for an event that has taken place for the last twenty years at least. The route passes through the Barbican and one of its main attractions is that it is traffic free. There were bloody great big signs up for over a fortnight before the event around the Barbican where this incident ocurred. Its for one day and then only part of it, for 365. The rest of Plymouth copes.

 fred99 25 May 2018
In reply to Moley:

> I'm guessing she was never breathalized, just a thought.


Drug testing would probably be more appropriate.

It's amazing how many (older) people who have disabilities are on drugs of one sort or another - these drugs aren't all driving compatible.

 timjones 25 May 2018
In reply to Wainers44:

> If your reference to the type of person who entered these city events was meant to be light hearted that passed me by.

Surely the smiley should have given you a clue?

> On the driver issue I take it you haven't seen the start of the clip? The front of the drivers car is in direct contact with a runner who is being pushed back as she revs the engine. If that's standard city driving near you then you live in a place even scarier than Plymouth, so stay safe out there!!

Was that the runner that seemed to think that he could stop a car by plonking a cone in front of it and then trying to push it backwards?

I mistook him for the world's worst marshall.

 

 Wainers44 25 May 2018
In reply to timjones:

> Surely the smiley should have given you a clue?

> Was that the runner that seemed to think that he could stop a car by plonking a cone in front of it and then trying to push it backwards?

> I mistook him for the world's worst marshall.

Yeh that was the guy. The one puzzled by the driver trying to force her way in amongst a load of unsuspecting runners. I wonder if he could see the driver clearly when he tried to stop them. He may have seen only later that it was some middle aged angry lady rather than some drugged up car thief?

Not sure why all this is so complicated for you and yet so simple to almost everyone else? Not your relative driving the car was it (smiley, so can confirm really kidding). Have a great one

 timjones 25 May 2018
In reply to Wainers44:

> Yeh that was the guy. The one puzzled by the driver trying to force her way in amongst a load of unsuspecting runners. I wonder if he could see the driver clearly when he tried to stop them. He may have seen only later that it was some middle aged angry lady rather than some drugged up car thief?

> Not sure why all this is so complicated for you and yet so simple to almost everyone else? Not your relative driving the car was it (smiley, so can confirm really kidding). Have a great one

This individual act itself isn't complicated in itself,  the issues surrounding road closures and effective/considerate marshalling of those closures are a bit more complicated than simply applying for a closure and bunging a line of cones across the road.

 Wainers44 25 May 2018
In reply to timjones:

> This individual act itself isn't complicated in itself,  the issues surrounding road closures and effective/considerate marshalling of those closures are a bit more complicated than simply applying for a closure and bunging a line of cones across the road.

Certainly agree on that. And angry and late to pick someone up or whatever excuse she might trot out, driving into a clearly vehicle free area despite the shouts of runners is not complicated at all, it's just plain stupid. 

 timjones 25 May 2018
In reply to Wainers44:

> Certainly agree on that. And angry and late to pick someone up or whatever excuse she might trot out, driving into a clearly vehicle free area despite the shouts of runners is not complicated at all, it's just plain stupid. 

I'll agree on that but I'd say that there is probably something a little stupid on the organisational side if they expect to fence people into their homes for most of a day.

Maybe some cities are just not suited to hosting a long closed road race?

 Wainers44 25 May 2018
In reply to timjones:

> I'll agree on that but I'd say that there is probably something a little stupid on the organisational side if they expect to fence people into their homes for most of a day.

> Maybe some cities are just not suited to hosting a long closed road race?

That's true, and even some bits of cities that work better than others. Frequency is an issue as if my street was shut 5 times per year for "events" I might be pretty p*ssed too. Still don't think I would force my car into a race route full of runners. 

 


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