UKH

It was a raw cold wet day in Reading today - not raining, but very damp. I ran 14 miles, which is the furthest I've ever run, and felt pretty good at the end and certainly not cold. Drank some water, had a shower, ate lunch - and THEN felt cold, my fingers went numb, and I just couldn't get warm. I went to bed with a hot water bottle and something to read, and inadvertently went to sleep for two hours and was ok after that.

So perhaps I was just more tired than I had realised and therefore didn't have the energy to stay warm - but I just wonder if there is anything specific about eating or drinking that might help to prevent this?

While running I had a small bottle of water and a number of jelly babies.

Grateful for any ideas (including "man up", of course...)
Lxx

In reply to BusyLizzie:

I get the same after bike rides, I just put it down to an energy drop after vigorous exercise. I'm beginning to learn the importance of a decent hot meal with plenty of carbs and protein after a good hard ride. Scrambled eggs on wholemeal toast with plenty of proper butter is my favourite recovery meal.

In reply to BusyLizzie:
Sounds like your body core had cooled more than you thought. I have experienced all the symptoms you describe from either not wearing enough or failing to get into dry clothes quick enough.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

A big greasy meal, a radiator-warm fleece or down jacket, and focusing on cups of tea or hot Ribena before the beer.

Also, don't go jogging.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Thank you all, I knew there would be good advice here.

Yes, I think I didn't get warm quickly enough, and lunch was a bit scanty...
Lxx

In reply to BusyLizzie:

I wouldn't worry about eating greasey food.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

I used to have this after long or hard runs when I was training hard and not just in cold weather, so don't be too worried if it happens on a milder day.
I put it down to the body being drained (energy) and need to recover. Get some food inside asap when you arrive home plus plenty of hot fluid for the core, I frequently needed a little sleep as well, then after a couple of hours all was well.
I learnt to take in the plenty of food and drink as soon as I had finished the event and not wait to bonk later.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Sitting around in damp clothes doesn't help and the worst thing is drinking alcohol, although the OP didn't do either of those.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

It seems unlikely that you would run 14 miles and then run out of energy after you had finished.
The body is presumably still releasing energy from body fat.
I think you adjust to high activity over a period. Then when you stop your blood pressure drops too far for a while before re-adjusting.
Strong coffee.

In reply to Moley:

I would add that the condition your body is in before you start your run probably plays a part, accumulation of harder training, work stress, diet and more can lead to your energy levels taking a battering quicker, the long hard run just tips the balance.

In reply to Moley:

It's not about energy levels. Food won't help.
It's because you pushed yourself hard for a long time. Which you would have been less able to do if short of food or out of condition.
Stimulants or, as you say, sleep.

In reply to BusyLizzie:
Mild hypothermia.

Your core stays hot as it's evolved to do. The capillaries in your extremities close down and the blood flow reduces. They get cold but you don't really feel them getting cold as it's a gradual process. 14miles is about 2hours.

You come into the warm and have a warm shower which is about the worst thing you can do in hypothermia cases.

Your capillaries in your extremities open up and the warm blood from your core rushes out to your cold extremities and cools rapidly, returning to your core. Resulting in death or quite a bad feeling.

Eat first. Sit around for a while then have your shower.

.

In reply to DancingOnRock:

Moley said this happened when it was not cold if he was training hard and I have the same experience.
It's possible, even on a warm day, that your core over-cools after ceasing prolonged effort. But the effect would be the same as my hypothesis.
(I think you adjust to high activity over a period. Then when you stop your blood pressure drops too far for a while before re-adjusting.)
I can't see eating being useful in the short term for hypothermia.

In reply to David Riley:

Lizzie specifically mentions numb fingers and feeling extremely cold.

That's not normal exhaustion.

I only mention eating as she said she was hungry and ate after her shower. Eating before just gives her something to do and a chance to warm up.

It would be strange for her to only feel odd after the shower if it was exhaustion.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Did a fell race recently and this was down on the entry form as required reading - it's well worth a read

http://fellrunner.org.uk/pdf/FRA_Hypothermia.pdf

I tend to get very hot when running - always have to wear a sweatband, even in sub-zero conditions - and then stay hot. However when I've been cycling in cold weather I do get similar reaction to you - the fact that my rides usually end with a long descent doesn't help. My advice - a really thick hoodie !

In reply to DancingOnRock:

She said "could not get warm" not extremely cold.
The numb fingers are low blood pressure. Which would probably also cause "could not get warm".
Nobody said exhaustion.
I get these symptoms often, and it's not exhaustion.

In reply to BusyLizzie:
In the conditions we had yesterday (0 degrees, snow and strong winds here) it's quite easy to cool your core. Your body will use a lot of energy fighting that, which will make you feel extra tired and also concentrate on getting your core up to temperature, making you feel cold.

A hot bath is better than a shower. I did 15 miles yesterday and felt very cold, but a bath revived me and I didn't feel cold afterwards, even though the house wasn't particularly warm.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

My ultimate solution for cold body temperature is to grab the Henry and do ten minutes of vigorous vacuuming, preferably with the brush deployed making the head even harder to push across the carpet.

This warms me very fast, collects an amazing amount of fluff and banks a few brownie points towards the time required for the next ride.

In reply to The New NickB:

Agree with the hot bath.

I couldn't face the Chesterfield cross country yesterday. Feels like -5C !!
Went to the new wall instead.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

I know someone (a small lady) who also gets really cold after running too - she would take hours to warm up. We recon its low blood sugar and around 3 glucose tablets or a can of IRN-BRU fixes it almost instantly.

In reply to David Riley:

Ok. Thanks for that. I always assumed it was temperature related and exacerbated by my hypothyroidism and thermo regulation as I don't get it at all during the summer. The ends of my fingers go white and I can't get warm. Only ever happens after the shower.

I was out yesterday for 3 hours with nothing to eat. Half hour drive home, coffee and toast and was fine.

I may ask my doctor on Thursday.

Thanks.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Thank you all!

I think it's right that my core got cold quickly when I stopped generating heat by running- whether or not we label that as mild hypothermia. I don't think it was exhaustion

Looking back at yesterday from the comfort of a warm Monday, I think I underestimates the cold. I could have done with a bigger breakfast and an extra layer. I had cold feet for the first three miles or so, despite warm socks and leg warmers.

Next time on getting home I will get into warm dry things and eat and get properly warm before showering; and lunch will be scrambled eggs on toast rather than hammy salad. Doh!

Thank you dearies.

Oh, and I am tall-ish; and I have to confess that 14 miles took me two and a half hours. We're talking old lady's pace here.

Happy running everyone.
Lxx

In reply to BusyLizzie:

If you're using marge or spread, get some proper butter - the climate of opinion is changing and realisation is beginning to dawn that athletes need fats and butter is not bad in moderation.

Personally I blame butter's bad image on the manufacturers of marge and spreads who realised they could add more value by creating a "healthier" brand that was cheap to manufacture and steering the public away from simple butter, then achieved their aim through the usual sleazy politician/tame physician route.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

Just to add - I would struggle to do 14 miles without a bit of a sugary drink or chocolate. Maybe that would also help you.

I want to shower straight away, but I get chilblains on my feet if I don't fully defrost them first. So I am often hanging around, shivering & drinking tea, waiting to be warm enough to have a shower.

In reply to stubbed:

I'm happy 'running' 20miles fasted but I have spent a long time training.

Where 'running' on a long Sunday run is about a minute or more slower than 'running' a marathon.

It shows we are all different.

In reply to BusyLizzie:

The postscript to my adventure on Sunday is that I have spent the week sneezing and streaming and have actually taken a day's sick leave today. And no running done since Sunday. Dohh!! I have only myself to blame
Lxx

In reply to BusyLizzie:

cold extremities can be due to Ranaurds Phenonemen...put clothes on immediately you finish and give it a google

In reply to PCD:

The body stores carbohydrate for an hours worth of exercise, if I'm running or cycling for not than 75 mins I take an energy gel at 60 mins then every 30 mins after that. I suspect the op exhausted her glycogen store.

In reply to JimR:

Why does low glycogen lead to being cold?

In reply to Yanis Nayu:

I don't know why, but a quick google search reveals that glycogen seems to be associated with protection from cold in rodent studies and that in people reduced muscle glycogen accelerates heat loss. This kind of makes sense in the context of mountaineering as tired/knackered people are at increased risk of hypothermia. I await a more erudite answer from someone in the know!

In reply to Yanis Nayu and PHD and JimR:

It's a while since this happened and I learnt a lot from it. I've not been cold like that since, even on a cold day for the Reading Half in March. More jelly banies; wrap up warm straight after running; something hot to eat before the shower- and coffee, which someone mentioned and it really seems to help.

Trying to up my distance now so I need to think a bit more about nibbles. My attempts with energy gels tend to lead to squirtage and overwhelmingly sticky fingers...

In reply to JimR:

Entirely dependent on what the hour's worth of exercise looks like. You also need to take into account how efficient the person is at using other sources for fuel, whether that be fat or lactic acid, for instance.

In reply to BusyLizzie:


Ooh err...

In reply to plyometrics:


I train fasted occasionally, and did 53 miles on the bike yesterday after fasting for 9 hours, with no problems at all. No gels or anything until I'd finished. You can train yourself to be metabolically flexible.

In reply to Yanis Nayu:

Agreed. I train fasted all the time and can comfortably run 20 miles in the morning without food either before or during.

Making sweeping generalisations that suggest everyone's body will automatically run out of glycogen at 60 minutes is ridiculous.

We do, however, have a limit of how much glycogen our muscles can store, which I'm led to believe is in and around the 2000 calorie mark, again dependent on the person of course. Which is really the point I think the person I responded to was trying to make in a roundabout way.

In reply to DancingOnRock:

Did u ask your Doctor about Raynaurds Phenomenon? There are pills called nifedipine that may change your life regarding numb digits

In reply to BusyLizzie:

I reckon eating a 'good meal' straightaway will be counterproductive as this has its own blood supply demand. Eat fruit/juice and or hot drinks for best recovery.

Whilst running you produce a lot of energy + heat - and as soon as you stop you need to get clothed - perhaps 'over-clothed' in the moment.

I'm skinny as a rake and have suffered hypothermia issues over the years. The experience has been slightly alarming but also quite ecstatic as I come back to life in a hot shower - try it

In reply to LeeWood:

My grandparents lived in a street called Lee Wood.

Anyway, yes, thanks, I'll bear that in mind as to food and shower. I am, ahem, not as skinny as a rake.