In reply to Andrew Wells:
Apologies for the delay in replying. Work (curse of the climbing classes!) got in the way. Other people have given you better replies than I could. But just out of courtesy...
> Sorry but this just reads as elitism to me, "unless you're prepared to climb trad and take a risk you aren't really skilled or rock climbing properly."
I don't know why this quote is in parenthesis. And I don't know what relevance it has for me. I didn't make it. Obviously if you've made it up (I hope you haven't) and ascribed it to me, you're guilty of sophistry. So we wouldn't be off to a good start.
> Sport climbing is just as legit as trad, and it will only become more popular over time as more people see it in the olympics and go to gyms and then want to get onto rock. Someone who never does trad, and never wants to do trad, and only does sport, is a legitimate rock climber and is legitimate to want there to be more sport routes, and for existing routes to be retrobolted, and they aren't "losing the joy in climbing" or anything ridiculous like that.
Interesting that you regard your views as legitimate and (one of) mine as ridiculous. Clearly anybody can say that their view is legitimate and someone else's view is ridiculous. It doesn't really get us too far.
> I fully accept that I am here on UKTrad flying the flag for bolted routes and that my view will not be popular, but I do think that someone needs to say in this thread "actually Sport is awesome and in places retrobolting British trad routes would actually be a Good Thing"
You're not on UKTrad - you're on UKClimbing. Most of us do trad and sport and other stuff (e.g. hillwalking, DWS). As a matter of interest, could you tell us how long you've been climbing and roughly how many sport and trad routes you've done? Might be useful to learn how your views have evolved from your experience.
The problem with climbing is this: it's dangerous. Sport climbers get killed on sport routes. Sport climbers get killed trying to access the crag. People have been killed at climbing walls. If you want to increase your chances of surviving at climbing, you need to develop skills. Someone can say that a skilled person is elitist. Guess what? The rock doesn't care. Given the chance, like Covid, it'll kill you.
I have friends who do virtually no trad. To me, they're climbers, just the same. I have friends who really just like toproping. To me, they're climbers, just the same. But every last one of them knows that climbing is dangerous - because I've drummed it into them. And every last one of them knows that if they're being unsafe or lax or complacent and I'm around, they'll get a bollocking. (Naturally this applies to me equally.) Better a bollocking than an early grave.
Mick