UKH

French and Font grades. Which one uses lowercase f?

I've just been told I've got it the wrong way round but can't get my head around it since that's how I've seen it for years. Anyone know what it was originally and why?

Font grades are: f7A

French grades are: F7a

No idea why.

Ignore the capital 'F', its gets misused too often (although it should be lowercase for font).

Best to take notice of the capital a, b, c. 

Uppercase ABC for bouldering.

Lowercase abc for sport climbing. 

No, always include the 'F' or 'f' otherwise it is a British technical grade.

I meant ignore the discrepancy between lowercase and Uppercase. 

'f' not needed for sport routes, we don't use it in the books. If it were a UK tech grade it would have an adjectival section too: f6C = bouldering, 6c = sport, E4 6c = trad,

Chris

It used to be lower case for Font grades, just checked Jacky Godoffe pink guide, 7&8 guides. I don’t why this got mis used/changed. 

Just by ignorance of detail. I know boulderers who don't know the difference.

Surely a minor point anyway - if it's a sport route assume it's I assume French grade, if boulder font?

Of course this all goes to shit on Southern sandstone where the tech grade isn't preceded by the adjectival grade and some of the routes would be short enough to qualify as boulder problems!?! 

I still see trad tech grades used on their own in books.

Some sport climber is going to be sorely disappointed when they go to climb this route:

https://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/crags/avon_gorge_main_area-31/route_two-...

and also see the UKC use a capital F for bouldering in the logbooks!

The devil is in the detail.

My mistake, I intended to type 'F' and it is too late to edit now, sorry for the added layer of confusion

Chris

Not any more. Thanks for pointing out the error.

Alan

This confused the hell out of me when My brother in law who has only climbed SS asked me what the "5c means next to the 6A" in the guide book. 

I was like dont you mean 5B for 5 Bolts.

No wait its all top rope...

Checked the book when we arrived and was like what the heck is this system about lol It just seemed it was whatever it was in french -1 

Then much later a much much older group of locals were telling some newer climbers the grades to which I realised were the tech grades and made them seem easier than they really were lol 

My pleasure

Thanks everyone. It's very clear that it is:

Font = "f"

French = "F"

Lots of other good points above. The main confusion occurs with traverses and boulder linkups etc. when they can be given sport and/or bouldering grades. My mate still thinks I'm wrong... There's a fiver riding on this

Like others above, for me the distinguishing feature is whether the letter after the number is capitalised. Capitals for a boulder grade. I usually don't even both with the f/F at all. It's not necessary as without an adjectival grade it is obvious you aren't talking about a UK tech grade.

Edit: unless you are climbing on southern sandstone of course

God dont get me started on bloody boulderers who suddenly have to give traverses sport grades. Ive seen some even switch from Font to V grades between problems. Too many drugs I reckon.

E4 6c, must be a right sandbag?

6C = bouldering, 6c = sport, E4 6c = trad,

No f is ever needed anywhere, whether it is lowercase or uppercase. It adds no useful information and only adds confusion due to the frequency of misuse.