UKH

Mountaineering Scotland have released a statement regarding the bolts on main cliff at Diabaig that were placed for the abseil descent. At the bottom is a link to a survey where you can give your views on the matter. 

https://www.mountaineering.scot/news/bolting-controversy-at-diabaig

Hopefully if there is wide participation in their survey a clear consensus will emerge on the issue. 

(Previous discussion can be found here: https://www.ukhillwalking.com/forums/rocktalk/diabaig_bolted_ab_points-694130?...)

Quite a crap survey in its current form.

The people who are upset about the bolting will go chop the bolts if they haven't already done so. Can't see the survey helping much. 

Such a controversial topic. Climbing in Europe on bolts or even just bolted belays and abseil stations is great. Makes a lot of sense to me. 

It can be great, it can make a lot of sense. Whether or not that is the case at a particular crag is something to be debated BEFORE the bolts are placed, and a clear consensus has emerged.

If bolts are placed by individuals, without proper debate and a consensus, at a crag where the current ethic is no bolting, then a discussion of whether the bolts are a good idea or not is irrelevant, as far as I'm concerned - the bolts should be removed, that being the only effective way to discourage that sort of action in future. 

.... in my opinion, that is

We've all got one  

Bet they've been chopped already. I'd take a bolted ab over tat most days. These poor bolts won't of even had a chance to corrode from the sea air. 

I'm off to buy more tat. 

I agree .

Also if the discussion had occurred prior, the bolts if agreed could have been fit for purpose , of the best materials and competency of placement.

I'd suggest the consultation poll would be more meaningful if it asked people to give their name and asked whether they'd climbed at Diabaig.

I have - about 25 years ago - and my first reaction would be "what do you need any sort of ab station for in the first place: just walk down you lazy b*stards (kids these days mutter mutter etc)"

Possible counter-arguments to which would be: walking damages the hillside by erosion, abbing down a solid chunk of the hardest gneiss in the world damages nothing. I which case I could see an argument for there being an ab station, and it might as well be a good 'un.

Or on the third hand: walking down is perfeectly ok but people are too lazy to do it. In which case I could see an argument for making the ab station as dangerous as possible because it's cheaper than shooting the lazy b*stards as they deserve.

Without going over old ground, see previous thread.

I'm interested to know if you've ever climbed at Diabaig and appreciated its wilderness surroundings? It's not Auchinstarry. You would not have to buy more tat if the equalised static rope and replaced anchors from last April were not removed.

Nobody 'buys' tat anyway!

Yes, a poor survey. I think names should have been required and comments made public.

Hehe yes I've climbed there once or twice...

Thanks for pointing out that it's not a quarry in Kilsyth. We pro bolters are easily confused. 

People buy cord to use as tat. Not everybody uses their old cut up rope you know  

I guess we voted differently on the above survey. 

There's no point in me arguing the case not to have bolts a Diabaig with you here. It's already been done on the previous thread and you describe yourself as a pro-bolter anyway. I'm just intrigued that you also say you enjoy new routes on remote Scottish Islands. I would have thought having convenience intrusive bolted lower offs in place would contradict an adventurous and wilderness experience that you enjoy.

Irony alert switched off??

See above.

Mick

Interestingly it appears you can vote multiple times too. 

Not sure a self selecting online poll is the way to change bolt policy. 

No worse than ignoring the current policy and bolting regardless...