Comfy ledge syndrome

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You're on a ledge, or at least somewhere you could hang on all day. It looks goey up there. You try a move, come back, chalk up, feel some other holds, put another bit of gear in. Up a move, feel a hold, back down. Chalk. Feel around again. Chalk. Good look around. Chalk up. Up a move, down again. Another bit of gear. Chalk. "Watch me". Up one move, down again. Chalk, gear....

Which routes have the hardest ledges to leave?

I'm going to open with Boot Hill and Prana, but I'm sure I'll think of more.

 dinodinosaur 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

This sounds like me on The Butcher (E3 5c) 

Crucible (E1 5b) is the one that really sticks in my mind as a bad one. 

I bet you could stand on Suicide Wall (E1 5c) for a while, could brew up on that ledge if you wanted

 Rick Graham 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

The ledge on Prana is not comfy at all if you catch it on the way down !

(Not personal experience )

 tehmarks 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

My ex once made herself fully at home on the ledge of that long Severe at Bamford. Bamford Wall? Reckon I could have probably tied her off to a convenient ground feature and nipped down the hill for a pint without her noticing.

2
 veteye 07 Feb 2021
In reply to tehmarks:

Hence why she's your ex

1
 mrphilipoldham 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Took me an absolute age to leave the ledge on Fringe Benefit (E1 5b).

 deacondeacon 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder: the stride onto Wuthering at Stanage can take an absolute eternity to commit to.

Standing in the pocket of Three Pebble Slab persuading yourself to get going is a good one too. 

All the best routes have 'em 🙂

 Shani 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

> You're on a ledge, or at least somewhere you could hang on all day. It looks goey up there. You try a move, come back, chalk up, feel some other holds, put another bit of gear in. Up a move, feel a hold, back down. Chalk. Feel around again. Chalk. Good look around. Chalk up. Up a move, down again. Another bit of gear. Chalk. "Watch me". Up one move, down again. Chalk, gear....

> Which routes have the hardest ledges to leave?

> I'm going to open with Boot Hill and Prana, but I'm sure I'll think of more.

The Sloth. All. F*cking. Day.

 mark s 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Painted Rumour (E6 6a) at the roaches springs to my mind. The physical crux is done getting to the cave. You get in there and can look around and then you realise the situation you are in. Then the mental crux of leaving the cave to the run out headwall 

Brilliant route though

 Dave Cundy 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

I vote for the ledge 10 from the top of Freedom Direct (E1 5b) at Wintour's Leap.

It's difficult to stand in perfect balance, the holds are a bit crap and the gear in front of you is worse. But you're only 10 ft from the top.....

My mate Christian spent 45 minutes there a few years ago.  I was on phorographer duty at the top and I have a lovely series of pictures of him dithering, as it went from Sunset to darkness. And finally he actually made a proper committed attempt.  And succeeded  )   fafftastic!

 Ottawa 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Jealous Pensioner (E4 5c)

Maybe it was just a bad day? or bad enough that I haven't been back to actually leave it (upwards)...

 The Pylon King 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

In my case it is called the ground. A very big comfy ledge.

Removed User 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

The Rainbow looks hard to leave

 Jon Stewart 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

> I'm going to open with Boot Hill and Prana, but I'm sure I'll think of more.

F*cking Boot Hill. I stood on that ledge for ages, never got fully off it, and eventually just scampered back down. It was that day I started saying "does anyone want to go out ledge-standing" instead of "anyone want to go climbing". 

The week before I did exactly the same thing on Parallel Piped (E3 5c)

 Shani 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Jon Stewart:

> F*cking Boot Hill. I stood on that ledge for ages, never got fully off it, and eventually just scampered back down. It was that day I started saying "does anyone want to go out ledge-standing" instead of "anyone want to go climbing". 

As i recall you can 'tall-it' straight up from the ledge (tricky), or step immediately left in to layback hell/fun.

 WaterMonkey 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Shani:

> The Sloth. All. F*cking. Day.

At the other end of the scale but the same ledge:

When I first started climbing, only about 6 years ago, me and a mate were doing Pedestal route, which starts the same as the sloth, uses the ledge but then traverses out left and up holly bush crack.

My mate lead the first pitch and belayed me up to the ledge. I struggled with the start and by the time I got to the ledge I had lost any confidence I had.

We sat on the ledge for a while, enjoying the view. I really didn’t want to continue! I even asked him if he fancied leading the second pitch too. In the end, with the help of him farting, I crawled across him and began the traverse. I think I was too high on the wall and didn’t get a single bit of gear in, I was shitting myself until I finally got to holly bush crack and managed to get some gear in. 
As my mate was finally leaving the ledge and doing the traverse he said even he was shitting himself due to my lack of gear and the massive swing he’d take if he fell!

In reply to Shani:

Took me about 15 minutes to talk myself into a dyno to a 3 finger crimp. I'm 6' but on that occasion I don't feel like it changed the odds.

 henwardian 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

> Which routes have the hardest ledges to leave?

Any of the ones where there is sod all gear visible and you know fine well that a fall from anywhere in the next 10m is going to result in a second (and much less comfortable) visit to said ledge!

 Jon Stewart 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Shani:

I convinced myself I could tall-it but couldn't quite; didn't like the layback up the left, and just fannied around forever.

 Enty 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

I had 3 belayers on Bloody Sunday over a period of about an hour. True story.

E

 Prof. Outdoors 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Chair Ladder

Sunshine, clear blue skies, calm sea, great lass Sarah as a climbing friend belaying me on South Face Direct but I found that leaving the second stance took me ages.

Same grade (4c) as the rest of the climb but there is such a good hold you don't want to let go and you can see the bulges waiting for you above.

Great climbing week. Diocese, Ochre Slab 1, Little Brown Jug, Dexter, Africa Route, Anvil Chorus.............

Post edited at 21:59
 Jon Stewart 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Enty:

> I had 3 belayers on Bloody Sunday over a period of about an hour. True story.

An hour's quite good time on a Pembroke pitch at one's limit. I've belayed for 3h on Minotaur, from low tide to leap nearly full (me on the block/ledge thing I think). 

 deepsoup 07 Feb 2021
In reply to deacondeacon:

> the stride onto Wuthering at Stanage can take an absolute eternity to commit to.

I did that quite quickly (with the security of the cheeky sling high up the chimney, so on a toprope really), then had a prolonged bout of more conventional ledgeitis standing with my toes in the slot struggling to commit to the last couple of moves to the top of the slab.

 kevin stephens 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Ledge below the top pitch

UKC Logbook - 'Lubyanka' (ukclimbing.com)

Failed on this twice due to fear

 Alkis 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Suspense (E2 5c)

I spent a very embarrassing amount of time on its various ledges.

Post edited at 22:18
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Years ago I spent a fair while eyeing up the first move on Kinky Boots at Baggy Point. Standing on a nice big ledge with your belayer behind you. The route starts on the other side of a narrow zawn and the sea was proper booming beneath. Just put your hands up and fall forwards. Stuck in my head was someone’s logbook comment along the lines of “just about reached at 5ft 7.” I’m 5ft 6. I was stood there a very very long time, arms stretched above head, swaying back and forth trying to convince my body to let gravity take it. I think in the end I only went because a gust of wind took me by surprise. 

In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

I didn't want to leave the ledge at the optional first belay on Gormenghast this summer.  When i finally did commit to what turned out to be extremely run out moves up left I realised my apprehension was well founded.  Terrifying!

 alan moore 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

There must be a few who have camped out on the ledge on Idwal's Suicide Wall.

I sat out a shower there and waited for the rock to dry. Wasnt particularly keen to continue as the holds seemed tiny and the last good runner was the little spike that we had belated on at the start.

Wobbled up it in the end of course.

 Liam P 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Superdirect - Milestone Buttress

 Andy Clarke 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

San Melas (E3 5c) on the Roaches Skyline. The ledge is capacious. You can wonder to and fro along it enjoying the fine prospect of the Staffordshire plain. It soon becomes clear that once you stand up on the first thin smear above it you won't be coming back. Time to commit...

Post edited at 23:07
 P_Ran 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Basically any nice ledge or good gear before a crux move!  My worst so far was Raven Gully (S), Low Man at Haytor - a ledge that feels as safe as the ground.  I made it all the way up but nearly tired myself out making the same move over and over and then backing down.

 Andy Clarke 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

As a variation on this theme, what about the horizontal shuffle, where a move or two into a traverse, nerve and strength falter and you quickly scuttle back before reaching the point of no return? Get breath back, shake out, stride forth... and scuttle back. Repeat ad lib. A good example to be had on the hand traverse pitch of Nexus (E1 5b) on the Mot. I bet this is a lot more fallen off than the big slab money pitch.

 Jon Stewart 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Andy Clarke:

> As a variation on this theme, what about the horizontal shuffle, where a move or two into a traverse, nerve and strength falter and you quickly scuttle back before reaching the point of no return? Get breath back, shake out, stride forth... and scuttle back. Repeat ad lib. A good example to be had on the hand traverse pitch of Nexus (E1 5b) on the Mot. I bet this is a lot more fallen off than the big slab money pitch.

I've belayed a couple of variations on this theme on Pleasure Dome (E3 5c).

 Jon Stewart 07 Feb 2021
In reply to kevin stephens:

'Lubyanka' (ukclimbing.com)

> Failed on this twice due to fear

Only failed once, but I packed it in when I went up to find the target holds after the traverse on the last pitch were loose. The lass who I handed the lead to went on to lead an E7 a week later, and she's obviously way stronger than I am, but even she wasn't having a good time in the rattly, gearless choss. It's not a nice route IMO.

 Robert Durran 07 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Right Wall

 GDes 08 Feb 2021

London wall. I was up And down like a up yo, putting in about 60 bomber runners, then retreating. Finally lobbed the remains of my rack to the floor adn got on with it 

 ianstevens 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Removed UserBilberry:

It's actually pretty slopey and unpleasant, far nicer to move on to some more positive, if smaller holds.

 Nic 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

As a slight twist on the topic, I recall halfway through some hard stuff on Scarlet Runner

Scarlet Runner (E4 5c)

there is the beginning of a "ledge" which runs off leftwards, getting wider as it goes. I can remember looking at it enviously, but realising that if I succumbed to the temptation to scuttle off along it, I'd never get back...

 Trangia 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Making the bold move left round the corner from the grassy ledge onto the airy traverse which leads to the bottom of Teufel's Crack on Munich Climb knowing that your second's belay is not the best and with the grim warning in the guide book going through your mind that "good ropework is required. There have been too many fatalities here" This was before the days of modern protection.

 gravy 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

I recall the belay ledge above the guano on FANTAN B being nice in the sun with the pitch above look slightly steep, intimidating and very worrying given the state of the rock so far and the previous gauno experience (but ultimately very easy and secure).

I'll contrast this with the next belay - also massive comfy - (you could camp there, awesome view - I could sit there all week).  The next pitch appears to be a gentle stroll off so we took a long sit in the afternoon sun. 

However the next pitch turns out to be terrifyingly insecure damp very steep grass loosely rooted in loose shale where I got one piece of gear in at 2m height and nothing else until I tied into a loose boulder at the full rope length 60m later. I sat on the boulder to weight it down.

I recall wishing I'd brought the walkie talkies because it would be safer to instruct my belayer to untie in case I slipped in which case I might at least enjoy the ride down.

Awesome day out.

 Stroppy 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Traveller in Time (E4 6a)

Literally one move from the ledge and its over, you can even caress the sloping ledge you need to mantle onto, but it feels improbable and you just don't want to commit.

I spent a long time on that ledge and failed at the move twice (once passing my belayer on his way up) before succeeding.

Post edited at 11:00
1
 Will Hunt 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

I've not done it but I think Pebble Mill (E5 6b) is (in)famous for this. I'm sure I've heard more than one story of would-be ascensionists phoning their mate in Sheffield to come up with a rope.

 Stroppy 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Stroppy:

Also at several points on Interrogation (E3 6a), before the tricky traverse and again before the mantle.

 Bulls Crack 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

In the same mould: Grand Alliance? I  remember scuttling feeling very committed after  I'd left it!

 Dave Todd 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

I never managed to leave the ledge (upwards!) on

Now or Never (E1 5b)

...the downclimb of shame...

 TheGeneralist 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Liam P:

Exactly. Was scanning the thread to see if this got a mention.  Certainly the biggest ledge of all the options so far.

 Cobra_Head 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Dave Todd:

> I never managed to leave the ledge (upwards!) on

> ...the downclimb of shame...


I know what you mean, I thought I'd done the hard bit, to get around the corner!

I what quite a bit of "up and downing" before I decided to just go, luckily it was a "now" for me.

 Route Adjuster 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Bloodhound (E2 5b), just before the awkward thin move onto the sloping ledge and the start of the high traverse.  Don't think I've ever done it twice the same way.

 Lankyman 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Shani:

> The Sloth. All. F*cking. Day.

Yes. I think I had several grades in hand for this and slunk away shamed with Whillans' sneering ghost mocking my sticky boots and fancy cams.

 Chris H 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Prof. Outdoors:

Ditto Anvil Chorus  ....and LBJ. In fact the ledge below the cruxes is even more tempting as you can walk off! 

 Chris H 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Drag racing underground Blacknor, Portland has a cave entrance 2/3 of the way up which you could crawl into and descend to the base whilst inside the cliff - rope drag mighty be an issue ...

 Shani 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Lankyman:

I only got on it in Autumn last year and despite having flashed up to E2 6a onsight over Summer and a LOT of training indoors (I'm heavy but as strong as I've ever been), i must have been camped out beneath that roof for 15 minutes! I knew it was all in my head - unlike the tears of fear and snot that were leaving my head as i wibbled outwards on those flakes.

Psychologically hards than Quietus for me (technically though, The Sloth is pretty steady). And yes, the Ghosts of Climbing Past were muttering in to their real ales in disgust at my behaviour given the advantages of chalk, sticky rubber, camming devices, wire gates, 8.5mm ropes, wall-trained strength, YouTube/UKC beta etc... 

 jezzah 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

One of my most memorable is on Main Wall https://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/crags/cyrn_las_gyrn_las-695/main_wall-28... Where it wasn't the difficulty of leaving one of the many ledges but the fact that we were in a stunning position high in the Llanberis pass (having chained a series of routes up from Dinas Mot earlier in the day) watching the sun set in the distance. Beautiful.

Post edited at 14:38
 springfall2008 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Yes I've done this a few times on Klute (HVS 5a) and on Cardiac (also Wyndcliff)

Post edited at 14:38
 Offwidth 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Sweatyman at Shooters is a good one, albeit reach dependent.

In reply to TheGeneralist:

> Exactly. Was scanning the thread to see if this got a mention.  Certainly the biggest ledge of all the options so far.

It is, but that's leaving the belay so not quite in the same spirit.
Surprised nobody's said Commander Energy or Five Finger Exercise yet...

Post edited at 15:16
 Jon Stewart 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Dave Todd:

> I never managed to leave the ledge (upwards!) on

I reckon the crux of that is about 6a.

 Philb1950 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Last move on Edge lane at Millstone. Mess up the step up from the foot ledge and it’s a groundfall. My friend fell off from lower on Green death next door and it very nearly was. Ended his climbing career.

 Philb1950 08 Feb 2021
In reply to mark s:

Yes but you’re by a good runner with 2 options off.

 Cobra_Head 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Jon Stewart:

> I reckon the crux of that is about 6a.


Where's the crux? It was my only E1 lead, I found get around the nose hard but well protected, IIRC the rest, once I'd committed, it was OK. I'm having trouble remembering it to be honest.

 Matt Podd 08 Feb 2021
In reply to gravy:

FANTAN B, a memorable route! I thought getting down to the base of it was the worst bit.

A friend of mine was doing an early repeat of it and they were all belayed on one of the ledges, when it parted company and went into the sea. Luckily their belay was sound.

 john arran 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Jon Stewart:

I've been on this solo maybe up to a dozen times or more over the years. Around half of those times I've found it straightforward and sailed up it. Most of the other half I've pondered and puzzled as to how the fcuk to get off the ledge in any sort of balance and control without feeling like I was going to barndoor straight off into oblivion.

Never did work out what I was trying or doing differently.

 colinakmc 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

What about the big ledge below the crux of Crowberry Direct. So comfy it should have a fridge full of beer on it... then 2 steps later your whimpering on sloping friction holds in your big boots. 

 flaneur 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

I've visited the "all too comfortable" shelf half way up Froggat's Great Slab several times, tightened my laces, cleaned my shoes, scratched the back of my neck, adjusted my helmet, and contemplated where to the next step should take me. Up? Right? ...or back the way I've come?

 Hooo 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Dave Cundy:

Yep, that takes me back. Watching my partner faffing for ages placing a peanut blindly round the corner, coming back for a rest, then going round and placing another and another. Then eventually commiting... And promptly taking his first trad fall.

Then I fell off it on second. More than once.

 Iain Thow 08 Feb 2021
In reply to colinakmc:

First time I went there, soloing, I did the aforementioned two steps and it started to rain. Not knowing that I'd done the hard bit I reversed them, which was distinctly scary. After a bit of time sitting on the ledge going "now what", I escaped via some big holds up right (Greig's Ledge, I later found out) to join the Original Route to the top.

 oldie 08 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

OP mentions chalk lots of times times......so how about ledge below top pitch of Skeleton Ridge, Isle of Wight, shortly before its hardest move followed by the easy a cheval section?

 JimR 08 Feb 2021
In reply to colinakmc:

That was my first ever route on my first ever day on a mountain, life has never been the same since!

 Dave Garnett 09 Feb 2021
In reply to Longsufferingropeholder:

Towards the top of the pitch I’m starting in the photo is a scary run-out that gets progressively harder until finally a decent hold arrives, big enough to stand relatively comfortably, to start with, one foot at a time.  To the left, out of reach, is a bolt.  The last one is long out of sight over a bulge below. I hopped from one foot to the other whimpering until the pain became unbearable until I finally plucked up courage to smear across with a draw in my teeth...

Maybe it’s been rebolted now, I was going off a Rémy brothers topo of their 6(neu) and the bolting was pretty minimalist. 

I was so scared I had to get my new girlfriend to lead the next pitch.  Which she did, which was an indication of things to come!

Post edited at 00:56


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