UKH

I always enjoyed photography, mostly landscapes, buildings and climbing. I've had more time recently to play about with it more and I'm starting to think my line up of cameras is less than ideal but not sure what to do about it.

I have an Olympus Tough TG4 as my playing in the water and climbing camera. It also takes great macro photos so that is definitely a keeper. The question is what to do about the other two.

I have had a Panasonic LX100 Mk 1 since soon after they came out and I really like that. As well as the convenient size, I like the control layout, level of manual control. Along with general photography, I've enjoyed using it for long exposures with an ND filter and time lapse. The only downside is lack of reach with the 70mm max zoom.

Over lockdown I have been playing about with an old Canon EOS 40D. I have three lenses for that: the kit 50mm, a Sigma DL 70-300 f4-5.6 and a Sigma APO 170-500 f5-6.3. I've especially enjoyed using the long zoom lens to take wildlife photos and would like to do more of that but the long lens is soft at larger apertures whilst the 40D has a max ISO of only 1600 and a relatively small pixel count so it is hard to avoid long exposures and cropping down doesn't work well. It also creeps under its own weight when pointing down so, if you are carrying it on a neck strap, the lens hood just about hits your knees. The 40D and lenses are just too bulky and heavy to carry just in case so I miss good potential photos.

Ideally I'd like to swap to a compact mirrorless system but that looks expensive and I don't think I'd get much for the old Canon or Sigma kit, or even my beloved LX100. My other idea was to get a Canon 7D II in place of the 40D for the much higher ISO and pixel count and keep everything else - but that does nothing to reduce the camera count or the bulk and awkwardness of the Canon-Sigma combination. My wife also has a Canon 550D so there is a bit of synergy in sharing lenses. 

What do people advise, assuming a budget to change of up to £1000?

I've recently shifted from an Olympus M10, which I didn't get on with, to a Canon M6 mk II, which I really like.  It's small, light and, because I'm familiar with Canon, much easier for me to use.  Takes good pictures too.

Whilst the M6 mk II might be stretching your budget, other cameras in the M range may be worth looking at.  The small and light form factor works and while M-mount lenses won't be compatible with what you have, there are plenty of adaptors around so that you can use the lenses you've already got.

It'd be worth you having a look at them and what you might get new or used for your money.  At worst you'll be better informed and you might just find they're what you want.

T.

You should be able to get a good 2nd hand mirrorless with a few quality lenses. 
 

if you’re into video at all (you didn’t mention this, so omit this if yer not). GH4 can be had for peanuts. 
 

if video is not s priority, I’d look into Oly PEN series or perhaps a Fuji. Oly PEN (and other MFT) have the option for numerous lenses and option to use non native lenses with adapters. Fuji is from What I can tell even nicer, but native lens collection is small and spendy (but really good).

note that for landscapes and architecture you can easily live with full manual vintage lenses. Depending on the kind of climbing stuff, autofocus etc. Could prove useful. 

With that budget you could get a 2ndhand Fuji XT-2 and a couple of lenses or a lens plus possibly a smart adapter for some of your existing lenses, which is what I'd do in your shoes.

The 7D2 is a terrific camera but leans towards sports and wildlife.

Agree with what's being said about second hand kit, £1000 is a substantial budget. MPB and Wex are two that should fulfill your every need, be it DSLR, mirrorless and glass. Wonderful companies to deal with - others are available.

Thanks very much for the replies. That gives me a few things to look at. 

The only thing that puts me off the M6 II (apart from price) is the lack of a viewfinder. I suppose I should have said at the start but my preferences are to have a built in eyepiece viewfinder, back button focus and as many as possible of aperture, shutter speed, ISO and exposure comp with dial controls rather than having to go through the menus. I'll have a look at the other M-series though.

I do like the look of the GH4. Although video isn't a priority, I guess there would be some carry over of what I'm used to with the LX100. Also I have a suitable flash for TTL that I thnk would still be useable with that.

The Fuji XT-2 also looks good. I like the dedicated dials. It is actually wanting to get into wildlife photography with long lenses that is the main driver for thinking of changing from what I already have - would the 7D2 be the best way to go with that as a priority?

My wife was also looking for a small-wildlife (birds) setup. She tried a Sigma 150-600 on my old Canon 550d and declared "No way am I carrying that around!". Eventually settled on a Lumix G9 (micro 4/3) with the 100-400mm lens - half the weight, half the size, phenomenally good image stabilisation (in body + in lens) and 60 picture/second pre-burst mode (i.e., it starts taking pictures before you press the shutter release). For big wildlife in low light (e.g., bears), I'll still opt for my Canon 6d + 80-200 f2.8, but otherwise the Lumix system is fantastic.

I'd also recommend MPB for second hand - that's where my Canon stuff came from.

ah yeah.

if video is not a priority, the the G7/G9 might be a valid option (more photo focused).

if small form factor is nice, the perhaps GX8 should be looked into.

You could also consider Sony, the A6xxxx range second hand would also fit within your price bracket with enough dosh to buy a lens or two.

I have the Oly TG-4..best small camera out there IMHO...

To go bigger I actually stayed with Oly as their picture colour is different than other brands & liked it....so I went big time into their top M4/3s kit...

Now with all the ruckus over Oly selling to JIP & Panasonic maybe switching to APS-C... I'm not bothered as there are mases of second hand cameras etc still around & will continue to be so...plus out of warranty service is still available from good independent repairers. Their kit does the job & for £1,108 you could get a very nice set up!

OM-D E-M1 MKII used £659

https://www.ffordes.com/p/SH-18-029229/olympus-omd/om-d-e-m1-ii-body-only

12-40mm F2.8 Pro used £449

https://www.ffordes.com/p/SH-18-031797/micro-43rds/12-40mm-f28-mzuiko

If wildlife is a priority then the 7D2 wins. Have a google for 7D2 wildlife reviews. There are some long lenses available for it which will be within your budget too, just.
Another vote for MPB here, great company to deal with.

I have an X-T2 and use the XF 100-400 with it for wildlife. It is great lens with superb image stabilistation but is neither cheap nor light!

That tends to be the case... add in the word Full Frame and cheap plus light are not even in the same galaxy.

Thanks all for the advice. That gives me a good (but not very short) shortlist. 

I had some time out yesterday with my current set up which reinforced how much I don't like the long Sigma lens. I think the eventual choice is going to be driven by a replacement long telephoto as much as by the camera.

M4/3s remember is half the size so when I stated 12-40mm that was the actual focal length.....however in 35mm size it has the same angle of view as a 24-80mm lens.....one of the reasons I swapped over...my 40-150mm f2,8..is nice & small...

For a 1000 £ budget, Canon 7d2 might not include a warranty, and perhaps no lens included.

But the camera is wonderful fast in focusing and picture processing, It's very worthy to buy a camera body.

I was thinking second hand. Wex have had some good 7d2s for around £700 for body only plus £800 for a decent used EF 100-400mm f4.5-5.6 L IS USM Lens (which has just sold) less whatever I can get for my existing Canon and Sigma kit. Probably still a bit over my budget. I'll have to weigh up the different options - none of them look cheap if I want a similar effective reach as my current set up.

I missed that bit..so upto (Sigma APO 170-500 f5-6.3). ..in M4/3rds thats 250mm..

To keep the price down to within budget...brand new Oly 70-300mm f4.8-6.7..£419

https://www.ffordes.com/p/11013118454561/micro-43rds/75-300mm-f48-67-ed-ii-...

 I have a  Canon  EF 100-400mm f4.5-5.6 L IS USM Lens

It is certainly a lot sharper than my Sigma 'Bigma' 50-500mm was, but it does need a touch of stopping down at the long end - at f/8 its pretty good. I think this is typical of the model.

Anyway, I barely use it so you could have it for £700 if you want.

Thanks very much, I'll bear that in mind as a good option. It might take me a while though to get my head round the different options though, let alone come to a decision!

Bit of a digression. 

Your TG-4 - how is it at focusing in "medium" light? Mine seems, weirdly, to have given up even trying! I've had it 4 years, bought second hand, had some fun with it but gradually used it less and less, in favour of my dSLR and CSC. I revived it recently and found its focusing seemed to really rely on having a lot of light, it surprised me as I've used in fairly low light before (like at a concert), sure the pics were noisy at high ISO but at least it FOCUSED. 

I installed the latest update last night and it didn't change anything. 
Just fishing around for ideas....
For reference, other cameras easily focus in the same light that makes the TG-4 fail. 

My really unhelpful answer is I wish I knew.

I have a 7d for when I am willing to take a proper camera out with me (with a choice between a paparazzi lens or general purpose plus wide angle).

A s90 for when I am out and about and dont want to be weighed down but still want some options. This is the one I want to replace.

Then a TG6 (hint its best to double check everything is locked on a tg5 before white water paddling) for water stuff. I did want it/its tg5 predecessor to replace the s90 but its UI and general flexibility is limiting.

Not offering specific advice as my APS DSLR Pentax system may not be what you need, but I’m very pleased with mine and it’s very compact for a DSLR, but to second recommend WEX used sales, I’ve built up a great collection of Pentax Limited lenses at a good price.

i also have a TG4 mainly for sea kayaking for which it’s ideal, however a big limitation for climbing is its lack of dynamic range due to small sensor and greedy Pixel count. The latest picture in my Gallery is a good example of this

UP till February this year I was a huge GH4 fanboy and I only stopped being a fanboy when I broke it playing in extreme weather conditions way beyond its capabilities.

If you did go down the GH4 route then you may find that you like taking video. Even today this six year old model out performs many modern cameras with its features.

I was going to scream GH4 but I've just discovered that the G80 has In Body Image Stabilisation while the GH4 does not. For me this was never a problem because I had a gimbal to smooth out footage. Then I got the GH5, which has IBIS, and my gimbal has never been taken out of the box since. GH4+Gimbal not worth the cost when G80 has IBIS

Let's not forget about glass. Micro Four Thirds make some of the sharpest lenses around. Some reasonably priced and some spendy.

I do not regret ignoring Full Frame cameras when I was in the market for a new camera. I wanted a smaller camera, than Full Frame with lighter glass. Admittedly Full Frame mirrorless cameras were spendy four or five years ago, however mirrorless Full Frame cameras still need big Full Frame glass which is bigger and more spendy than Micro Four Thirds equivalents.

But what about image quality with MFT compared to Full Frame?

Surely you can't blow the image up without the image falling apart?

Right now, I'm looking at a print of my pooch, printed at one meter across. I virtually have to put my nose up against the image to see any dots. That would be true except for the fact that my eyes can't focus that close to a subject any more.

Why am I no longer a GH4 Fanboy?

That's easy, my insurance covered for a sexy new GH5.

If you are in the market for a Panasonic MFT camera then may I suggest:

Panasonic G80 or G85 £375 used (One is UK the other USA)

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/15bEjDzWqOvMFnXpdjzZUkU81cN5nkiED?us...

Panasonic G9 £800 used (its almost as good as the GH5 but cheaper)

https://www.mpb.com/en-uk/used-equipment/used-photo-and-video/used-mirrorle...

Panasonic GH4 £450 used

https://www.mpb.com/en-uk/used-equipment/used-photo-and-video/used-mirrorle...

With your £1,000 budget then you simply can't go wrong with the G80 or G85 with a lens or two. Its a Weather Sealed camera.

youtube.com/watch?v=fGRMOXCE9TQ&

youtube.com/watch?v=3DNsaSaEKMc&

youtube.com/watch?v=yDt4YMcrsuU&

I have that lens and I have to say that I use it as much as my 12-35. However it blows Nathan's budget out of the water all by itself.

https://www.mpb.com/en-uk/used-equipment/used-photo-and-video/used-lenses/u...

Here's a local thief.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/the1lemming/49970635217/in/dateposted-public/

A micro four thirds zoom lens at 100-400mm will give an equivalent Full Frame range of 200-800mm

You seen the price of a Nikon 800mm lens?

May be a bit over budget

https://www.wexphotovideo.com/nikon-800mm-f56e-fl-ed-vr-lens-1535644/

Some of these big high-end lenses really are astonishingly expensive. I recently had to buy a car for the first time in many years (previously had a company car) and immediately had a bit of buyer's remorse, that I could have bought a good camper van instead. Now I see I could almost have bought a Nikon 800mm lens instead! 

I'm only looking at cropped sensor cameras in any case. I'm well aware that 6-800mm on a full frame would never be viable on either lens cost or the weight I'm willing to carry. My current Sigma 170-500 and APS-C Canon also gives 800mm equivalent but it is frustration at the lack of sharpness that is driving me wanting to change. Your photo of the thieving squirrel has far better sharpness and definition than I can get, even with carefully set up test shots on a tripod in bright light.

I had narrowed it down to two options, both trading a bit of maximum reach for (I hope) better image quality: Canon 7d II with the original EF 100-400mm f4.5-5.6 L IS USM Lens (and share my wife's Canon lenses) or Panasonic G9 with a 100-300mm f4.0-5.6 II LUMIX G Vario Lens plus another lens with shorter focal length or perhaps just carry my LX-100 when I want that option. Hopefull selling my existing Canon 40d and Sigma lenses should bring the cost to change close to my £1000 budget. Sadly the EF 100-400mm f4.5-5.6 L IS II USM or even the Panasonic-Leica 100-400 are probably a step too far. 

Mr Squirrel was taken hand-held from 15 meters away, down a darkened part of the garden. I also broke the shutter rule of double the focal length and still got pin-sharp focus. This is testament to the IBIS of the camera and the IBIS of the lens. Even though the Lumix 100-400m is made by Panasonic it is also licensed/approved by Leica.

Personally, I'd spend the lion's share of your budget on this bad-boy lens if wildlife is your thing. Its also a Weather Sealed lens. I'm reliably informed that a lot of weather happens in wildlife locations.

That sound's like a cracking combo, however the 100-300mm is not weather sealed. I like the thought of knowing I can go out to play in all weathers with my camera+lens and not worry when it starts spitting.

From what I have just researched today, a G80 or GX80 are as good as a GH4, however they have added In Body Image Stabilisation. The G9 also has IBIS.

I had no idea what this camera was till I googled it. This looks like a great little camera with a MFT sensor inside it. And all the reviews are very favourable about it

I do like my LX-100 - it is not too big to carry just in case on holiday or for climbing but still good fun to use with a lot of control and I've been pleased with the results. The only downside is the lack of zoom.

Thanks very much for all this, really appreciate you taking the time. I'm just looking at G80 reviews now and thinking of taking your advice to spend the money on the lens - a G80 and the Panasonic-Leica 100-400 would be OK on price where the G9 would be a stretch to justify.

And the G80 is weather sealed

Just reading the specs and the G80 does not have a low pass filter. I never really knew what this meant because I had nothing to compare with.

My GH4 had a low pass filter and I loved the images and video it took. Then I got the GH5 minus the low pass filter. Even though the sensor has more pixels the image quality was far sharper and clearer.

The G80 is ticking a lot of boxes:

No low pass filter

IBIS

Weather Sealed

Magnesium body

Fully articulated flippy screen.

EDIT
This review with G80 vs G9 obviously says the G9 is superior, however the reviewer says the G9 is an incremental upgrade. Unless you pixel peep, then a G80 + 100-400mm lens sound's like a killer combo for your wildlife shots.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yPFSq2z9JM&t=16s