UKH

I visited China for the first time last month, to teach at the University in Wuhan for two weeks.  Then I had a week or so sightseeing in Beijing and Shanghai.  I found it to be an interesting trip, which undermined many of my preconceptions.  There are clearly significant issues in relation to politics and human rights, but many of the people I met (generally young people) seemed to be very happy.  I still find myself trying to come to terms with the places I visited and the people I met - and I'm still not sure how I feel about that place.

It is however very photogenic, and while my amateur pictures don't really do it justice, I thought I'd share some snaps of Beijing here...

https://dynamicstasis.blog/2019/12/03/beijing-a-photo-essay/

In reply to J Brown:

Thanks for sharing. Very cool. Looks like Beijing hasn't changed as much  as I thought since I visited in 2007. An incredible place. 

In reply to bouldery bits:

Funny of you to say that (no offence meant!). I remember from my visit in 2007-2008 how many of the Hutongs were being torn down each week - with the remaining families playing Xiangqi and eating in the street right next to the rubble and waiting bulldozers where their neighbours used to live just recently - being replaced by tourist trap replicas and "historical" facades along the main streets. That time was the height of the modernisation and changes. Thankfully, few years later they probably realised that they should probably not tear down all the historical sites, I guess. I wonder how much would I recognise today...

In reply to J Brown:

I wasn't so keen on Shanghai probably as I didn't really explore, I was in shock at the size, pollution, roads, traffic but Beijing I loved.  I had a wonderful time overall and loved the food.  I also was there on Academic business and very much enjoyed and got on with all the people I met.

Kind regards

Toby

In reply to bouldery bits:

Thanks bb. I didn’t have time to comprehensively explore the city (4 days, with one at the Wall at Jinshanling), but it certainly seemed to me that Beijing was more mature as a city - which had developed over a longer period and was more coherent than the bomber placed I visited. Shanghai (4days) seems to be (re)developing very quickly.

And Wuhan, where I was teaching at the architecture school was growing exponentially. I’d never heard of that city before the joint degree programme was established with Dundee - it’s a former small-scale centre of light industries, and now 10-12 million people live there. The pace of development there, and in the surrounding areas, is staggering.

In reply to J Brown:

Some good photos there.

I travel regularly to Beijing and have done for 20+ years. The change in that time is colossal. I can only agree with Frank R in that it is a shadow of its former self (historically). The hutongs have all but gone to be replaced with concrete blocks of various shapes and sizes. Given the population of 21 million it has surprising few interesting places to visit. The summer palace and forbidden city are interesting but absolutely mobbed with people. 

One of my favourite places is the wall at Jinshaling as photographed by the op. You can escape some of the crowds for a few km's and get a real feel for Chinese  history.

In reply to Toby_W:

The academic staff I met (as well as students) in Wuhan told me that most people tended to like either Beijing or Shanghai - that those cities are very different to each other.  I'm not sure which I preferred, given I only had a few days in each place.  I know I'd like to go back to both cities at some point.  I'll sort out my photos from Shanghai and Wuhan at some point.

In reply to Le Sapeur:

I think I was fortunate to be at the Summer Palace first thing in the morning, so had lots of time wandering round before it was busy - certainly seemed crowded as we were leaving. The Forbidden City was very busy indeed, which rather overwhelmed me to begin with, although I did find some quieter areas. On balance both of those experiences remained positive though - truly memorable days.

But seeing the Wall at Jinshanling was extraordinary. It was unbelievably quiet. Apparently this was due to it being right at the end of the visitor season, and being slightly further from Beijing than some other locations. I was in a small group (me and one couple) - our guide took them a couple of shortcuts as they were tired, while I walked on - frequently I was just on my own. That felt amazing... walking along the Great Wall of China with (occasionally, not all the time) nobody else in sight. It was a wonderful day.

In reply to J Brown:

I've been to the Jinshanling section a couple of times and both have been quiet. Like you I think I was there in October which is a great month to visit. Cool weather and more likely to have clear enough air to get views.

If you go back try the Huanghuacheng section of the wall. Easy to reach from Beijing and almost deserted.

There are also a few independent guys who will take you to a rural starting point, provide you with a map and then off you go on your own for the day. These sections will end at a transport hub so you can take a bus back to Beijing.

In reply to J Brown:

I guess you would not like it in Xinjiang though...

Genocide and culturicide being what it is...

In reply to Frank R.:

North King Street massacre, Ireland, 1916.

Jallianwala Bagh massacre (Amritsar), India, 1919.

Gujranwala massacre, India, 1919. 

Croke Park massacre, Ireland, 1920.

Qissa Khwani Bazaar massacre, Peshawar, 1930. 

al-Bassa massacre, Palestine, 1938. 

Athens massacre, Greece, 1944. 

Batang Kali massacre, Malaysia, 1948.

Let's not pretend us Brits are free from atrocities. Doesn't diminish what the Chinese are doing now, but people, glass houses etc. 

In reply to Le Sapeur:

I think those are all rather small beer - you need to look at things like famines in India during WW2 for a comparator.

In reply to Dr.S at work:

And arguably the potato famine in Ireland.

In reply to Le Sapeur:

Yep. Great example of whataboutism. The Soviet "And you are lynching Negroes" comes to mind. Classical fallacy...

But I do apologise - sorry to hijack the OP's pretty innocent photo thread...

The problem is what we do (or don't) about the Uyghurs' genocide/culturicide - turn a blind eye just because the rest of China is so beautiful (which it is)? Or bring it up even in unrelated discussions about different Chinese topics like this quite peaceful thread about few photos from Beijing and elsewhere? Would it be better to discuss elsewhere in a dedicated thread or does any mention of China warrant a scrutiny of their Human Rights issues? 

In reply to J Brown:

I think you underestimate your talent! you do indeed have some great photos of one of the least photogenic places on the planet.  A soulless, dystopian mass of polluted concrete is how i would describe Beijing.  I really hope I never have to go back!

I feel anyone who praises the beauty of any Chinese city is either blind, mental or it's just the first city they have ever visited. 

sorry i shouldn't have commented, but i really hate beijing!

In reply to climbercool:

I'm guessing you have never been to Fenghuang?

In reply to climbercool:

So... thanks, I'm pleased you liked some of the photographs.  I'd tend to disagree on whether Beijing was photogenic, but each to their own obviously.  It might just be to do with my background, but I enjoyed the 'urbanity' of the place, likewise in Shanghai.  A great many of the places and streets I wandered through in those cities (and in Wuhan) were rather bleak at first glance - but I still found that interesting to some extent.  

I think in Beijing I also enjoyed the blend of wonderful ancient architecture and modern / contemporary (albeit not very good in many instances) architecture.

Thanks for taking a look.  JB

In reply to Le Sapeur Just checked some photos and Fenghuang does look pretty special!  Ill have to go!

P