UKH

... and what's more, seem to be proud of the fact?

Half the thrust of Brexit seemed to be that we were being imposed upon; people are 'victims' because they choose to gamble or shop too much; as soon as a relationship goes south one party (or both) become 'victims',

There are victims in this world, who genuinely are in bad places they had no way of avoiding. Let's stop using the same word for a Syrian orphan in a Syrian hospital from a dumped 19 year old - or middle class couples being charged for the use of email.

In reply to Rob Exile Ward:

Words aren't binary and there are degrees of which someone can be hard done by. I find adjectives are useful for this.

In reply to Rob Exile Ward:

Are you blaming the victims? For shame!

In reply to Rob Exile Ward:

I feel like I am a victim this morning as I have run out of Columbian  coffee, having to make do with Ethiopian !

In reply to Rob Exile Ward:

I think it’s being replaced with ‘survivors’. 

In reply to Yanis Nayu:

What get's me is all these Mail and Express readers who seem to relish their victimhood... 'I was a victims of a scam' ... No you weren't you were greedy and ignorant and got caught out. 'We're victims of a postcode lottery'. No you're not, you just happen to live somewhere where other people's priorities aren't quite the same as yours.

The crusader on the Express masthead really needs a hanky to be snuffling into.

In reply to Rob Exile Ward:

Why would you read either of those?!

In reply to Rob Exile Ward:

When it's to do with medical care which can be lifesaving sometimes, being 'a victim of a post code lottery' if being denied certain care seems like it might be apt to me, if one isn't able to plan ahead to live within a certain area because a certain kind of medical treatment will be needed?

In reply to marsbar:

Know your enemy. And I never pay for copies.

In reply to Rob Exile Ward: A friend has liked The Sun on facebook with the same philosophy. 

In reply to Timmd:

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=you+tube+the+very+rich+want+us+to+die&...

In reply to Rob Exile Ward:

I simply dread the victimhood the Brexiters will spout once (as seems quite likely) the Brexit project goes pear-shaped.

In reply to Timmd:

I see your point but as far as free healthcare goes, simply living in the U.K. means you’ve already won that particular lottery.

In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

I miss Mr Carlin....  https://www.bing.com/videos/search?view=detail&mid=9CFD28DE53DBDC750783...

and.....corporations    https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=&&view=detail&mid=711078E7...

In reply to paul mitchell:

Yes, yes, yes.

In reply to Stichtplate:

Of course, but that's not an argument against not having the post code lottery situation, things would never improve in society if that kind of logic was used for everything.

Say, if domestic violence deaths aren't as high in the UK as in some other countries, that doesn't make the rate we have something to be comfortable with, or rates of male suicide, whatever it is.

The aim for improvement is what's kept us moving forwards...

In reply to Timmd:

No, but getting back to the point of the thread, it is an argument against categorising yourself as a 'victim' when 99% of people are in a worse situation as far as free healthcare goes.

In reply to Stichtplate: As far as the person in the correct postcode for the needed treatment, one is comparatively worse off though, if unable to access it, which is understandably what somebody in the wrong postcode is thinking about. 

I'm not saying I don't see what you mean, I'm saying that the people in the wrong postcodes aren't 'wrong' to see themselves as a victim of circumstances - because in that aspect they are. Both perspectives are true and exist along side one another.

In reply to Timmd:

And I'm saying that if you can stand back from the parochial bubble and see things in Global terms, characterising yourself as a victim of a healthcare postcode lottery is rather like a Ferrari driver claiming to be hard done by because his next door neighbour has a Bugatti on the drive.

In reply to Rob Exile Ward:

Why take responsibility for your actions when you can claim that society forced you to act that way. 

In reply to Timmd:

Victim is far too strong and loaded a word for variations in healthcare provision. 

In reply to Stichtplate:

It seems like we're going to have to agree to disagree.  

When it comes to personal health, I don't think it's either parochial or at all like a having a nice car and wanting a nicer one, because one's health is so fundamental to how well one lives.

In reply to Timmd:

Your local NHS trust has a limited amount of cash to spend and very specific populations to service. If the area you live in happens to be a retirement hotspot and consequently the local trust has chosen to allocate more cash to hip replacements at the cost of multiple rounds of IVF, then the childless couple could well see themselves as 'victims'.

As the OP has pointed out, it seems the people are increasingly prone to viewing themselves as victims. It's more realistic to note that 99% of the worlds population would have zero chance of free treatment, and people might be better served thanking their lucky stars for all the free health care that they do have access to, rather than concentrating very few things that are denied them.

In reply to Rob Exile Ward:

This is a wider problem than just 'victim'.

we increasingly use more extreme words.

"today the x admitted y"

instead of

"today x stated y"

is my favourite bugbear - if we and the media adopted less OTT language then things would appear moderately better.

In reply to MG:

When it comes to differences in the rates of cancer survival, I think it's a fairly close to accurate word, if pondering one's mortality.

There's no sense in which I'm applying blame to the NHS, though, which seems to be a possible misinterpretation...

In reply to Dr.S at work:

There was a paper in Science a few years back sort of along these lines, which makes for interesting reading. Basically, the premise is that as events start to become less frequent, people broaden their definitions so they perceive these events to keep happening.

"As it turns out, abstract concepts can creep, too. For example, in 1960, Webster’s dictionary defined “aggression” as “an unprovoked attack or invasion,” but today that concept can include behaviors such as making insufficient eye contact or asking people where they are from. Many other concepts, such as abuse, bullying, mental disorder, trauma, addiction, and prejudice, have expanded of late as well. Some take these expansions as signs of political correctness and others as signs of social awakening. We take no position on whether these expansions are good or bad. Rather, we seek to understand what makes them happen. Why do concepts creep?"

https://science.sciencemag.org/content/360/6396/1465