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Basil 25 Mar 2020
Eric9Points 25 Mar 2020
In reply to Basil:

Yes, Ashleigh along with Tim Martin and the CEOs of Britannia Hotels and Cineworld seem to be in fierce competition to win Shit of the Year 2020.

We won't forget.

1
Angry old man 25 Mar 2020
In reply to Eric9Points:

Absolutely agree. Should all hang their heads In shame.

Ashley is an absolute shit

1
Rob Parsons 25 Mar 2020
In reply to Eric9Points:

> Yes, Ashleigh along with Tim Martin and the CEOs of Britannia Hotels and Cineworld seem to be in fierce competition to win Shit of the Year 2020.

What's your specific criticism of Martin? In another thread, you incorrectly claimed that he sacked his staff as a result of the current enforced closures - and you didn't politely withdraw the claim when your mistake was pointed out.

It seems important to stick to the facts here.

2
Dax H 25 Mar 2020
In reply to Basil:

Unfortunately there are a lot of greedy shits out there. 

A company that I deal with that is in my game, has the same amount of people as me and give or take the same turnover has told their people that if they go off sick they will only get statutory sick, each service engineer needs to bill £3.5k per day and they will only close if the government forces it and if that happens they will only pay the 80% the government will rebate.

My mate that works there is pouring oil on the fire telling all their lads that 4 weeks ago I told my guys I could afford 4 months full pay if it came to it, that I will now cover the extra 20% and I sent everyone home for their own protection on Monday and we will only be carrying out essential work for the utility, pharma and food sectors.

It's looking like the majority of people there will be bailing on the company once this is over and setting up their own organisation doing the same thing (I may have offered to help them with spares and equipment until they are established enough to stand alone) 

Blue Straggler 25 Mar 2020
In reply to Eric9Points:

What have Cineworld done and how does it compare to other chains like Odeon and Vue? Sounds like I missed something 

Eric9Points 25 Mar 2020
In reply to Rob Parsons:

Well Blue Straggler seemed to correct me so I didn't see much point in posting again.

Anyway, Martin had told his staff they wouldn't be paid until he got money from the government. It also turns out he told all his suppliers the same. This evening he has now relented and will be paying his staff, not sure about his suppliers.

Eric9Points 25 Mar 2020
In reply to Blue Straggler:

They paid off some of their staff, not sure how many.

In Edinburgh they had a dispute last year which got nasty. I think some staff tried to join a union and were sacked.

Don't know how any of the other chains have behaved.

wilkie14c 25 Mar 2020
In reply to Basil:

Spotted today

Morrisons diesel- 1.09 L

A50 services at Uttoxeter - 149.9 L

Blue Straggler 26 Mar 2020
In reply to wilkie14c:

Presumably actually 1.499/l though 

1
Dax H 26 Mar 2020
In reply to Eric9Points:

>  It also turns out he told all his suppliers the same. 

Hopefully his suppliers will start legal proceedings ASAP and very publicly and when this is over tell him to do one with regard to further supply. 

Hat Dude 26 Mar 2020
In reply to Angry old man:

> Ashley is an absolute shit

He just keeps plumbing the depths!

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52040579

Rob Parsons 26 Mar 2020
In reply to Eric9Points:

> Anyway, Martin had told his staff they wouldn't be paid until he got money from the government.

I realise that Martin is a hate figure for many on account of his stance on Brexit. However, I dislike bandwagons and whipping boys.

On bridging the gap until the furlough payments commence, I have no idea what the financial/cash-flow position of the Wetherspoon's company would be. But neither do I know the same in respect of the multitude of other companies in the UK. What seems important in this matter is that the UK government acts to implement the payments as quickly as possible. If that is done, the problem doesn't exist in the first place. Of course, meanwhile, I expect any company or institution to act with compassion and do the best it can.

5
NBR 26 Mar 2020
In reply to Rob Parsons:

Martin's comments follow the govt' advice to avoid pubs (pre shutting), where not helpful but encouraged behaviour that could do  harm. That is enough to put him on the shitlist.

BnB 26 Mar 2020
In reply to Basil:

By contrast UKC Remainer's favourite James Dyson has not only shown some "wartime spirit" by rushing to address the shortage of ventilators:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-52043767

But also what the article doesn't state  is that he is building a further 5,000 at his own expense for distribution to needy authorities around the globe (source: FT today). All good PR of course but not without financial burden.

Rob Parsons 26 Mar 2020
In reply to NBR:

> Martin's comments follow the govt' advice to avoid pubs (pre shutting), where not helpful but encouraged behaviour that could do  harm.

I agree.

neilh 26 Mar 2020
In reply to BnB:

It will probably be more efficient/cost effective to make 15,000 than 10,000 as well.

Rob Parsons 26 Mar 2020
In reply to BnB:

> By contrast UKC Remainer's favourite James Dyson has not only shown some "wartime spirit" by rushing to address the shortage of ventilators:

The curiosity with that is why, at this time, one would choose to design (and then test, certify etc.) a brand new machine. Why not rather offer capacity to increase production of already-certified existing machines, or the parts for same?

It will be interesting to see whether these machines are available for use here before the crisis hits; I hope they are.

Post edited at 10:11
mondite 26 Mar 2020
In reply to BnB:

> All good PR of course but not without financial burden.

So not tax deductible then?

neilh 26 Mar 2020
In reply to Rob Parsons:

Because there may be limits on existing production that take longer to solve.If you can put something together from say available off the shelf components, that may be quicker than ramping up exisiting production.There is alot in that Dyson photo that looks simple to put together.

Its an excercise in lean manufacturing at its best.

So you strip out the wasteful add ons and keep it really simple.

BnB 26 Mar 2020
In reply to mondite:

> So not tax deductible then?

What are you trying to say? That he has absorbed 100% of the cost of what is basically humanitarian aid in order to claim back 19% in some secret scheme to rob the taxpayer? Firstly, it makes no business sense at all - why not avoid incurring the cost at all. Secondly, the UK is receiving 1,000 (20%) of those free ventilators.

I may have misapprehended your intention, but, at first glance, your comment comes across as, not just poorly informed, but also rather spiteful.

Rob Parsons 26 Mar 2020
In reply to neilh:

> Its an excercise in lean manufacturing at its best.

I hope it works.

mondite 26 Mar 2020
In reply to BnB:

> What are you trying to say? That he has absorbed 100% of the cost of what is basically humanitarian aid in order to claim back 19% in some secret scheme to rob the taxpayer? Firstly, it makes no business sense at all - why not avoid incurring the cost at all.

It makes lots of good business sense. Pages of free PR. Look at how much has been dedicated to him rather than all the other teams who are working on producing ventilators.

BnB 26 Mar 2020
In reply to mondite:

> It makes lots of good business sense. Pages of free PR. Look at how much has been dedicated to him rather than all the other teams who are working on producing ventilators.

Exactly, so it has nothing to do with tax avoidance as you implied.

Stuart (aka brt) 26 Mar 2020
In reply to mondite:

> It makes lots of good business sense. Pages of free PR. Look at how much has been dedicated to him rather than all the other teams who are working on producing ventilators.

Exactly this. Seems like some of the heavy lifting was already being done. 

https://www.gtech.co.uk/ventilators

neilh 26 Mar 2020
In reply to Rob Parsons:

Hope is not a word in these things. You design the product  so you know it works and eliminate the failure risk so to speak.

1
mondite 26 Mar 2020
In reply to BnB:

> Exactly, so it has nothing to do with tax avoidance as you implied.

Well aside from the deductible.I would be more impressed if, as per most of the others working to the same goal, it wasnt accompanied by a carefully designed PR piece with lots of nice photos.

neilh 26 Mar 2020
In reply to mondite:

Does it really matter if the product works?That is the impressive part.

Stuart (aka brt) 26 Mar 2020
In reply to neilh:

> Does it really matter if the product works?That is the impressive part.

It is impressive. BnB took a swipe at Remainers though (playful or not). They perhaps should have realised there would be push back. 

Rob Parsons 26 Mar 2020
In reply to neilh:

> Hope is not a word in these things. You design the product  so you know it works and eliminate the failure risk so to speak.


What I meant was that I hope that the strategy works. I have no doubt that Dyson (and others) can successfully design and build ventilators. The question is whether such can be produced (and both tested and certified for public health use) before the potential crisis hits: time is very short.

As I say: I hope it works.

neilh 26 Mar 2020
In reply to Rob Parsons:

Things like certification can be done incredibily quickly when you have to by stripping back to bare essentials that will work for most cases.You just need to scrap and rewrite the guidelines.

And yes there will be issues. But the broad strategy will be there.

This is all a diversion away from the manufacturing of PPE, now that is a different complexity all together. Anybody in the supply chain for that, must be as busy .

BnB 26 Mar 2020
In reply to Stuart (aka brt):

> It is impressive. BnB took a swipe at Remainers though (playful or not). They perhaps should have realised there would be push back. 

No I didn't, I simply pointed out that he is a bete-noir of the UKC Remainer community, which is a fact. Though he has been the subject of multiple negative threads, there was no intention to rub anyone's nose in it and I don't see how you could read that into my comment unless you were remarkably sensitive*. I thought this was a nice opportunity to consider another facet of his activities.

* which perhaps we all are in these anxious times

Post edited at 12:37
BnB 26 Mar 2020
In reply to Rob Parsons:

> What I meant was that I hope that the strategy works. I have no doubt that Dyson (and others) can successfully design and build ventilators. The question is whether such can be produced (and both tested and certified for public health use) before the potential crisis hits: time is very short.

The aim of most governments is to control the first wave of infection in an orderly fashion to allow time for the manufacture of much larger supplies of medical equipment to handle a potentially broader second wave. Whether these supplies are intended for the first or second wave I couldn't tell you.

Blue Straggler 26 Mar 2020
In reply to Eric9Points:

> They paid off some of their staff, not sure how many.

> In Edinburgh they had a dispute last year which got nasty. I think some staff tried to join a union and were sacked.

> Don't know how any of the other chains have behaved.

Thanks, so the Edinburgh thing last year wasn't coronavirus related, and they have paid off some staff now. How does this lump them in with Tim Martin and Mike Ashley (this is not an argumentative question btw)

Post edited at 12:49
Stuart (aka brt) 26 Mar 2020
In reply to BnB:

> No I didn't, I simply pointed out that he is a bete-noir of the UKC Remainer community, which is a fact. Though he has been the subject of multiple negative threads, there was no intention to rub anyone's nose in it and I don't see how you could read that into my comment unless you were remarkably sensitive*. I thought this was a nice opportunity to consider another facet of his activities.

> * which perhaps we all are in these anxious times

Hmm I think you saw an open goal and thought you'd have a shot, and why not. You say that's not what you meant. Fair do's. If it helps I am chuckling ☺.

Dyson is doing good work and we will need the results of the effort. 


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