How do you dry your clothes

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 montyjohn 05 Oct 2022

We don't have a tumble dryer, and even if we did, I would probably pull the fuse out with the energy prices at the moment.

We have a heated drying rack, but it's not great. Takes about 12 hours to work (possibly longer if full), and at 300W that's not a great option to be on all day, plus it required cracking the window open to avoid mold, which is fine in October, but that will cost a fortune in January to have a window cracked open for so long.

In the winter we can put essentials on a radiator, crack window open for that short period and they are done in about 2 hours, but again, not convinced that's a great option this year.

I keep reading about not putting clothes on a radiator, but I don't get why a rack is any better. it still puts moisture into the room. benefit of a radiator is you can vent the room for that short period.

Our heating hasn't really come on yet (we have it set to 19 degrees), so we have a problem were the house is cool (circa 19 degrees), so clothes take about 3 days to dry and we don't have any radiators on to dry things quickly.

Similar story if we hang them outside, takes a few days, and they just get damp again overnight and then you're lucky to get enough days in a row without rain.

We don't have an airing cupboard either.

What are other people doing?

4
 J Whittaker 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Dehumidifier.

 Robert Durran 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Just hang them over doors or whatever until they are dry. 

1
 wercat 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Mk 1 Washing line

In reply to J Whittaker:

> Dehumidifier.

They take quite a bit of power: ~500W

2
 Hooo 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Heat pump tumble dryer. I was anti tumble dryers for years due to the energy waste, but I reckon with a modern heat pump unit it uses less energy than your heated rack or leaving the window when the heating is on. Not to mention dealing with the dampness and mould if you dry indoors.

1
 FactorXXX 05 Oct 2022
In reply to captain paranoia:

> > Dehumidifier.
> They take quite a bit of power: ~500W

Domestic ones are about half that.

 Rick Graham 05 Oct 2022
In reply to wercat:

> Mk 1 Washing line

We use a Mk 7 when it's dry outside. ( on seventh home now)

Otherwise a ceiling rack in the kitchen/ diner Spun clothes are well dry after 24 hours or so. No damp problems , central heating rarely on , just wood burner in another room in the winter evenings. 

It's a newish house so insulated to 2019 spec, tried freestanding drying racks at first inside but could not stand the clutter.

 Sealwife 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Either the washing line if it’s not raining, or a clothes horse sat on the upstairs landing.  Usually a combination of the two.

Ive never had a tumble drier and have used the above method for years, including one spell when I had two kids in cloth nappies.

 daWalt 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

I seriously recommend getting a decent domestic dehumidifier, cheapy wee ones are a waste of time, industrial are a bit overkil. I regret not getting one years ago.

you know already that you can heat your wet clothes as much as you like, but this water just ends up in the air inside the house. if you remove this water, not only will your clothes dry faster, the house is warmer (you're not wasting heat keeping a good few liters of water up to temperature).

the dehumidifier is a lot less efficient when it's cool, but the thing blasts a good flow of air through it and this helps blow-dry things at the same time.

(n.b. clean and clear the air filter(s) regularly - dry lint is a potential fire hazard)

obvs, I use the line in the back garden whenever it's in working condition. it is free after all.

In reply to captain paranoia:

My current dehumidifier is rated at 200w (or 250w if set on high); it has a humidistat with can be user altered and so clicks compressor on and off depending on humidity in room.  It does run the fan all the time it is switched on so I just switch off when not using for drying.

To OP been using dehumidifiers for 35 years now (on my third) when I can’t hang stuff outside for natural drying. The fan circulates air in the small room I use it in and the heat given off raises the temp as it’s drying the air and this helps a quick drying of clothes. I can dry most items overnight (8 hours) except for heavy cotton, sheets and such like.

 MG 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Clothes rack some where - outside, backroom, bedroom etc. Tumble dryers seem mad to me, before you even consider the CO2 angle.

 Jenny C 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Line outside and careful weather check before deciding if it's a washing day. In winter sightly damp clothing is finished off on an airer in the bathroom (window always open fire ventilation) and then transferred to airing cupboard.

Only use radiators under duress as the extra humidity means the house feels colder, so you need more heating.

I admit being a household of just two has its advantages, as we usually only do 1 or 2 loads per week. Unless it's ideal drying conditions I don't do a second wash until the first is dry, can just about dry a full load on the bathroom airer if forced to by bad weather.

 Hooo 05 Oct 2022
In reply to Climbing Pieman:

I suspect this drying system uses as much energy as my dryer.

1
 wintertree 05 Oct 2022
In reply to Hooo:

> I suspect this drying system uses as much energy as my dryer.

I suspect possibly more…. 

 

1
 Tom F Harding 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

I've got a EcoAir DD1 dehumidifier that can be switched between 300 and 500w. It has mainly been used to keep a very damp gear storage cellar usable but I've tried to dry cloths with it as well. My electricity bills went up noticeably and considerably from when I started using it. It also seemed to take ages to actually dry my cloths, even if I put it in a small space with the cloths surrounding it.

My washing machine broke a few months later so I bought a condenser washer dryer. It works out at just below £2 per load. It doesn't make my basement flat damp and I just chuck cloths in and they come out ready to put away a few hours later.  I just make sure I only put a full load in.

 Neil Williams 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

A rack which conveniently fits into an otherwise useful corner of the lounge, which even more conveniently has a large radiator in it.  Works well, and the room is big enough not to get damp.

In summer, outside.

I don't see taking 3 days to dry as a problem per-se, I have enough clothes for that.

 Neil Williams 05 Oct 2022
In reply to Tom F Harding:

I have a washer-dryer but hate the dryer, it creases things something rotten and slightly shrinks anything made of nylon (and has only one temperature setting, before anyone says to reduce that).

 PaulJepson 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Another vote for dehumidifier. Put your clothes on a rack in the bathroom/utility room and close the door with it in. They will be dry in a couple of hours. You can get a very good one with a 3+ year warranty for about £300. 

Also a very useful tool for the house air in general. Dry air feels warmer so if you have it set at 50% then itll not come on much but you wont feel like you need to use the heating as often. 

 artif 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

A quick google suggests that an 8kg  heat pump dryer will dry a load using 0.5 to 1.6kWh of electric

A 300W rack running for 12 hours = 3.6KWh

Even a standard tumble dryer wouldn't be much worse than that.

Post edited at 20:00
 MG 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

> Our heating hasn't really come on yet (we have it set to 19 degrees), so we have a problem were the house is cool (circa 19 degrees), so clothes take about 3 days to dry and we don't have any radiators on to dry things quickly.

Put the rack outside for an hour or two in the breeze?

 CantClimbTom 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Lots of coat hangers, and all over the banisters. Seems to work very well as they have air all round them, but it's limited capacity 

 David Riley 05 Oct 2022
In reply to Hooo:

I bought a condenser dryer 15 years ago. I generally only use it for polyester type items, holding little water, at low temperature.  It's very good for this.  The cotton stuff goes on the line.

Now they are called heat pump dryers, which to me is the same thing.  Are they better, or just a different name ?

4
 Billhook 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

> Similar story if we hang them outside, takes a few days, and they just get damp again overnight and then you're lucky to get enough days in a row without rain.

We don't have  a tumble dryer.  We do however manage quite well using free energy from the sun and wind - a washing line.  Its not unusual to have clothes dry in just a few hours and we almost never leave anything on the line overnight.  I don't know where you live but we live on the NE coast and have lived in the SW coast of Eire.  Rarely had any problems drying stuff outside.  

It costs almost nothing to run.  Two washing lines and a new packet of pegs in the last 12 years.

Like you and others if we have to bring stuff inside, then in a room with the window ajar and hung over the back of a clothes horse or chairs.

2
 nathan79 05 Oct 2022
In reply to PaulJepson:

And another vote here. Bought one when living in a damp flat to stop it getting more damp from washing. 

As you say it also makes a difference with the place feeling warmer(and being warmer with the heat the dehumidifier kicks out).

In a bigger, drier house now but the dehumidifier still a feature.

 FactorXXX 05 Oct 2022
In reply to David Riley:

> I bought a condenser dryer 15 years ago. I generally only use it for polyester type items, holding little water, at low temperature.  It's very good for this.  The cotton stuff goes on the line.
> Now they are called heat pump dryers, which to me is the same thing.  Are they better, or just a different name ?

Your condenser dryer will basically be using an electric bar fire to provide the heat source and then run the resultant hot/wet air through colder air sourced from the room that the dryer is in.  The hot/wet air hits the colder environment and condenses into water which is collected.
A Heat Pump dryer still uses the same principle of running the hot/wet air through a colder source of air except that it uses the same technology as a fridge in that it compresses a gas to provide the heat source and then expands the same gas to provide the cold area to turn the hot/wet air into water.

 elliot.baker 05 Oct 2022
In reply to Billhook:

Problem with washing lines is time… I think it takes a good 15 minutes to put a full load on a washing line, and if the forecast is showers at any point in the day - you need to be ready and around to take it all off the line or it gets wet again.

also - what magical pegs are you buying that last years!!? Half the time I use a peg it pops into its two component pieces 

8
 Hooo 05 Oct 2022
In reply to David Riley:

Completely different thing. A condenser dryer uses heat to dry the clothes, then throws the heat away. A heat pump dryer is basically a dehumidifier in a box. It's far more efficient, like a quarter to half of the energy consumption. And it doesn't shrink your clothes like a heat dryer.

Post edited at 20:50
 Dave Todd 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Had one of these for about 15 years;

https://www.dunelm.com/product/3-tier-heated-airer-1000197361

Important tip: put the clothes on then throw an old, cotton sheet over the top of it all.  Heats up nicely, dries clothes much more quickly but lets enough air flow around to remove the moisture and prevent excessive heart build up.

 Jenny C 05 Oct 2022
In reply to elliot.baker:

> also - what magical pegs are you buying that last years!!? Half the time I use a peg it pops into its two component pieces 

I still regularly use sprung wooden pegs that I inherited from my granny 20+ years ago. Plastic ones are useless and degrade/break really quickly.

 David Riley 05 Oct 2022
In reply to FactorXXX:

I assumed my condenser dryer had a freon, or whatever, fridge type cooling system when I bought it and had never considered otherwise.  I'll take the back off tomorrow and check.  It certainly does a remarkable job collecting water if it's passive.  But I would change to a new heatpump one if it was better.

1
 FactorXXX 05 Oct 2022
In reply to David Riley:

> I assumed my condenser dryer had a freon, or whatever, fridge type cooling system when I bought it and had never considered otherwise.  I'll take the back off tomorrow and check.  It certainly does a remarkable job collecting water if it's passive.  But I would change to a new heatpump one if it was better.

The freon, or its very modern equivalent, will be what's in a heat pump dryer.
Heat pumps use less energy to dry, but usually take longer and cost more to buy.
It's probably a balancing act which one is cheaper depending on how often you use it against initial outlay of buying a condenser/heat pump.

In reply to Hooo:

> I suspect this drying system uses as much energy as my dryer.

Could do, but I don’t know as I don’t have a heat pump drier nor know much about them. My dehumidifier is cheaper than using the tumble drier I’ve got anyway.

It is very rare I would use a tumble drier for clothes drying so I can’t justify considering buying a heat pump drier which seems to cost 4+ times my dehumidifier to buy. I’ll stick to my dehumidifier meantime and use the savings to pay for the electric 😉!

For me a dehumidifier is a useful applicance when I need to use it. Got to bear in mind the compressor can be off for up to half the time it is switched on and the fan only can’t use much electric.

 Hooo 05 Oct 2022
In reply to David Riley:

I very much doubt that you bought something advertised as a condenser dryer and got one with a heat pump in it. 

A condenser dryer just means it condenses the water out and vents into the room, so you don't need a hole in the wall like the really old dryers did. I've never owned one so I'm not certain of this, but I seem to recall it uses cold water from the mains to cool the condenser. So not only does it use lots of electricity, it uses water too. 

What someone else said - cover your heated clothes airer with a sheet and then it's way more effective (assuming you're like me and don't have access to a washing line, dryer OR radiators!). 

 FactorXXX 05 Oct 2022
In reply to Hooo:

> A condenser dryer just means it condenses the water out and vents into the room, so you don't need a hole in the wall like the really old dryers did. I've never owned one so I'm not certain of this, but I seem to recall it uses cold water from the mains to cool the condenser. So not only does it use lots of electricity, it uses water too. 

A condenser dryer collects the water in a bottle that is periodically emptied by the user.
If it vented straight into the room, then you would be effectively depositing all of the removed water from the load all around the room which might cause a bit of a damp problem...
The condenser unit temperature differential is achieved by directing normal room air through it via a fan - no water involved.
 

 girlymonkey 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

I dry them as far as possible on the line, and if it's the sort of day where they stay a bit damp, then I finish them off with the dehumidifier inside or just hung on racks, depending on how warm it is. 

We sleep with windows open every single night, no matter what the weather, so dampness indoors isn't really something I need to think about 

1
 mrphilipoldham 05 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Washing line if it’s dry and windy, on the rack between our beams above the fire if it’s not. 

 Slackboot 05 Oct 2022
In reply to Rick Graham:

I second the ceiling rack or 'Aunt Sally' as they used to be called. We have two. If we can't hang clothes outside we put them on those to dry.

Just checked online if the term 'Aunt Sally' is still used. I get the impression it isn't used widely now. Instead terms like 'Pulley Maid', 'Sheilagh Maid' and 'Ceiling Pulley' seem to be used among others. Makes me wonder why we  have always called it an Aunt Sally?

Post edited at 23:25
 wintertree 05 Oct 2022
In reply to FactorXXX:

> A condenser dryer collects the water in a bottle that is periodically emptied by the user.

With a heat pump based condensing dryer you want to send that condensate down a drain - it is colder than ambient with the heat taken out of it going in to the dryer and thence the room.  If you keep the cold water in a bottle it just re-absorbs the heat.  If you send it down the drain, it doesn’t, and you heat your house with the heat recovered by cooling the water that was in the clothes.  

Thinking holistically about the net flows of energy reveals how complex it is to decide what is better between a dehumidifier and a heat pump condensing dryer.  It varies massively between if you run a hot, air tight house or a cold, well ventilated house.

Post edited at 23:36
 CantClimbTom 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

In summer a condensing dryer (one that doesn't vent the air outside) is a terrible energy drain on energy 

In Winter, *if* you are using the heating, all that dryer energy heats your house, so in my case it's more electricity and less gas.

I'm happy to use a tumble dryer in the cold months, from the logic above that it costs no energy I wouldn't have used already.

Just make sure you don't dry stuff that shouldn't be in it and shrinks, for me that's usually about 60% dryer and 40% hanging stuff up. Very useful for a family of 5 with endless supply of general clothing, school uniforms and PE kit to wash

 mike123 06 Oct 2022
In reply to CantClimbTom: I would prefer to dry all the washing on the line as it feels and smells fresher and I quiet enjoy pegging washing out , but  I’m likewise “ afflicted “ with three kids and it would  be a full time job keeping everyone supplied with clean clothes . It has to be a day when it no rain is guaranteed  otherwise it’s a waste of time . Next best thing is on two large racks in the same room as the wood burner when it’s on, which is all the time In the winter .Two loads of wet washing will be bone  dry over night . After that it’s the tumble  drier , which I would prefer not to use at all but there is only so much time in the day . Everything is about balance . I have , on the odd occasion  , lit the stove to dry a load of washing but again , that may or may not be more environmentally friendly . As my wood is largely  “ free “ it’s certainly cheaper . 

Post edited at 07:01
 FactorXXX 06 Oct 2022
In reply to wintertree:

> With a heat pump based condensing dryer you want to send that condensate down a drain - it is colder than ambient with the heat taken out of it going in to the dryer and thence the room.  If you keep the cold water in a bottle it just re-absorbs the heat.  If you send it down the drain, it doesn’t, and you heat your house with the heat recovered by cooling the water that was in the clothes.  

The water collected in the bottle is warm/hot and definitely hotter than ambient air temperature.

 Hooo 06 Oct 2022
In reply to wintertree:

I did the maths (on a fag packet). Chucking the water down the drain gains me about 0.2kWh per load. Good thing I have it plumbed in eh? 😂

 wintertree 06 Oct 2022
In reply to FactorXXX:

> The water collected in the bottle is warm/hot and definitely hotter than ambient air temperature.

Yes, that’s because it sits next to hot stuff and isn’t disposed of immediately after coming off the condensing bit which, in a heat pump dryer or a dehumidifier, is cold.  Keep it near the hot stuff and it rapidly re warms, dispose of it immediately and it goes out cold, leaving that heat to stay in the room.

 Rog Wilko 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

We have a cupboard with a bit of the CH circuit extended through it and a smallish dehumidifier on a time switch set for a couple of hours. That is 200 watts, but probably fairly economical compared with tumble drier, anyway!

OP montyjohn 06 Oct 2022
In reply to Robert Durran:

> Just hang them over doors or whatever until they are dry. 

This what we used to do, or just accept they take a long time to dry, but now we're a family of four and have school uniforms that must be dry our system is breaking down a bit.

I've found myself putting the heating on, simply to ensure kids clothes are dry for when they are needed, which is why I need a bot of a re-think.

I think come winter it will be less of an isse as the heating will be on anyway, but we do so many loads now (kids are filthy at the end of every day) moisture will soon become a concern.

OP montyjohn 06 Oct 2022
In reply to wercat:

> Mk 1 Washing line

How do people do this in the winter? And where do you get the time?

Weekdays I can forget it. It's nearly dark when I finish work, and before work is a madhouse getting the kids ready.

If we leave it to the weekend we'll probably have about four loads to do which effectively means spending the whole day putting washes on, and that's assuming it's a nice dry day. If it's not we certainly can't afford to wait to the next weekend.

OP montyjohn 06 Oct 2022
In reply to Hooo:

> Heat pump tumble dryer.

Maybe in our next house. We really don't have the space for a tumble dryer but I think it may have to come to this eventually.

OP montyjohn 06 Oct 2022
In reply to J Whittaker:

> Dehumidifier.

This may be out stop gap solution.

What I'm wondering is, if it's 250W, do you pretty much get 250W of heat out of one, in which case in the winter it may not be a bad idea at all.

I also like the idea of the house being able to be cooler whilst comfortable as it's dryer.

OP montyjohn 06 Oct 2022
In reply to Dave Todd:

> Important tip: put the clothes on then throw an old, cotton sheet over the top of it all.

This is very similar to what we have. It has a cover, and I haven't found much difference with or without it.

With the cover it just ends up being a warm humid mess that doesn't seem to dry.

Without, you're just heating the room and only drying the clothes where they touch the bars.

What I would love to do is build an extractor for one that vents outside before after passing through a heat exchanger. That way you keep circa half the heat it produces in the room, has a good breeze so dries quickly, and ejects all the moisture.

Might be a bit overkill however. 

 wercat 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

You have to choose the right time in the colder seasons, no good without either some sun or a drying breeze but we don't have very many windstill days here.

Clothes horses can be taken outside opportunistically when there is sunshine no rain and not too windy.   Also changing washing plans according to bad weather forecast.  I suppose this is living like our ancestors.  When that fails then making use of central heating in the evenings which is slower but in an old house there is more ventilation and perhaps moisture doesn't build up as quickly.

Post edited at 09:12
In reply to montyjohn:

I suppose starting with a very good spin to get as much water out as possible before hanging to dry...

 Dave Todd 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

An old, thin, cotton sheet works really well - no trapping of moisture.

We've been doing this for 15+ years and it seems to do the trick!

 stubbed 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

A ceiling clothes horse next to the back door with the window open constantly dries most things within a day. In the short season between summer & central heating going on, it can take a bit longer, but like someone else said, you can always change your washing plans for a windy day. Also worked for us during a few years of washing nappies. nb. with reusable nappies it's the drying, not the washing, which is the problem.

I'm not around often enough to hang everything outside (as my Mum did) but it really doesn't need to be that warm to get things dry.

Last resort - condensing tumble dryer - but only if I am over loaded with soaking washing...

 Robert Durran 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

> This what we used to do, or just accept they take a long time to dry.

Yes, I typically do one load a week. If the clothes take a week to dry it isn't a problem. 

 Hooo 06 Oct 2022
In reply to wintertree:

It appears FactorXXX has a condenser dryer, not a heat pump. So his condensed water will be above ambient temp and he'd gain by letting it heat the room before chucking it away. 

 gethin_allen 06 Oct 2022
In reply to Hooo:

> I suspect this drying system uses as much energy as my dryer.

It's questionable.

A quick look suggests a reasonably large A++ rated tumble dryer uses 2-2.5 kWh for a cycle (assuming this fully dries the clothes). That's 9-10 hours using a dehumidifier, our one uses 248 W on full but I'm not sure about the average usage over a hour or so is because it changes based on temperature and humidity in the room. How long does it take to dry stuff?

I guess that the main difference is that the heat that goes into evaporating the moisture from the clothes to be later condensed by the dryer/dehumidifier comes from electric in the former and probably gas central heating in the later.

We only initially bought a dehumidifier to sort out a damp rental house and later found it useful for drying clothes in winter. We still aim to dry things outside whenever possible.

One thing I have also found it good for is keeping moths from eating our wool clothes. They need a certain level of humidity to thrive so keeping the wardrobes very dry keeps them away.

 AllanMac 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Wear clothing for longer than normal, and instead wash the body more frequently (and use antiperspirant/deodorant). Given that the body dries much faster than clothes, keeping the smellier parts washed more regularly, increases wearability of clothes much longer than you might think.

Also wash thinner fast drying underclothes more regularly than thicker, slower-drying outer wear. Time it to coincide with a forecast of warmer drier weather, so you can dry them outside on a washing line rather than causing damp problems inside the house. 

If all this sounds a bit disgusting, there's the entertainment value of clothes typically making their own way to the washing machine after a few weeks of wear. 

 Hooo 06 Oct 2022
In reply to gethin_allen:

I think it's almost impossible to answer the question definitively. In the link artif posted above, the guy measured 0.78kWh to dry a load. And there are so many factors involved - are you heating a room to dry clothes with a dehumidifier, when otherwise you'd leave that room cold, or would you be heating it anyway? Is the waste heat from a dryer useful, or heating an unused room?

I just don't think people should write off modern dryers as a terrible waste of energy, they might actually not be any worse than other indoor drying methods.

Anyway, the washing machine has just beeped and it's a nice day, so I'm off to hang it out on the line.

 wintertree 06 Oct 2022
In reply to Hooo:

> I just don't think people should write off modern dryers as a terrible waste of energy, they might actually not be any worse than other indoor drying methods.

As you allude the calculation has to be holistic.  At this time of year I run a cold house with ventilation - the heating hasn’t come on yet - and the energy cost of running a heat pump condensing dryer is peanuts compared to what others spend heating their houses and using a dehumidifier to dry their clothes. 

 Robert Durran 06 Oct 2022
In reply to AllanMac:

> Wear clothing for longer than normal, and instead wash the body more frequently.

How do you think that works out in cost terms (let's say change underpants etc. every day but quick shower every 3 days against vice versa)?

 Bottom Clinger 06 Oct 2022
In reply to The Thread:

We’ve been a family of four and always used washing line and clothes horse, in wet Wigan.   Childrens school clothes rarely got washed until the weekend, and I’m a real scruffy get. In winter, stuff like bedding could wait until a dry weekend then on the washing line.  
An issue for me is how often people feel the need to change and wash clothes.  I reckon many folk feel under pressure to wear something different each day they go into work, and insist on school uniforms being totally spotless.  The environment (and my wallet) is more important.

Post edited at 11:22
In reply to montyjohn:

Not going to put out 250 w. Does make a marked temp difference of 2-4°C for my small 2 x 2.8m room using for a couple of hours or more with my 200w rated machine. The difference in feeling warmer and drier air is noticeable c/w a cool damp feeling with condensation on cooler surfaces without the dehumidifier on. Some clothes with modern fabrics can and do dry in a couple of hours.

In a very large room esp if dehumidifier is under spec will have little or no noticeable effect and prob have little or no effect on clothes drying. Spec the machine according to room needed. Make sure you get a humidistat and other auto controls on a machine for better running costs and convenience.

Some users of dehumidifiers will run for a general house drying effect as well (I used to with my first machine continuously on automatic but I did have high humidity levels, 80%, with that home), though I don’t now a days nor done in subsequent homes, and it can make a much nicer atmosphere, minimising damp moulds, and giving a better to heat environment.

 gethin_allen 06 Oct 2022
In reply to wintertree:

surely you have a few hot servers to dry your clothes on, like the ladies running colossus at Bletchley Park used to do.

 CantClimbTom 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

> ... we do so many loads now (kids are filthy at the end of every day)

I've often said to my Mrs (joking, but not 100% joking) that we should've had a pack of dogs instead of having a pack of kids, dogs are more hygienic and damage the house less

Post edited at 11:32
 David Riley 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

I have a wheely bin that collects water from my roof.  Suppose I installed a second bin lower in the garden on a platform connected to a piston with a metal sphere on top. The northern hemisphere could be lifted off with a handle and clothes inserted.  If a tap was opened to fill the lower bin with rainwater,  a vacuum would be created, cooling the sphere.  As it warmed, the water would boil in the clothes reducing the vacuum.  The bin would descend until the clothes were dry.

 mutt 06 Oct 2022
In reply to elliot.baker:

> Problem with washing lines is time… I think it takes a good 15 minutes to put a full load on a washing line, and if the forecast is showers at any point in the day - you need to be ready and around to take it all off the line or it gets wet again.

> also - what magical pegs are you buying that last years!!? Half the time I use a peg it pops into its two component pieces 

And that there is a neat definition of snowflake. 

8
 mutt 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

My laundry either goes on the line to dry or onto a standard cloths horse. The advantage of the clothes horse is that I can move it into the sun so I never need to leave it to dry for more that 36 hours. Washing hung outside is usually dry in a few hours so WFH really helps getting the washing done and dry on sunny days. I never use electric for drying  at all.

 WhiteSpider88 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

I use my local SNP MP, the hot air dries them in no time. 

3
 Neil Williams 06 Oct 2022
In reply to mutt:

> And that there is a neat definition of snowflake.

It's a definition of lazy, but I'm not sure why it's to do with people getting offended unnecessarily!

Personally if it's not windy I don't bother with pegs, FWIW.

 snoop6060 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Rotary washing line that has a cover so it doesn’t matter if it rains.  Well as long as it’s not absolutely hammering down. Usually just then finish them in the TD. I have a washing line in my poly tunnel as well but it causes mildew on any plants I’ve still got in there. Works bloody great tho even in the dead of winter! 

OP montyjohn 06 Oct 2022
In reply to David Riley:

> I have a wheely bin that collects water from my roof.  Suppose I installed a second bin lower in the garden on a platform connected to a piston with a metal sphere on top. The northern hemisphere could be lifted off with a handle and clothes inserted.  If a tap was opened to fill the lower bin with rainwater,  a vacuum would be created, cooling the sphere.  As it warmed, the water would boil in the clothes reducing the vacuum.  The bin would descend until the clothes were dry.

The solution is here somewhere. 10/10 for effort. But if I may I see a few problems.

I'm guessing the cylinder would need to have a cross sectional area roughly half of that of the bin to take a decent load of washing. This means a 1m column (assumed height of the bin) of water pulling down is only going to reduce the pressure to 0.8 Bar.

This would reduce the boiling point by only 6 degrees (94 degrees).

Now, it will still increase evaporation rates but I suspect not sufficiently to make it workable.

Building on your excellent work, how about a vacuum chamber and pump powered by an exercise bike. I see no reason why this could not reach 95% of an absolute vacuum, and the heat generated by the child (who's fault this is anyway) powering the bike would go some ways to heating the house.

It's also not reliant on having water in the water butt.

 David Riley 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Yes, it was just intended as a colourful solution (ultimate green).

A wider cylinder would require more weight, a narrower one more movement.

An electric pump would be much more convenient.  I make it a rule never to design with children or animals.

 elliot.baker 06 Oct 2022
In reply to Neil Williams:

I wouldn't say I'm lazy I would say I am time poor.

OP montyjohn 06 Oct 2022
In reply to David Riley:

> I make it a rule never to design with children or animals.

Then you won't like my bicycle wheeled chariot idea (I'm seriously going to build this one day).

It will be dual fuel.

Powered either by two alsatians or children subject to travel purpose and destination.

 owlart 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Living in a first floor flat with no access to outside space, then clothes get either draped over the bedroom radiator, or hung on hangers off a line strung cornerwise across the bedroom. I have the window open a fraction for ventilation In summer they dry really quickly but in winter it can take a few days unless I turn the heating up. I don't seem to have any damp/mould problems.

 David Riley 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

No. Electric will be better in the end.

Note the cylinder diameter is not related to the clothes container size, so your observation is not valid.

 AllanMac 06 Oct 2022
In reply to Robert Durran:

Does it have to be a shower? Washing machines and showers use power. Why not just the armpits and nether regions with a soap, flannel and lukewarm water from a kettle after having a cuppa?

If things get really crusty, 80 grit sandpaper and a wire brush would do the job nicely, after breaking the ice first.

 AllanMac 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

> Powered either by two alsatians or children subject to travel purpose and destination.

If cats or chocolate bars are nearby, you will need to be wary of speed cameras.

 Robert Durran 06 Oct 2022
In reply to AllanMac:

> Does it have to be a shower? Washing machines and showers use power.

Obviously I was meaning cold showers and cold washes.

> Why not just the armpits and nether regions with a soap, flannel and lukewarm water from a kettle after having a cuppa?

You actually boil the kettle?!

> If things get really crusty, 80 grit sandpaper and a wire brush would do the job nicely.

Is that for my nether regions or the skidmarks on my underpants?

 jkarran 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Washing line when it'll work.

High efficiency condensing tumble drier the rest of the year. It's in our living space so I don't much care about the energy use when the house needs heating anyway. The noise annoys me but such is life.

jk

 Neil Williams 06 Oct 2022
In reply to jkarran:

I don't overly care about the noise of a tumble dryer any more than when it's washing, but I dislike the smell it puts into clothes and the way it seems to crease things even when a small load is used, plus it shrinks nylon clothes.

Far rather put stuff on a rack by the radiator, or outside if not raining.

Post edited at 16:24
 David Riley 06 Oct 2022
In reply to Hooo:

> Completely different thing. A condenser dryer uses heat to dry the clothes, then throws the heat away. A heat pump dryer is basically a dehumidifier in a box.

I have travelled deep into spider-space and found my condenser dryer very hard to follow.  It does not seem to have refrigeration, but I don't think it throws the heat from the condenser away.  It is re-used to heat the incoming air.  It could also be considered a dehumidifier in a box.

> I very much doubt that you bought something advertised as a condenser dryer and got one with a heat pump in it. 

Athough fridges have always been heat pumps, the term was not widely used in the past.

>  it uses cold water from the mains to cool the condenser.

No.

Although the performance of condenser dryers is quite good,  I am now convinced the heat pump dryers are better and will get one soon.

 The Norris 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

I'm just a boring old washing line or indoor clothes-horse-when-wet-outside kinda guy. 

But the damp issues mentioned up thread have made me think a bit more, and i might trial par-drying the clothes in my shed.

Do you reckon the loss of water from wet clothes is linear or more exponential? Figured I could get the worst of it out in the shed, then finish off in the house, to get the best of both worlds of minimising damp, as well as drying time. I have no evidence to back this theory up, but I like it nonetheless!

Post edited at 18:02
OP montyjohn 06 Oct 2022
In reply to The Norris:

I reckon it's as near to linear it makes little difference. It might be slight the exponential in the sense that it dries slightly quickly right at the end when it's almost dry but I suspect it's mostly linear.

My shed is full of oil and pieces of car. No place for your delicates. They'd never be the same again.

 EdS 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Leave in the fire station 🤣

 gravy 06 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

When I was a child I was frequently the victim of pants that had been dried on the top of a paraffin heater or under a gas grill, both with added melted nylon chunks that burnt and embedded themselves and then later on set hard and chaffed for the rest of the day. The parafin heater ones had the charming whiff of petrochemicals and the grilled ones has toast crumbs embedded in the molten plastic that created a "comforting" 40 grade emery cloth texture.

After several unpleasant when is a hurry to get to school I became wise the serious and humiliating burns that can be inflected by globs of molten synthetic fabric.

I also had a swimming costume shrunk to tiny proportions under the grill much the same way monster munch packets used to shrink to badge size in the oven.

I nostalgically look forward to the return of the 1970s this winter.

 Sealwife 06 Oct 2022
In reply to gravy:

You grilled your pants?  I’ve ironed a shirt dry, and blow-dried a pair of tights before but grilling clothing is a new one on me.

 gravy 06 Oct 2022
In reply to Sealwife:

They were grilled for me by my parents. 

It was a careful balance, obviously you'd be naked in the freezing cold waiting to get dressed and handed a pair of freshly grilled pants that were enticingly warm but may contain burning hot globules of molten plastic and embedded chunks of well carbonised toast - it took a few serious injuries before the instinct to check carefully first developed properly.

I remember vividly a pair of my pants blackening and melting on the paraffin heater and running down the side.

 Fiona Reid 07 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Washing line as first option. We WFH thus it's easy to grab it if the rain starts.

If washing line isn't an option due to weather then clothes rack and dehumidifier. 

We've not used the dehumidifier since the spring as it's rare you can't get stuff dry outside.

 SouthernSteve 07 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

We don't have a tumble dryer. We are constantly checking the weather forecast and then swear a lot when it pours down when there was less than <10% chance of rain and the washing – likely pretty dry is again soaking.

It does mean that washing can become a bit of a mass activity if the weather has been rubbish for a few days, although we can opt for using the airer for essentials. 

 Duncan Bourne 07 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

We just hang ours on a plain old drying rack (clothes horse) in the spare bedroom. No window open (in winter) but with other doors open there is enough airflow around the house so no mould. On bright days they go outside. Sheets we hang over the banister.

EDIT: Just to add that our washer does a spin cycle so no dripping water from the clothes. They are already halfway dry on coming out of the washing machine

Post edited at 08:53
 Lord_ash2000 07 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Until very recently we hang them out on the line, now the weather is coming in we hang them on the sheila maid in the utility room with the window slightly ajar for ventilation. If we want them done quicker or don't want the window open we'll use a dehumidifier or if it is just T-shirts and stuff we'll sometimes use the condenser dryer. The washing machine is a like a 2 in 1 thing

 Mike Stretford 07 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

I've used a dehumidifier for years in winter because I prefer it. Obvs no damp issues and clothes don't need ironing afterwards for everyday wear.

I assumed it's cheaper than than running a tumble drier but tbh haven't really thought about it in detail.

Mine is 210W rated but won't be running at that the whole time, seems to work fine with the fan on the lower setting and the compressor isn't always running.

I do have the kit to monitor energy use so will do. Result to be published exclusively on UKC.

 wbo2 07 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

clothes horse sat on the upstairs landing.  Clothes are dry in a day usually

My tmble drier is used once or twice a year for drying down stuff..

 oldie 07 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

> I reckon it's as near to linear it makes little difference. It might be slight the exponential in the sense that it dries slightly quickly right at the end when it's almost dry but I suspect it's mostly linear. <

That last bit is easily and quickly done by simply wearing the item.

 AukWalk 07 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Surprised how many people are using dehumidifiers. They are not actually that cheap or efficient to run - there is a theoretical limit on how efficient they can be due to the thermodynamics of how they work. 

I try to do washing when there's dry weather and hang it outside - even in winter it dries reasonably well after a full day, can then finish off inside. For inside I just have a couple of airers that get put up in the kitchen, and have enough ventilation to stop damp build up.

If I had space I might consider a tumble dryer to use on odd occasions, but don't have anywhere to put one. 

 tlm 10 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

1. Think about how much washing you create in the first place. Wear clothes until they are actually in need of a wash, hang towels up to air between showers etc.

2. Use passive ways to get plenty of air circulation around clothes. Hang them up with plenty of space between them, make sure fabric isn't scrunched, make sure they have space around the rack and the door of the room is open.

3. Use outdoors when possible. You can just put a whole rack outside, then bring it back in if you are going out.

4. Put the rack on the sunnier, warmer side of your house, in front of any sun coming in windows.

5. With thicker clothes, like jeans or towels, consider hanging them away from the other clothes, or over a radiator.

6. Look at the spin speed you are using. A faster spin speed means drier clothes.

7. We tend to leave them on the rack for two days in the winter to make sure they are thoroughly dry. We have our house at a maximum of 17C, use a normal, unheated rack and don't open the windows. Lighter things only take one day, but I just do the whole load as one.

8. Don't leave them sitting in the machine, as they won't be drying in that time, and it can lead to them smelling musty.

9. People talk about using dehumidifiers, heated racks or fans, but I've never had the need. Until around 20 years ago, most people just dried stuff indoors on racks in the winter, or did the in/out dance trying to avoid showers, the night or any other dampness outside. But I don't think people did as much washing then.

In reply to montyjohn:

I have a classic old 'Dutch airer' which works extremely well in my 'dining room', with a very high ceiling. Everything bone dry in 12-15 hours; faster in the winter when the CH is on. Looks just like this: https://amzn.to/3yxW3JZ

 Toerag 10 Oct 2022
In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

>  with a very high ceiling. Everything bone dry in 12-15 hours; faster in the winter when the CH is on.

Takes advantage of the hottest part of the room .

In reply to Toerag:

Yes, exactly. It's a very warm, dry small terraced cottage, with remarkably high ceilings downstairs.

 Mike Stretford 10 Oct 2022
In reply to tlm:

> 9. People talk about using dehumidifiers, heated racks or fans, but I've never had the need. Until around 20 years ago, most people just dried stuff indoors on racks in the winter, or did the in/out dance trying to avoid showers, the night or any other dampness outside. But I don't think people did as much washing then.

I can't say my washing habits have changed in 20 years..... I don't think society has changed in that regard since 2002.

None of us need a dehumidifier but I have found it a better solution as I've increased the insulation of the house, sealed leaks. As more people increase the insulation they will find this. Yes it uses some energy but the saving from a well insulated house are much bigger, as that's every day over winter. Insulate Britain do have a point!

OP montyjohn 11 Oct 2022
In reply to Mike Stretford:

> None of us need a dehumidifier but I have found it a better solution as I've increased the insulation of the house, sealed leaks. As more people increase the insulation they will find this.

I plan on going to town with this sort of thing in my next house. No point doing it in my current house as I won't likely be here long fingers crossed.

Think passive house stuff but without the certification. Heat exchanger circulation being a key part of it. 

OP montyjohn 11 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

> 1. Think about how much washing you create in the first place. Wear clothes until they are actually in need of a wash, hang towels up to air between showers etc.

I'd say 90% of it is kids clothes. When they come home from nursery and school filthy we can't send them in the next day wearing the same clothes. The clothes may be small, but they build up quickly.

> 3. Use outdoors when possible. You can just put a whole rack outside, then bring it back in if you are going out.

So Saturday was interesting. Beautiful cool sunny day. My garden doesn't really get any sunlight this time of year as it's surrounded by tall trees, it also means very little breeze. We hung everything outside early in the morning, took them in at roughly 4pm before dew started to form, and whilst it's hard to tell, I'd see they were roughly as damp as they were when we put them out. We always use a second spin on the washer so they aren't soaked to begin with.

Maybe it's just our property, but I'm finding by the end of September, there's no point hanging clothes outside.

 stubbed 11 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

It will be worth it if it is a windy day though

 stubbed 11 Oct 2022
In reply to Gordon Stainforth:

I have one of these that I have brought with me into every house. In my terrace house (very high ceilings) I had it hanging over the stairs out of the way & stuff dried so quickly

 Mike Stretford 11 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

> Think passive house stuff but without the certification. Heat exchanger circulation being a key part of it. 

Yes that's my thinking too. TBH I should get close next year when I replace the old double glazing/frames. It obs wasn't a great job in the first instance (80s?), and the newer frames and triple glazing seem to have improve a lot.

After that I'll try to work out if it's worth getting a MVHR. 

 Jon Greengrass 11 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

Dehumifidifier in a south facing room with the door and window vents shut and the clothes hung on airers. It is much more efficient than either tumble drying or a heated rack because there's no damp air (full of energy)  being lost to outside either through the tumble dryer vent or an open window. 100% of the electricity that goes into our dehumidifier ends up heating the house.

OP montyjohn 11 Oct 2022
In reply to Jon Greengrass:

> 100% of the electricity that goes into our dehumidifier ends up heating the house.

Is this definitely true? I was trying to work out if energy is sapped elsewhere somehow but couldn't find an answer.

 Mike Stretford 11 Oct 2022
In reply to montyjohn:

> > 100% of the electricity that goes into our dehumidifier ends up heating the house.

> Is this definitely true? I was trying to work out if energy is sapped elsewhere somehow but couldn't find an answer.

Almost.......there's some sound.

Agree with Jon it's a system that works well if the room is well insulated. Took some convincing my GF who kept opening the window.... though she seemed to like 'you're trying to dehumidify the rest of the world!'

 wintertree 11 Oct 2022
In reply to Jon Greengrass:

> 100% of the electricity that goes into our dehumidifier ends up heating the house.

More given the recovery of the latent heat.  Even more still if you can dispose of the cold condensate in real time, not collect it in a tank to re-absorb heat from the house.

In reply to Mike Stratford:

> Almost.......there's some sound.

Can you hear it from outside?  No!  Sound is mostly absorbed in the room, where the sonic energy becomes… heat.

There will be tiny looses as EM radiation from all the wires.

Post edited at 17:43
 David Riley 12 Oct 2022
In reply to wintertree:

> More given the recovery of the latent heat.  Even more still if you can dispose of the cold condensate in real time, not collect it in a tank to re-absorb heat from the house.

Good point, as I sit reading the manual for the A+++ heat pump dryer delivered this morning.  Had just decided not to bother messing about connecting the outflow.  Mind changed.

This part of the house is not heated or well insulated.  So, much better than an open humidifier.  Claims to dry 9Kg. of cotton using less than 1KW/hour.

Surprised to find it's fully internet connected and communicates with solar controllers.

 Mike Stretford 12 Oct 2022
In reply to wintertree:

> In reply to Mike Stratford:

> > Almost.......there's some sound.

> Can you hear it from outside?  No!  Sound is mostly absorbed in the room, where the sonic energy becomes… heat.

> There will be tiny looses as EM radiation from all the wires.

I did say almost! I suspect it could be heard outside the window..... but I take your point I won't be tying a microphone to the washing line pole! (mmmm.....but they may be a good before and after test for next years new windows).

 Mike Stretford 12 Oct 2022
In reply to wintertree:

And I do wonder how much of how housing stock suffers from dodgy 80s double glazing installation. Ours are awful.... leaky and and they didn't install a lintel when they replaced thick wooden frames. So that needs sorting first of all.


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