UKH

On the news last night, and other MRT's reporting the same.  I find it interesting that the other month there was much discussion on here about how relatively safe climbing/hill walking is.  And UKC polls appear to show many folk getting out.  Don't know where I stand on this (and many other) issues - my head is well minced these days.  I can see all the arguments but can't decide whether or not its OK to go climbing/hill walking.  It does look like a right faff for rescuers though.

What's the 360% increase have they gone from 1 to 4.6 ? call outs

Some sense of scale might help

Here's a link to the press release: https://edalemrt.co.uk/peak-district-mountain-rescue-organisation-press-rel...

"Thirty-Seven times from 18th May – 31st May 2020 (inclusive) compared with only eight callouts for the same period in 2019, an increase of 362.5%."
It's not a very informative statistic on its own; maybe those weekends it was raining last year? 

I guess the point they want to make is that it's a large number of call outs, and while we are allowed to go out now, it's still much harder for them to provide their normal service. 

Fairly sure it was a 360% increase on the same period last year (possibly a 2 week period, so a small sample).  North West News.  Showed them stretchering a climber who had slipped down a descent gully. 

Some boulderers in the background, so someone on here might have unwittingly got on TV!

I think peak district teams are by far the busiest in the country at the moment. 

Must be a lot more people flocking to the peak than other areas e.g lakes and north Yorkshire. I presume this is because wales is still 'closed' and the peak is the next nearest place for many people.

I don't know about the numbers, but I went hill walking last weekend, and intend to continue doing so from now on unless the law changes again. I'd stand by hillwalking and climbing being pretty low risk activities, and to not engage in them because of a miniscule risk of mrt having to be called out and risking infection seems rather disproportionate.

Schools are going back, shops are opening, BBQs back on, people going back to work. If all that's OK then I don't see why perfectly legal outdoor activities should be avoided purely because of a miniscule additional transmission risk (if it is actually increased at all once you correct for the fact that local exercise will put you in contact with far more people than an average day on the hills). Avoiding busy areas, don't take unnecessary risks etc is reasonable, but avoiding the hills entirely is not.

I get the slightly uneasy feeling wondering if its right or not after being told it's too risky for so long (and that's why I didn't get out on the hills for a couple of weeks after we were technically allowed to). However, personally it feels like the risk is low enough that I'm not being unreasonable. We accept all sorts of other risks to ourselves and others during normal times, and it doesn't seem to me that transmitting covid by going hillwalking would feature particularly highly on that list at the present time. 

Only problem is it seems that some irresponsible people are putting themselves and others at unnecessary risk by going out unprepared, and causing other trouble by leaving disposable BBQs all over the place etc. As long as you're not one of those I'd say go for it. 

Looking at their facebook page page, there seems to have been two climbing incidents*, rest appear to be more injuries on fairly benign walks, Lady Bower, Padley Gorge, Chastworth Estate. It's not really people pushing it.

* Tragic fatal accident and a tumble down a decent gully

There were highs of 15 degrees, strong winds and scattered rain in that period last year.

They should compare it to a similarly sunny period otherwise their conclusion is nonsense.

Dont think there was any conclusion just a fact. It is up to individuals to make there own conclusions but there does seem to be a lot of people out on the hills who would normally be somewhere else eg shopping centres, zoos,funfair parks etc, all out of reach at the moment, As for not going hillwalking/climbing I'm afraid that pleasure has been curtailed for me as I'm under isolation because my wife is having an operation in a fortnight and as we live close together I had no other option but to isolate with her.

8 calls during the second half of May last year across the whole of The Peak seems pretty low. It's also clear at least some of the calls are nothing to do with relaxing restrictions (the vulnerable missing people and WWII ordnance). That said, they do seem fairly busy now.

The absence of people is a double edge sword. I wonder how many rescues i/we/the outdoor community prevent without even realising. 

The people who never seem to overtake who are surreptitiously following you to get down, the people who sheepishly ask to look at your map, the people you might say "watch it, the path is a bit further that way....." to, who you are pretty sure weren't going to walk off the cliff. 

Without that fellow community, are we just not seeing those minor errors of judgement going uncorrected?

Also aren’t they comparing it to a period where people were in work and children in school?

Bit like comparing police call outs on a Tuesday night and a Friday night surely. Right now every day is basically a bank holiday weekend. 

Isn't that what everyone is saying to justify them doing activities in the outdoors?
Including the ones that have needed the services of Mountain Rescue...

Possibly, I'm not sure - but I'd argue that people who got lost in the mist without a compass, or started fires with disposable BBQs did not in fact take reasonable steps to minimise the chance of mrt, fire brigade, etc being called out even if they claimed they did. To me, being reasonably prepared means having appropriate navigation tools (and knowledge of how to use them), clothing layers, sufficient food and water etc (obviously depending on exactly what you've got planned).  I think there's a reasonable consensus among outdoor enthusiasts about what it means to be prepared. Being prepared reduces the chance that you'll get into difficulties, and increases the chance that if you do get into difficulties you'll be able to get yourself out of them too. Some people were obviously not reasonably prepared, or were irresponsible (e.g. with disposable BBQs). 

Of course, however well prepared you are, you can accidentally trip over a rock and break your leg, or make some other mistake resulting in you needing help, which in the current climate potentially puts people at risk of transmitting coronavirus. But, by being prepared and being sensible I'd argue that the risk to others is actually pretty low now, and at an acceptable level. To me, outdoor activities are among the lowest risk activities in terms of virus transmission - we're naturally socially distant, don't share facilities or indoor spaces, and only very rarely need any help from mrt (anecdotal, but I don't personally know anyone that's ever needed rescue). Personal transmission risk is easily reduced by distancing from others, using elbows / gloves / hand gel to open gates etc.

Even without the coronavirus there is a non-zero risk to yourself and others every second of the day, whether you go for a walk in the hills or sit at home watching TV. I'd argue that the increased risk from transmitting coronavirus is low enough that it's reasonable to go outside not only legally, but also ethically. 

You may disagree, as people will evaluate risk differently. But I'd counter and say when will the risk be acceptable if not now? When track and trace reaches full 'world class' status? When the number of new cases is down to 100 per day (which may never happen)? When we have a vaccine? When the virus has been completely eliminated? When every single potentially harmful microbe on the planet has been eliminated? Or is it unethical to go into the hills full stop if there's a chance we may need help from mrt, as they might trip and break an ankle on their way to rescue us? 

Potentially yes. Anecdotally, on facebook I've noticed friends of friends who live out in the Peak talking about more people being irresponsible and not using their heads, regarding fires and litter and general good practice (as one put it, 'Not just your typical 'Gammon', but Nether Edge hipsters* who think they know better too') , which might be linked to more people who are less hill-safe needing to be rescued too? It could be the same demographic (which many on here would probably like to think).

* Nether Edge can be a fairly middle class alternative and educated area, and it's generally leafy, iirc their MP is a Green.

Edit: Speaking for myself, I'm still mountain biking, but ever since the 'safety net' of my more solid oldest brother moving away and my Dad too, I'm more careful with just my dreamy musician bro left in Sheffield as a safety net/support along with the NHS. It didn't take covid19 for me to be more careful.