/ Conspiracy Theories.

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Smith42 14:10 Thu

Anyone else notice how we seem to have become a Communist state in all but name? 

Every decision is dictated by the government and represents the long-term interests of the people.  Social rights have been removed, we wait to be told when to go to work, what we can buy, how we can spend our free time.

The Western world has been brought to its knees in a few short months.

Covid 19 originated in China.  

Boom, were through the looking glass.

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Archy Styrigg 14:13 Thu
In reply to Smith42:

It's pretty conclusive proof that chemtrail spraying exists and works.

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Stuart William 14:20 Thu
In reply to Smith42:

You might be confusing communist states with totalitarian or authoritarian states. I’m not sure this is what Marx had in mind. 

To be honest, I think there are a lot of people right now very grateful for the socialist influences in our current system. Those able to seek state support for businesses or individuals. Those able to access free healthcare. Those being protected from eviction or home repossession.

It’s not clear what you think the alternative is right now, from an ideologically pure capitalist perspective. Do share. 

And just to be clear, are you saying that you believe this to be a global act of biological warfare by China? Big claim. 

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profitofdoom 14:29 Thu
In reply to Stuart William:

> And just to be clear, are you saying that you believe this to be a global act of biological warfare by China? Big claim. 

It looks like he's saying.......... errrrrrrr what is he saying?............ errrrrrrrrrrrr beats me, I'm tremendously confused...... And then he titled his thread "Conspiracy Theories?, is he saying it's one of them???

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Stuart William 14:36 Thu
In reply to profitofdoom:

I can’t make up my mind whether it’s a piss take or whether they are meaning something more along the lines of “you thought it was just a conspiracy theory, but open your eyes...”

Genuinely curious as to how the post was meant. But thanks all the same for your insights. 

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summo 14:40 Thu
In reply to Smith42:

I blame the Rothschilds. 

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mondite 14:46 Thu
In reply to summo:

> I blame the Rothschilds. 


I blame Rothmans. Breathing difficulties was a speciality of theirs.

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profitofdoom 14:48 Thu
In reply to Stuart William:

> I can’t make up my mind whether it’s a piss take or whether they are meaning something more along the lines of “you thought it was just a conspiracy theory, but open your eyes...” > Genuinely curious as to how the post was meant......

Me too, but I guess we'll never know unless he replies, too bad (??)

Thanks for your reply to me anyway

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summo 14:48 Thu
In reply to mondite:

> I blame Rothmans. Breathing difficulties was a speciality of theirs.

Do they even exist anymore? I've no idea. 

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aln 14:58 Thu
In reply to summo:

I blame Thatcher!

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The Lemming 14:59 Thu
In reply to Smith42:

> Anyone else notice how we seem to have become a Communist state in all but name? 

Hmm, no, not really.

> Every decision is dictated by the government and represents the long-term interests of the people.  Social rights have been removed, we wait to be told when to go to work, what we can buy, how we can spend our free time.

Probably because fekwits do selfish things like buy shit loads of toilet roll, go to mass public gatherings such as race courses or go up mountains enmass.

> The Western world has been brought to its knees in a few short months.

We are in a pandemic. PANDEMIC!

> Covid 19 originated in China. 

So, fekin what?

> Boom, were through the looking glass.

Either you are on drugs, or you need some meds.

My advice is chill.

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summo 15:01 Thu
In reply to aln:

> I blame Thatcher!

Bliar's been very quiet lately too. No doubt holed in one of his many properties. 

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The Lemming 15:02 Thu
In reply to aln:

> I blame Thatcher!


She stole my milk.

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mondite 15:07 Thu
In reply to summo:

> Do they even exist anymore? I've no idea. 

You see they have fooled you into not believing in them anymore. Now that is power. They are after you!!!!!

We really need to be able to format in green ink.

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In reply to Smith42:

I imagine the various measures in place are similar to measures taken during World War Two, sometimes referred to as "war socialism." EG. Key workers moved around the country and told where to work. War socialism led to the Welfare State. I'd love to think we might see a radical redistribution of resources, a better NHS, many more affordable houses built, etc when this is over but I'm not optimistic.

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nniff 15:35 Thu
In reply to Smith42:

You are an insurgent and ICMFP.  

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Baz P 22:09 Thu
In reply to Smith42:

I’m not usually into conspiracy theories but I find it slightly unusual that a country a large as Russia at present has 799 cases of Corvid 19 with 3 deaths.

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In reply to Smith42:

Coronavirus is a natural disease.  

The Tories are a man-made problem.

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Lankyman 08:32 Fri
In reply to Smith42:

> Anyone else notice how we seem to have become a Communist state in all but name? 

I think you're talking total tripe

> Boom, were through the looking glass.

Then again, I did catch a glimpse of someone on a grassy knoll the other day .....

Post edited at 08:33
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mondite 08:37 Fri
In reply to Baz P:

> I’m not usually into conspiracy theories but I find it slightly unusual that a country a large as Russia at present has 799 cases of Corvid 19 with 3 deaths.


Does a government lying count as a conspiracy theory? Subset of government employees yes but didnt think it applied to when the whole government lies.

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summo 09:12 Fri
In reply to tom_in_edinburgh:

> Coronavirus is a natural disease.  

> The Tories are a man-made problem.

You'll notice though that most other political leaders are quiet.. They either think that there isn't really much else any government could do to fix a problem that appears 3 months ago and know all countries are making it up as they go along.. or they are thinking thank fu@k they aren't PM. 

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pec 09:36 Fri
In reply to Stuart William:

> I can’t make up my mind whether it’s a piss take or whether they are meaning something more along the lines of “you thought it was just a conspiracy theory, but open your eyes...”

> Genuinely curious as to how the post was meant. But thanks all the same for your insights. 


The fact that he actually calls his post "Conspiracy Theories" suggests to me he's taking the piss out of people who promote such nonsense by postulating what they are likely thinking right now. Conspiracy theorists don't tend to think of their ideas as conspiracy theories but "the truth", its the rest of us that see them as conspiracy theories.

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aln 10:17 Fri
In reply to summo:

> Bliar's been very quiet lately too. No doubt holed in one of his many properties. 

You do realise Thatcher isn't really dead and her and Tony are holed up with others in a crystal pyramid under the Antarctic ice? Their species lives a lot longer than humans. They probably created and released the virus, no threat to them as they're immune. Have you seen a lizard with coronavirus? Well HAVE YOU? Didn't think so!

Post edited at 10:18
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Smith42 22:02 Fri
In reply to pec:

I saw something on Sky news which said the Coronavirus originated from an accident at the Chinese Military Centre for Biological Warfare which was based in the Wuhan province. I couldn’t find any corroboration for this and the story didn’t repeat. So maybe Sky fact checked and it was fake news.
So I posted tongue in cheek cos as a mechanism for social change this outbreak  has proven very effective. 
But since I posted it’s been reported by China that the rate of infection is lower than in Italy or Spain. 
Italy and China. Population of 60 million with top health care system compared to China’s 1300million. Something is not adding up. 

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gravy 22:09 Fri
In reply to tom_in_edinburgh:

"Coronavirus is a natural disease. "

The virus is a natural phenomenon.  The pandemic is a man-made problem.

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ena sharples 22:09 Fri
In reply to Smith42:

Admit it-you've been taking those David Icke pills again, haven't you?

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In reply to Smith42:

> Italy and China. Population of 60 million with top health care system compared to China’s 1300million. Something is not adding up. 

Possibly you are not adding up the level of state control in China compared to Western countries? 

Probably one of the few times when it could be argued that (well directed) dictatorial  control could be a good thing.

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In reply to summo:

> You'll notice though that most other political leaders are quiet.. They either think that there isn't really much else any government could do to fix a problem that appears 3 months ago and know all countries are making it up as they go along.. or they are thinking thank fu@k they aren't PM. 

Obviously untrue.  China, Taiwan, South Korea etc are not making it up as they go along.  They had extensive plans and preparations after the SARS and MERS outbreaks where we were lazy and penny pinching.   They handled and controlled it far better than the UK and US despite having had less warning.   

China could build a fever hospital for Wuhan and fill it full of equipment and staff in a week.  When you look at the pictures you see a ton of ventilators and people in full PPE suits.  That didn't just happen by magic, they were prepared.   They were also giving many patients anti-viral drugs.

Hunt refused to buy protection equipment requested by the UK flu pandemic preparation exercise due to cost.  Trump fired the people at CDC responsible for pandemic preparation because they hadn't been needed for a while.

The UK saw the outbreak in China and in Italy and kept its borders open.  The reason the sh*t is hitting the fan so hard now is that a ton of people went on holiday to Italy and came back infected.   The UK dithered far too long about locking down.  They didn't follow, and still aren't following WHO advice e.g. WHO says 14 day isolation if you get symptoms, UK says 7 is enough.   They didn't establish effective cordons around hotspots.  They didn't join in EU wide procurement for PPE and ventilators.

A reasonably competent government could have avoided the huge surge in cases that are about to hit us and been far better placed to deal with what did occur.

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summo 06:40 Sat
In reply to tom_in_edinburgh:

> Obviously untrue.  China, Taiwan, South Korea etc are not making it up as they go along.  They had extensive plans and preparations after the SARS and MERS outbreaks where we were lazy and penny pinching.   They handled and controlled it far better than the UK and US despite having had less warning.   

Yes. I'll partial agree and if the West had just cut all air travel we'd have been better off. Hindsight. We didn't severe all air travel for sars and mers, the West followed the sane plan.

> China could build a fever hospital for Wuhan and fill it full of equipment and staff in a week.  When you look at the pictures you see a ton of ventilators and people in full PPE suits.  That didn't just happen by magic, they were prepared.   They were also giving many patients anti-viral drugs.

Anti viral Drugs.. what drugs?

New built hospital..  it was effectively rows of portacabins joined together. 

> Hunt refused to buy protection equipment requested by the UK flu pandemic preparation exercise due to cost.  Trump fired the people at CDC responsible for pandemic preparation because they hadn't been needed for a while.

Lots of hindsight.. what if it was Ebola and not covid? Etc. 

> A reasonably competent government could have avoided the huge surge in cases that are about to hit us and been far better placed to deal with what did occur.

I'll agree. Europe missed countless chances to reduce the damage. The UK isn't any better or worse than any other in Europe. Nearly all were way too slow. Even now the measures are too weak.. it'll rumble on for months. This leaving to exercise and dog walk is a joke. 

I'm just waiting for you to tell us an snp immune system is better than a Westminster one. 

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felt 07:07 Sat
In reply to summo:

> Do they [Rothmans] even exist anymore? I've no idea. 

It's very fishy. I associate the brand with gold-braided "officer" cuffs on a pilot's arm, his hand nonchalantly resting on a walnut steering wheel of (what is now) a vintage Jag. These three things, Rothies, pilots and Jaguar, all gone, all at once. 

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veteye 07:33 Sat
In reply to tom_in_edinburgh:

 They didn't join in EU wide procurement for PPE and ventilators.

> A reasonably competent government could have avoided the huge surge in cases that are about to hit us and been far better placed to deal with what did occur.

There was a mistake in communication on the EU side about buying ventilators, and we were unintentionally left out.

If the tighter controls on movement had been placed earlier, a lot of people would have thought them unnecessary, as there would have been little outward sign of severe spread of disease at that point. Thus there would have been reluctance in a large part of the populace to obey the rules. The only way round that would have been a more police state approach, and that is not a particularly British/UK thing.

I believe that if the interviews by Steven Nolan on Radio 5 had been broadcast across all the networks, then people would have believed in the real threat at an earlier stage. One of these, I spread across friends and relatives via an email link, and every single person who listened had an immediate change in view of the degree of threat. The interview was an appeal from an A+E consultant for people to stay at home, before the government action.

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marsbar 07:40 Sat
In reply to veteye:

The EU says we were represented in meetings where the procurement was discussed.

If there was a communication problem it wasn't down to the EU.  

https://audiovisual.ec.europa.eu/embed/index.html?ref=I-187505&lg=en&fbclid=IwAR2_Caq1wS2P80vid4Lf6xjrZDiUAtRlf5d4m8OhFoFJBq0BzYe-sq8zj4M

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veteye 07:44 Sat
In reply to marsbar:

What you say may be true, but the BBC said that the EU admitted that there had been a communication mistake on their side. Probably somebody on our side should have chased it up as well. The actual ordering would not have been done for the whole group in the UK, it would have been in Brussels or similar, and on that side they probably did not carefully enough go through the list of intending participants.

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jkarran 08:58 Sat
In reply to Baz P:

> I’m not usually into conspiracy theories but I find it slightly unusual that a country a large as Russia at present has 799 cases of Corvid 19 with 3 deaths.

Two optiins: it got established there late or the numbers are wrong for one reason or another. 

OP: top trolling

Jk

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Ian W 09:28 Sat
In reply to veteye:

> What you say may be true, but the BBC said that the EU admitted that there had been a communication mistake on their side. Probably somebody on our side should have chased it up as well. The actual ordering would not have been done for the whole group in the UK, it would have been in Brussels or similar, and on that side they probably did not carefully enough go through the list of intending participants.


Its ok though - we've apparently given an order for 10k ventilators to a company that has neither a design for ventilators, nor a facility to build them in locally. Even if they could build them, their factory is in singapore, which is a 4 - 6 week delivery lead time away. I wonder if the PO had Graylings signature on it........

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In reply to veteye:

> What you say may be true, but the BBC said that the EU admitted that there had been a communication mistake on their side. Probably somebody on our side should have chased it up as well. 

The BBC is full of sh*te, even more so since the emergency powers law was brought in.  They are feeding us wartime style propaganda full of happy news stories about brave British boffins building a ventilator industry from scratch in two weeks and clapping the NHS.   Now they are cutting Scottish news bulletins and replacing with UK coverage to gaslight the devolved government.

The EU says ministers were present when offer was made.  UK doesn't want to participate in any EU programs because they are determined to get a Canada style free-trade deal and disengage from EU.  Not taking part in this procurement is consistent with every other decision they have made recently, its far from the only useful EU program and organisation they are leaving.  They are putting Brexit before breathing.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/boris-johnson-coronavirus-trump-ventilators-uk-us-latest-a9431371.html

Yes, if tighter controls had been brought in earlier a lot of people would have thought they were unnecessary.  So what.   There's an epidemic with an exponential growth curve and a 7 to 14 day incubation period.  It doubles every 3 days, which means there are just under 5 doubling times in a 14 day period of 2^5 = 32 x as many cases.  You need to act before the problem looks bad.   A competent government would have looked at the maths, ignored public opinion, and acted faster.

Post edited at 15:35
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In reply to summo:

> Yes. I'll partial agree and if the West had just cut all air travel we'd have been better off. Hindsight. We didn't severe all air travel for sars and mers, the West followed the sane plan.

I said at the time it was f*cking stupid.  So did many others.  The UK was way out of line with WTO advice and best practice among other countries and it was intentional because they had this insane model that there was no alternative and you may as well let it pass through the population quickly.

> Anti viral Drugs.. what drugs?

Chloroquinine and HIV medicine.

> New built hospital..  it was effectively rows of portacabins joined together. 

It was a mobile design they created after SARS specifically to deal with this kind of infectious disease.  It was obvious to them there would be more occurrences, just like it was obvious to Taiwan, South Korea, Hong Kong and many planners in the US and UK.  But the right wing governments refused to spend money preparing for something that might not happen.  Politicians were acting like stupid laymen following 'common sense' and thinking it was something that only happened in Asia.  The reason is our politics is full of lawyers and PPE graduates, they don't think like scientists and you can't convince them with maths.

> Lots of hindsight.. what if it was Ebola and not covid? Etc. 

FFS.   It isn't hindsight when other countries were prepared and responded properly at the time.  What it was is lack of foresight from the UK.   Due to political choices made by the Tories.  They thought aircraft carriers, nuclear missile submarines were more important than pandemic preparation and they imposed austerity and ran the NHS with zero spare capacity.

This is starting to go through the classic Yes Prime Minister list of excuses for a complete government f*ck up.

> I'll agree. Europe missed countless chances to reduce the damage. The UK isn't any better or worse than any other in Europe. Nearly all were way too slow. Even now the measures are too weak.. it'll rumble on for months. This leaving to exercise and dog walk is a joke. 

UK is far worse because it saw the sh*t hit the fan in Italy and let people go on holiday there.  Even football games with visiting teams.  It was intentional.

> I'm just waiting for you to tell us an snp immune system is better than a Westminster one. 

Just about any f*cking system is better than a Westminster or Trump one.   They are the standout least competent responses in the entire world.

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