UKH

I have been losing weight for the last few months, I'm about 12kg down on my summer weight. I have cut out processed sugar, although still eating a little fruit and a wee tsp of honey in my porridge in the morning (it's just too bland otherwise!). The other change I have made is buying a smaller bowl to regulate my portion sizes and if I am using a dinner plate then I am trying to half fill it with leafy stuff or light veg. (Your brain thinks you are full if you have eaten a full plate, even if it is a smaller plate than normal or full of lower calorie foods). It has really worked, I can now recognise when I am actually hungry or full. 

In the past I have lost a load of weight and been very thin, but it was more through will power and slightly obsessive calorie counting. I kept it down for quite a few years, but then went back to uni and the weight went back up. I don't think I ever really knew how to recognise real hunger etc.

This change has amazed me, I just assumed I would never recognise it. I really noticed it last night when we got a takeaway curry with a friend. I ate a little more than I needed, and then a couple of hours later went for a run and felt so sick (not normal for me). Then this morning I still felt over full right through to around lunch time and even then I wasn't all that hungry and had a smaller lunch than usual (I ran 7.5km just before lunch, or I don't think I would even have wanted any). 

This is a very odd feeling for my body to, presumably, be reacting to overeating as it is meant to! Is this how people's bodies normally work if you have never had a weight problem? You just eat less after overeating?

In reply to girlymonkey:

I've been on the one meal a day thing, or 20/4, or whatever this weeks trendy name for it is. I started by reducing breakfast from two slices of toast, to one. Then postponing it until about 11. Then reducing lunch. I work from home, or in the office. So some weeks, it's a sociable lunch with colleagues. Other weeks it's beans, boiled eggs or yesterdays leftovers reheated. 

Then I realised that I wasn't eating much at lunch time so I postponed that until mid afternoon. Then eventually just an evening meal. Not an overly healthy meal and in normal portions. Possibly with beer or wine.

I've also been doing long runs in a fasted state. First 10 then 20km. On Sunday I did 37.5km on an empty stomach and I didn't take any fluids with me. I'd like to say it was easy. It wasn't. It hurt, but I got round. I've done the same loop a few times, but always with food in me. The 'running on empty' feeling for the last few km wasn't that much different.

It's not a sustainable dietary choice. However, it has shown me how little I need to eat, in order to get by. I think the hunger reflex is something that can be trained and you can train it it both directions. One way to block out hunger pangs. The other to insist on eating, as a reaction to any slight feeling of hunger.

In reply to dread-i:

I'm interested at what point you think you reached this unsustainable level?
I usually eat first meal at 2:20pm (or earlier if it's an active day, or cicumstances dictate), and whenever I want on weekends - and I feel I'm fully sustainable at this point and could do this forever.

In reply to dread-i:

To what end are you eating quite so little? If you think it's not sustainable, have you got a particular goal in mind after which you will change to a more sustainable pattern?

In reply to girlymonkey:

My appetite is fairly well regulated until I see pasta. I once weighed out a recommended portion and my head was going what on earth is that. It's a 2 years old's portion. Add more. Scales must be wrong. When cooking it I always end up making enough for 4 and eating more than half of it. I've learned to just skip the pasta isle now, it's the only way. 

In reply to snoop6060:

Have you tried puting it in a smaller bowl so it looks like a full portion? It's weird, it really works (for me anyway). If you serve it up away from the table and use the right size plate or bowl for your correct sized portion you do feel full after it. I also never ( and haven't for a long time) eat white carbs. All pasta, bread and rice is wholegrain so keeps your feeling full for longer

In reply to girlymonkey:

The human stomach is actually quite small, it's not evolved to eat massive amounts in 1 or 2 sittings a day. It's little wonder it protests at relative binges, it can't cope. Better to graze, nibble, multiple small meals. The challenge is keeping them all healthy. Steady eating also makes it easier for your body to regulate sugar levels, regular sensible eating is the basis of all diet controlled diabetics. 

In reply to summo:

I think what has amazed me is that it has never objected to big meals in the past and my brain has never been any good at regulating my appetite, despite me having reduced food intake in the past to lose weight. I wonder why it has suddenly started acting as it is meant to in my late 30s. Even as a child I don't remember having any feeling of having eaten too much and I would always eat more if it was there (not that my parents let me, so weight wasn't really a problem until I started cooking for myself)

In reply to girlymonkey:

I've read that the stomach is obviously stretching elastic.. it becomes accustomed to the volume of normally receives, but like most body parts becomes less stretchy with age. 

In reply to summo:

Interesting, it could be to do with that I guess. 

In reply to SenzuBean & girlymonkey:

Its unsustainable in that:

A) It's anti social. "I don't want to go to lunch with you, as I'm going to wander the streets for 30 - 60 mins instead."

B) I want to get my body fat down to about 15%. I think this is probably about right for my lifestyle. Enough lard to power me through ultras, but light enough so that I'm not carrying excess baggage. I think that body fat is a better marker for health, than weight.

In reply to girlymonkey:

At this time of the year I'm not cycling much but still walking once a week. I manage to keep the weight almost in equilibrium, have gone from 75 to 78 kilos but still take the same trouser size as when I was 20. 

The key for me is to avoid drinking beer, which I do a lot on trips to Africa so I always come back feeling pudgy and tight round the waist. That returns to normal though within a month on my normal diet.

In reply to Rigid Raider:

I don't drink anyway, never liked it. Also never been into fizzy drinks etc. 

My weakness is chocolate. I think cutting it out has been the biggest thing that has impacted my weight. Now I have been off it for a few months, I am actually not missing it. I don't crave it or anything sugary at all. Exercise does increase my appetite (but hardly at all increases my calories burned), so I now make sure I have a good small but high protein snack after exercise so I don't add many calories but my body is happy it has been refueled. The best is if I run before breakfast and then just eat normal breakfast. 

In reply to summo:

After doing a bit of research I've switched to eating 2 large meals and not eating in between. I find it's improved my gut health. Other advantages too.

Not sure what you mean by 'steady eating' or 'regular sensible eating' but I've heard  intermittent fasting and/or ketogenic diet can be effective to reverse insulin resistance and type 2 diabetes.

In reply to 1poundSOCKS:

I guess it's not impossible that different people's bodies respond differently to different patterns of eating. I suppose it's learning how your body functions and how that fits around your lifestyle too. 

In reply to girlymonkey:

Totally agree. My lifestyle changes, sometimes my diet changes. And not always for the best. Working out how to fit a good diet around your life can be challenging. Working out what a good diet is can be challenging. 

In reply to girlymonkey:

I just shovel it into my mouth straight from pan after polishing off my tiny bowl

In reply to summo:

Are you sure? There are plenty of mammals that will gorge on food, while it's present, rather than eat little bits during the day, in fact most primates do, especially if they are not herbivores, they only reason the herbivores eat all day is because of the poor calorific / nutritional content of what they are chomping on. Eating quickly and as much as possible is an evolutionary way of stopping predators nicking your grub.

In reply to krikoman:

I can see humans with our fight or flight instinct gorging when it was safe/possible to in the past. I think there's potentially a 'range' between which the stomach operates, a relative talks about overeating on walking holidays or over Xmas and getting up feeling very hungry, and the converse happening other times. Your last sentence reminds me of growing up being the youngest and looking at 'seconds' disappearing before my eyes.

In reply to girlymonkey:

I got my appetite back under control in 2013 by doing the 5:2 "fasting" diet for three months or so, losing 5kg of unnecessary fat in the process and learning that hunger goes away if you ignore it. Then I got dose of Norovirus on holiday which hit pretty hard, lowest weight (mass, actually) was about 60kg (I'm 1.78 metres). Anyway, I survived and now aim to be between 62 and 64kg, happy to go out running or biking fasted, don't snack or graze during the day and rely on fat-burning for energy most of the time. Long days in the hills require jelly babies etc to top up reserves but being fat-adapted is a real asset. The idea of constant small meals/snacks makes apparent sense but is completely wrong as far as I am concerned - the body needs a rest from digestion and fat cells need to be depleted!

In reply to girlymonkey:

One thing I've noticed is that I find it very easy to maintain strict control during the Summer and nigh on impossible during Winter.

In reply to DubyaJamesDubya:

Interesting, I find the opposite! In summer I work away from home a lot, eating in restaurants and eating with clients a lot. So no home cooking and little control of my portion sizes etc. In winter I am mostly at home so can control much more easily what I buy and cook and how much I have.

In reply to girlymonkey:

Great work on your efforts, sounds like you have it cracked. 

Honestly, I wouldn't fret about not being able to run after eating a curry. It's a heavy meal and will take a good amount of time to digest. I usually can't do much until the next morning after a curry or other rich meals. 

I certainly eat less if I overindulge in my portions. 

Keep at it and keep your primary goal in focus. 

In reply to girlymonkey:

To add to this, not knowing what your diet is, makes this difficult to say, but if you've cut out sugars then you may be 'reacting' to the sugars in the curry. 

I know I went for a while (purely by accident) without eating grains or carby foods, then had a normal-sized bowl of quinoa and really felt like crap for hours. 

Worth speaking to a dietitian if it concerns you. They will be able to give informed advice, not internet garbage like my words.  

In reply to girlymonkey:

Maybe I’m oversensitised as my daughter has an eating disorder, but parts of your post are screaming at me. Hopefully all is well, but be very careful you do not travel that particular road. It’s not a good journey and the destination is hell.

In reply to JimR:

I think you probably are oversensitised to it.

Just out of interest, what rang alarm bells for you?

I badly needed to lose the weight, I was in the obese category of BMI (which I know has its issues, but is a reasonable indicator) and really needed to lose about 15kg. I have maintained a healthy, balanced diet and worked out how to make my brain understand when I am full, which is something it never understood before. My weight loss has been steady and my goal is not to be as thin as possible, but to be a healthy size which doesn't put strain on my joints etc. I will probably lose another 3 kg and then work out how to tweak my eating to maintain the size I am then. It's about being healthy, not skinny. (My body will never do skinny - I have chunky muscles and intend to keep it that way! My mum says my arms look like Desperate Dan, and I am proud of that! Lol)

I'm sorry that your daughter has gone through so much difficulty with disordered eating, I hope she is managing to get the help she needs? From what I have heard, eating disorders can be so hard to treat. 

In reply to cap'nChino:

No, not concerned by it, I guess more surprised, and wondering why it has never happened before even when I was thin last time. I guess, as much as anything, just musing on the way bodies change and adapt without us really understanding what is going on inside.

In reply to girlymonkey:

BMI is not a great indicator of whether you're too fat or not (e.g. all muscular rugby types are technically obese) but it is definitely of value in terms of 'being too heavy is bad for general wear and tear on your body'.

That is exactly the right way to think.

In reply to Toerag:

I'm chunky, but not rugby player levels of muscle! I think I should ideally be between mid to high end of the "normal" range of BMI. If I was to end up in the lower end then I would have too little body fat and would be unhealthy. One of my big priorities is having functional knees into old age, so keeping the weight lower is fairly key for this I think ( as is keeping my legs strong)