Access to Property

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 Bojo 18 Nov 2022

Does anyone know? Am I right in saying that the only people entitled to enter the property of a deceased person are his or her executors?

Thanks in advance for any info.

 freeflyer 18 Nov 2022
In reply to Bojo:

The law is unlikely to help you very much. I suggest changing the locks.

Sorry to hear about your current situation

ff

 SouthernSteve 18 Nov 2022
In reply to Bojo:

That would depend if anyone lived there with the deceased. If not, the change locks suggestion sounds very good to me. I am not sure what the situation would be if there were court appointed debt collectors or similar involved. Are you handling the estate yourself? If so, speaking to Citizens Advice might be useful, otherwise using a family-orientated solicitor can be a great weight off your mind.

This is not the time you want to be thinking about legalities and having any strife. I hope it all gets sorted.

OP Bojo 18 Nov 2022
In reply to SouthernSteve and freeflyer:

Mrs. Bojo is an executor along with her son. Just that we have a suspicion that an estranged sister of the deceased might try to access the property. We have reason to believe that she MIGHT have a key.

I suppose we could put a padlock and hasp on each external door.

Post edited at 15:28
 Ridge 18 Nov 2022
In reply to Bojo:

> I suppose we could put a padlock and hasp on each external door.

It'd probably be as easy, and certainly more secure to change the locks with a like for like replacement, unless they're really ancient. Even cheaper to put an internal bolt(s) on the back door and just change the front.

 dread-i 18 Nov 2022
In reply to Bojo:

>Mrs. Bojo is an executor along with her son. Just that we have a suspicion that an estranged sister of the deceased might try to access the property. We have reason to believe that she MIGHT have a key.

There are some offers on cctv cameras on amazon, at the moment. You could put a couple inside and outside. Some will talk via wifi, others have SD cards. If there is someone poking around, you'd have proof. With an internet connection, you'd have an alert and off site storage. Also, scrotes may notice the house is unoccupied and think it easy pickings. Probably worth getting some timers for lights.

Changing a lock is pretty easy for a diy'er. Locksmiths will charge a call out fee, emergency locksmiths charge an arm and a leg. I'd get to b&q and change them asap. If some distant relative moves in, and says they had an agreement with the deceased, you'd have a lot of trouble and expense proving that was not the case.

 Billhook 18 Nov 2022
In reply to Bojo:

Put it another way.  

You have no automatic legal right to enter your next door neighbour's house.  Neither do you have a legal right to enter any of your sibling's houses, or your offspring if they live elsewhere. Nor do they have an automatic right to enter your house if they are living elsewhere.

If you are concerned about what she might do, then I'd do what the others are suggesting and to make sure she's locked out.

You might want to, to avoid her getting angry if she turns up at the house unanounced and finds she's been locked out, is to contact her - email? saying that for security concerns you have changed the locks or whatever but if she wishes to contact you, you could arrange a visit (with you present).d

As an executor it is your job to look after her estate.

OP Bojo 18 Nov 2022
In reply to Billhook:

> Put it another way.  

 As an executor it is your job to look after HIS estate.

7
OP Bojo 19 Nov 2022

Is the installation of a camera in these circumstances dependent on a computer installation in the house that is being monitored and will I be able to view images from 50-60 moles away. Apologies for my ignorance. Also it would need to be battery.

 MG 19 Nov 2022
In reply to Bojo:

What are you going to do if someone enters? Are you really going to take a relative to court, and if so for what?

Just change the lock if it's bothering you 

1
 Brown 19 Nov 2022
In reply to Bojo:

If you have an internet connection at the property you can get a internet connected CCTV camera for about £30. This will need a mains power connection and the home router.

You could connect it with a 4g wireless router or possibly at hot spot mobile if there is no wired internet.

This can be set up with alarms etc to alert you to it detecting movement, (allowing you to view remotely) however it basically stores the data in the camera so is vulnerable to someone just removing it.

Its all Chinese low data security equipment so I doubt it's secure or private in any real way but it's good for putting off unsophisticated trouble. I did it when leaving property unoccupied for a while and it made me feel better.

Post edited at 18:05
In reply to Bojo:

> will I be able to view images from 50-60 moles away.

Moles aren’t very long so I imagine you’ll be fine with a long extension cable fed out of a window.

More seriously, you can get internet enabled cameras that will allow remote access. The bigger question is what would you do with the footage if you did catch them entering? Changing the locks and preventing entry in the first place seems like far less hassle and far more effective than trying to take any action after they have done so. 

I presume part of the concern is this person preemptively claiming items that they believe they deserve to inherit (my assumption is based on experience of people doing exactly this and quietly removing bits of jewellery from a property). If your wife challenged them with the footage, and they told her to get lost, then that only leaves legal action which is probably time consuming, costly, and not guaranteed to be successful (especially as footage of them entering the property doesn’t necessarily prove that they took anything). And I suspect that legal action would cause far more strife than an uncomfortable discussion about locks being changed. 

Sorry for your loss, and sorry to hear that there might be some tricky family dynamics to contend with - I know how much stress that can add at a time when you least want it. 

 Jenny C 19 Nov 2022
In reply to Bojo:

First thing I would do is remove any items of obvious value for safekeeping, burglars love empty properties, so even without the relative issue removing money, jewellery etc is a good idea. Keep a record of what's removed, so it can be suitably distributed according to the will at a subsequent date.

As others have said, for peace of mind changing the locks is probably the best way forward. 

In reply to Bojo:

In addition to helpful comments from others.

As others have pointed out the executors are responsible for all the assets of the estate and must take any prudent action necessary to keep them safe. They may have to find insurance cover appropriate to risk and needs. There are apparently companies specialising in providing insurance cover for a deceased’s assets so you may need to seek them out if current insurers won’t cover things.

You should check insurance policies in force - it is not uncommon for things like valuables, cars, etc., not to be covered from the date of death. Don’t delay in making enquiries I would suggest.

I’ve twice been an executor. One time all valuables, and certain other things in the property were not covered at all from the date of death and in that company’s T&Cs would not be (would have had to go to a different insurance company) and they would only cover the remainder of contents and the likes of building with additional conditions and payment of an additional premium which I had to make to ensure cover. I also in that same instance had only 10 days (iirc, might have been 7) to remove the deceased’s car from the public highway and sorn it as executor or the insurance would be cancelled and all the potential consequences that could entail. I chose to drive it to my home (they covered me driving without any charge and have it off-road until I got probate granted and so to be allowed to sell it.

The other one (different insurance company) all valuables were to be covered but only for a limited period only and subject to certain terms, so I chose to remove and store safely.

One thing for the executors to be aware of when trying to speak to the different companies involved in all aspects of dealing with the estate, is the easiest way to get through the security, etc., and speak to knowledgeable staff to start discussions, take actions, etc.  is to ask for their bereavement department. Any large company should have the later and they are trained to deal with executors on a more sympathetic and knowledgeable basis.

I had to remind many companies that I was the executor and so I could or could not do x,y,z at whatever stage and they would have to wait (eg they were demanding bills paid). On the other hand not speaking to bereavement depts can lead to inaction. One example, I told the deceased’s bank to remove her online access that they had to another’s bank account (her parents account). They ignored it (don’t think they believed I was actually the executor) and two years later I was still dealing with it.

If in any doubt of executors’ responsibilities I would strongly recommend that the executors seek appropriate professional advice including legal as needed.

Post edited at 20:10
In reply to Bojo:

Change the locks. ASAP.

jcm

 MG 19 Nov 2022
In reply to Climbing Pieman:

Very good advice 

Id also recommend a spreadsheet with all accounts, insurances, properties etc and columns recording when and how they were all contacted (e.g. phoned, recieved forms, returned forms, account closed, value ,funds transferred etc) . 

 gethin_allen 19 Nov 2022
In reply to Bojo:

If there are multiple access points and you know this person only has a key to some of them you could simply stick a key in the lock inside and turn it a quarter turn. That way the lock can't be used from the outside and you just let yourself out of the other door that they don't have a key to.

 fred99 21 Nov 2022
In reply to Bojo:

When my mother died I simply switched the lock barrels between the front and back doors - both doors being the plastic double-glazing sort that had been done at the same time.

Reason - lots of people had front door keys - my siblings, care workers, etc.. I had the impression (but no proof of course) that some stuff had either been moved or removed. Swapping barrels solve the problem, and of course I then had spare keys for what was now the front door to hand over later.

 apache 22 Nov 2022
In reply to Bojo:

Rather than go to the cost of replacing the locks- if the door handles are levers, then get some heavy duty tie wraps and put them round the handles. Very simple and effective, easy to remove as well once you are inside


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