A serial swindler (ltd) small claims courts?

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 Timmd 04 Sep 2020

Today I read about a friend who has paid a lady who advertisers herself as helping out up and coming businesses (I'm not sure in what capacity), who's gone onto not deliver on what she advertises and kept the money. 

She's been in touch with CAB and Trading Standards, and TS are already aware of her, and she has a habit of opening a company, swindling people then closing down and starting again. 

From what my friend has written, she does this in the capacity of a limited company, I'm guessing that this is so she can't be held personally liable for the money she keeps when not doing what has been paid for.

Would the small claims courts be a possibility, or is it basically hopeless?

1
In reply to Timmd:

Basically hopeless.

jcm

 Dave Garnett 04 Sep 2020
In reply to johncoxmysteriously:

Can't she at least be disqualified from being a director?

gezebo 04 Sep 2020
In reply to Timmd:

Sounds more like it’s a criminal issue and the Fraud Act may be a more suitable line of investigation. 

OP Timmd 04 Sep 2020
In reply to johncoxmysteriously:

Thanks, I thought as much. 

OP Timmd 04 Sep 2020
In reply to Dave Garnett:

I gather that family members are being used as directors. She has a facebook and other social media profile, and there's quite a lot on other social media about her business practices and string of companies she has been involved in.

Post edited at 16:30
 Deri Jones 04 Sep 2020
In reply to Timmd:

Have a look at this set of information from the House of Commons library regarding Phoenix trading using Ltd companies - there may be some recourse to getting the director banned, but I wouldn't hold your breath unless there are substantial amount involved. You could raise it with your MP?

https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/sn04083/

In reply to Timmd:

> I gather that family members are being used as directors. She has a facebook and other social media profile, and there's quite a lot on other social media about her business practices and string of companies she has been involved in.

Can you share so we can see if there's  a LinkedIn profile too. If she cant get business, she can't defraud people. 

Rogue Traders would be keen to hear about her too.

I hate to hear about stories like this, boils my pissle.

 muppetfilter 04 Sep 2020
In reply to Timmd:

He could always do it the Chicago Way ....

http://www.thebaseballshop.co.uk/baseball-bats-c11

1
 Ridge 04 Sep 2020
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:

> boils my pissle.

Ouch! 😫

OP Timmd 04 Sep 2020
In reply to TheDrunkenBakers:

I shall do when I've had more sleep, either tomorrow or Sunday. 

 Billhook 05 Sep 2020
In reply to Timmd:

The SCC can only be used to claim unpaid debts.  It cannot be used to obtain compensation or damages.

3
In reply to Billhook:

Rubbish. Goodness, why do people post this stuff?

jcm

1
In reply to Dave Garnett:

> Can't she at least be disqualified from being a director?

Oh, sure, you can wind up the company and pay an insolvency practitioner to do all sorts of stuff. It is even possible - unlikely, but possible - that if you were to spend let us say a hundred thousand pounds in costs, you might be able to recover the few quid the company owes you to put towards those costs. And. yes, you might be able to get her disqualified

jcm

 Billhook 05 Sep 2020
In reply to johncoxmysteriously:

What charm school did you go to? You obviously wasted your money!.  Either way you won't get your money back in a small claims court.

Have a nice weekend.

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/reclaim/small-claims-court/

However, this particular incident may well be fraud. Its rather difficult to tell from the short sentence posted.

8
 Toby_W 05 Sep 2020
In reply to Billhook:

You know what John does for a living....?

OP Timmd 05 Sep 2020
In reply to Billhook:

My friend paid for some kind of online course, it now transpires, and the lady paid has kept the money without delivering.

Taking a neutral position on the online personae or written tone of any posters , I understand that John/jcm works in a legal capacity.

Post edited at 15:26
Removed User 05 Sep 2020
In reply to Timmd:

From bitter experience I can advise that you can get awarded a judgement in your favour and the court will instruct the individual to pay but if they choose to ignore it not much can be done in reality.

I was pretty shocked by the toothlessness of the courts.

OP Timmd 05 Sep 2020
In reply to Removed UserBilberry: I see, she has a few country court rulings against her already I think, and has continued on in her merry way, and has done well enough to keep a horse it seems, going on her facebook page.

 Jamie Wakeham 05 Sep 2020
In reply to Timmd:

How did the friend pay?  If it was by card, they ought to be able to get the card company to refund under section 75 (credit card) or a chargeback (debit)?

JCM - thinking out loud, is there any way one could take the swindler to the county court and, upon winning, ask the judge to make the order against the swindler personally, rather than the limited company? 

Removed User 05 Sep 2020
In reply to Jamie Wakeham:

> How did the friend pay?  If it was by card, they ought to be able to get the card company to refund under section 75 (credit card) or a chargeback (debit)?

> JCM - thinking out loud, is there any way one could take the swindler to the county court and, upon winning, ask the judge to make the order against the swindler personally, rather than the limited company? 


I think in cases of fraud the directors can be individually liable and not hide behind the limited shell.  However, it gets you nowhere still unfortunately.  Even court enforcement officers aren't allowed to enter without consent - and have to give 7 days' notice of their visit...and that assumes they know where the person lives...

 Jamie Wakeham 05 Sep 2020
In reply to Removed UserBilberry:

Possibly she'd care enough about having her personal credit score ruined by an unsettled CCJ and would therefore pay up.  

But I've no idea if a judge could order this.

In reply to Billhook:

And which part of that link made you think damages claims can't be brought in the small claims court?

jcm

1
In reply to Removed UserBilberry:

I knew someone who drove the van for the Central London county court bailiffs. He lasted six months, and in that time they didn't take away a single stick of furniture. If you can't find a car, bailiffs are useless.

jcm


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