UKH

Hi all,

I am currently looking into potential dissertation topics and I am somewhat inquisitive as to weather there are grounds for research on the peak district as a space in which certain recreation types are struggling to coexist.

In order to gain some context I wondered if you had any particular feelings about how climbers affect your capacity to enjoy natural spaces when you are engaging in recreation that is not climbing, specifically in the peak district if possible!

Examples would be great or just feelings on the matter, anything helps ! 

Personally when I am out enjoying the hills on a run/walk/bike ride seeing & hearing climbers really irritates me.

Mainly because for whatever reason they are getting out climbing and I'm having to make do with a walk/run/bike.

Lucky buggers

I don't usually have a big problem with climbers from a recreational point of view. They are relatively quiet and don't block other activities, unlike off roading or grouse shooting. ( for example)

I sometimes worry about habitat/ nest disturbance, but that's a different issue

I always marvel that climbers leave little visible impact from their activities - it takes someone with a keen eye to spot bolts or chalk marks when walking past a crag - the same could also be said for those who enjoy a spot of dry tooling, I've yet to notice any impact, positive or negative they have on the place, other than seeing people just out enjoying the natural resources we have in and around The Peaks 

The weather in the Peak certainly affects my experience!   

I've never been aware of other climbers affecting my non-climbng day outdoor expereinces but I know other people may feel differently. I've walked behind a chap walking his dog under some local crags and heard him complaining about people climbing there - no particular reason that I  heard - think he was just a miserable Yorkshire git! 

Another time on the Ormes a sea angler confronted us as we were walking back to the car and started going on about how he'd like to cut climbers ropes. We didn't bother replying 

4/10

Excessive shouting, grunting, swearing can be really off-putting. I'm guilty of the latter, in spades. 

I'm a hill walker rather than a climber, and in Scotland / Lake District rather than the Peak District. Can't recall ever being annoyed seeing climbers climbing, it's certainly not been something which has ever reduced my enjoyment of the outdoors. Drones, on the other hand .... grrrr!!  That might be an area of conflict to give you more to write about!

I hate seeing other people when I'm enjoying natural spaces, regardless of whatever recreation they're engaging in.

Does that help?

I don’t know about you but I love the sound of a desperate Londoner dry humping zippy’s traverse in damp conditions having dumped all their unicorn dust on the holds.

Usually if there are enough climbers about to be annoying then there will be way more hikers around so the problem will be overcrowding in general. My pet hate is eMTBers anyway.

3/10 troll

I've gotta say, I think you're asking the wrong question to the wrong crowd. On a climbing forum, most people (we) aren't going to be frustrated by other climbers when we're out running, cycling, paragliding or whatever, but more curious as to what they're climbing, are they doing that move the same as I do, where's the next bit of pro going etc etc.

They (we) certainly aren't going to think they shouldn't be there because it's ruining our family picnic. Perhaps you should either be asking local rambling groups, trail runners, e-bikers, twitchers etc if climbers are affecting their enjoyment (if you haven't already), or if we climbers are affected by the aforementioned groups. 

It's in "Hilltalk" - very much a hill walking forum, especially if you're coming in to it via UKH instead of UKC.

I believe you are confusing "Dogging" with "Climbing".

Climbing?  Is that not another name for Wild Dogging?

I hate having to share pubs with crowds of climbers.  Not so much a problem in the Peak, though.

Here I was with my spray cans, just starting to spray my tag on  the base of the cliff, when these blokes turned up with lots of rope an dangly things telling me I was doing wrong.  Really pissed me off, so after they got off the ground I sprayed all their kit s a nice shade of sliver.

Later I decided to go birdwatching.   When I got back to the crag I noticed the Peregrines falcons had deserted the nest as the poor birds had happened to have used one of their climbing routes.

Then my neighbour  came in and told me she'd just seen another gang of climbers cleaning a new route.  This has totally destroyed a rare UK lichen, Lobaria Pumonaria which was on the crag.

 

Drone fliers vs pretty much anything else. They're awful.

I really dislike being at crags covered in climbers, Stanage etc being the top of my list to avoid on a busy day i.e most of the time, but I wouldn't limit my dislike to just climbing, the same applies to other hobbies I do (SUP, Kitesurfing, MTB etc).

I really don't get the herd mentality,  I so often see groups of people clustered together, when just a short distance away places are empty, my local beach is classic example 10+ miles of beach and all the kite surfers stick to a few hundred meters of it (great for me as I get to the rest to myself). same goes for the SUP crowd who stick within 20 meters of the beach with all the swimmers/tourists, while I'll go straight out for a mile or two and have the ocean to myself, apart from a few seals and porpoises etc. 

Genuinely interested by emtb specifically? Having had one for a year or so now after conventional bikes I honestly can't see how it would be a difference? I patiently wait to pass walkers as at the end of the day I will have some assistance to get back up to a leisurely pace swiftly afterwards. If anything it's much less annoying on an e bike being stuck behind a three wide group covering the whole path than it is on a standard bike as my momentum is a lot less critical. Plus with the legal limit, downhill would be no quicker than a standard MTB.

Genuinely curious as I may be in the minority but I'm just as cautious and patient if not more so on my emtb, would be a shame to hear they are bringing a bad name to the MTB scene in general. And also if there is anything specifically that makes them more antisocial. (Assuming we're not taking about stupid unlimited illegal models)

I have a dislike for climbers who flash my project, that I’ve spent days working on, and still can’t do.  Buggers.

I detest seeing climbers on the crag when I'm walking past with the wife and kids. It really irritates not being able to join in when seeing them having so much fun. I really think all climbing should be band if there is any chance I'm walking past and unable to climb to avoid any jealousy 

On a serious note I have many non climbing friends who really enjoy stopping and watching climbers and sometimes stop to have a chat. Are you thinking that maybe some non climbers get intimidated by crowds of climbers and are unable to share locations or more at the possibility people have an issue with the sport rather than the people when they don't have a true understanding of climbing. I know of some people who think the rock is being damaged by hammering in of tools etc thinking that's how it done these days not realising there is minimal damage until it us explained to them. Would be good to know any outcomes if you do this

I'll second that. Drones are a total PITA

"BuT ItS A rOckFax TOp FIfTEEEEeee RoUTe AnD A cLAssIC"

I used to think this but nowadays I'm more "Whatever, keeps 'em all in one place and leaves everything else for me"

In reply to the OP assuming it's not fairly lame troll attempt...

I'd be surprised if it's much of an issue beyond the "Honeypot" crags as there simply won't be enough climbers to upset others unless they happen to be the odd group of total bams.

Seems odd to focus on climbers, so will comment more broadly, based on my experience of the outdoors which is normally as a hillwalker 

1. Whichever type of recreation someone else is engaging in there is potential for them to affect my enjoyment if they are acting antisocially - eg playing loud music, act unfriendly when you go past them, drop litter, cause unnecessary damage to plants or infrastructure etc, or a mountain biker flying past very close at high speed. This isn't reserved for recreation types other than the one I'm engaging in either. An antisocial group of hillwalkers could affect my enjoyment just as much as an antisocial group of kite flyers.  This kind of thing is more likely the more people there are.

2. Some activities are inherently higher impact than others - eg would take 100s of climbers to make as much noise as one scrambler bike or 4x4, and 1000s to cause as much erosion. Grouse shooters have an enormous impact on the way landscapes are managed (which may or may not affect your enjoyment depending on perspective), and also result in access land being closed sometimes (which certainly affects enjoyment), and I don't think other recreational activities even come close to those impacts.

3. Depending on perspective, anyone can affect enjoyment regardless of whether they are behaving well or engaging in a different recreational activity. If you enjoy being the only person on a mountain but there are lots of other people there then they have affected your enjoyment. Or of all the car parking spots are full because of other people. Or if sheer footfall has eroded a path or caused a muddy bog near a gate then they have affected your enjoyment. Or of there are just too many other people then it causes problems with crowding and you might not feel as relaxed or able to simply enjoy what you're doing as much - eg going up Snowdon on a busy day is simply not that pleasant in my opinion because of the number of people. 

I hate having to share crags with crowds of climbers. Not so much a problem in Scotland though with careful crag choice.

Dogging is just part of climbing. Almost everyone does it, especially sport climbers.