UKH

Greetings everyone

Just a quick question.

What does everyone take with them on the hills/mountains for emergency protection from the elements?. We've always taken a couple of those large orange  bivi bags and a couple of foil blankets.

Are the small shelters any better such as the Rab?

Thank you

I always take one of these https://www.terra-nova.co.uk/storm-shelters-bothies/bothy-2/

Will work in an emergency but also you can get it out for a cuppa and sit down when the weather is foul. 

Group shelters are tonnes better than orange bivi bags, and have the added advantage you can have your lunch in them quite comfortably if it's a bit grim.

I have a Summit Gear Supalite bothy bag. Never had to use it in anger yet ...

https://www.summitgear.co.uk/product/supalite-reversible-bothy-bag-2-person...

Another vote for the supralite, 2 person is small enough to put in a jacket pocket.  In winter possibly also blizzard bag.  https://www.blizzardsurvival.com/product-category/bags-blankets/bags/

I have 2

https://rab.equipment/uk/sleeping-bags/tents/group-shelter-4-6 for when I am out with a group, used it in the lake district in horrible conditions whist coming up with a plan for getting the hell off the ridge as we were getting blown back.

Supalite 2 which is big enough for me, my partner and our dog, which we have used for a lunch break in what I would describe as "not ideal weather" and what she would describe as "are you trying to get us killed".

For the size and weight I would definitely recommend the Supalite 2 as you don't even think about it being at the bottom of your bag

2 man bothy bag, even if I'm on my own. Once I got into the way of routinely using it for a break in bad weather I got to really appreciate it. It's quick to deploy and to stuff back in its bag, and it's a place to think out of the wind and rain and to check maps and eat. Even talking is easier and the world is a rose-tinted place for a bit. (other colours are available). I think I bought whatever was cheapest at the time, around the £25 mark, from the old Field&Trek IIRC, and it's been in use for 15 years now. I'd replace it with the same if I had to.

Completely agree - used mine far more than I thought I would so stop my sarnies getting wet at lunchtime. I've got a cheap 4 man version. 

The supalite bothy, has loops points on the outside. I've been thinking that with a few well placed bits of string, a wall, some pegs and a bivi bag, I could make a reasonable tent like structure. Enough space to sit up in and keep your face out of the rain, with legs poking out in the bivi bag.

I've only used if for breaks, but it makes things much nicer. A two person bag can be used by one person.

I have the small one of these so I can include the dog!

yet another vote for the supalight bothy bag.  weights next to nothing and takes up virtually no space while being more versatile than a bivi esp in that you can both be in it - much warmer and psychologically better than isolated in individual plastic Bivis.  Foil blankets are rubbish generally - split far too easily and you can't do much whilst wearing them.  Either add an additional spare layer, or if you want something dedicated for emergencies try something like a blizzard survival jacket - massively warmer and once it's on you can rake about in rucksacks etc without losing it and any warmth you've built up.

Cheers,

+1 for a bothy bag unless the weather looks perfect. Not that big, lightweight, but can massively increase comfort if you need to stop and it's raining / windy etc. Can imagine it being very useful in emergency situations too. I imagine that most bothy bags on the market are pretty similar, so I'd be tempted to get whichever looks cheapest. 

I always have one of those tiny foil survival bags with my first aid kit too, just so I feel prepared! 

Vango 2 person bothy bag. 20 quid.

Is a 2 person a bit of a squeeze for 2 + gear or would a 4 be more comfy?. Neither of us is big but we sometimes both carry 30l rucksacks.

It's easy to sit in a two man with your backs to the two short walls and tension it comfortably between you then have room for gear between you, or sitting on it in a survival situation. I suspect it's more convenient for routine use (and lighter) than a 4. 

 I haven't used a 4, but spent a night under an 8-man with 6 of us and that was dire as folk moved and shifted through the night

They're generally fine for 2 with kit. The trick is to keep the backpack on as it puts space between you and the wind hitting the shelter. I've used them in winter when you're generally carrying a lot more kit and they're fine.

I've got a Tera Nova superlight Bothy 2. 

I've used it loads for breaks from the weather and once when the clegs were so bad it was the only way to be able to stop to eat / drink.

Another vote for a bothy bag, i carry a 2 person. I'd also recommend a small piece of foam (e.g. roll mat foam) to sit on. As you lose most of your heat through the ground. 

Lomo 2-3 person storm shelter seemed to be the best combination of price, pack size and internal size when I looked.

Whilst not as small pack size as the expensive super light shelters, it is still small enough to not be noticeable in a bag. Easily usable with one or two people, great for sitting out bad weather or keeping your sandwiches dry, and at a pinch in an emergency situation you could fit a third person in. As I don't tend to walk in a group, this is the perfect size for me.

https://www.lomo.co.uk/acatalog/emergency-shelter.html#SID=50

I've got the selection from the foil blankets to the orange bivvy bags to the group shelter. What goes in the bag depends on the day, and sometimes all 3. To my mind they've all got slightly different applications

Are they? I imagine you'd stay warmer in a orange bivvy bag as its a better fit, less fabric flapping, air ingress and dead space..

Different jobs to my mind..

For the most part I carry one of these: https://www.ultralightoutdoorgear.co.uk/equipment-c3/first-aid-emergency-c5...

I chose it because it's so small and light and I'm generally running and on my own so the benefit of a bothy bag type shelter is less and they're heavier and bulkier. The stuff bag is big enough to keep a Petzl e-lite in so that means I always have a head torch or spare.

Winter climbing as a pair we'll often take one of the below between us as that equates to about the same weight as the emergency bivvy and the benefits of the more robust 2 person shelter are far greater in winter. 

https://www.summitgear.co.uk/product/supalite-reversible-bothy-bag-2-person...

Both those kinds of thing have their place but the bothy bag type shelter is going to be more use if you go in a pair or group or like to stop for lunch etc. If you're solo/fast and light a super light emergency bag maybe makes more sense.

Well I've never spent much time in a orange bivi bag but I was genuinely shocked how warm and sheltered my rab 2 man shelter is. I've used it in driving rain/snow and 70 mile an hour winds. Totally different world inside not at all drafty and with the bonus of not having my head sticking out one end plus you can actually do useful stuff like navigate inside. I you havnt tried one I thoroughly recommend giving them a go. Given the choice I would definitely choose a group shelter over a bivi bag any day. Unless I was actually planning to bivi in which case I would take a gortex bag or small tent.

I take a Vango 200 shelter with me. I haven't had to use it yet but it is good to know its there if things turn bad.

Dave

A long time ago, so might be misremembered, Glenmore Lodge looked at the difference between bivy bags and group shelters for warmth (persecuting ML trainees I suspect). I am sure the group shelters came out much better. 

Do you not bump into stuff all the time? Or have you got one of the ones with the wee window?

Sharing a shelter with one other person is like taking a 100W heater with you.

More like 1kW, no?

That would be nice but sadly not.

https://www.physlink.com/education/askexperts/ae420.cfm

I stand corrected! I've carried that notional 1kW about in my head for ages -without ever doing the simple calculation. Thanks for putting me right.

Would that not only work if they were naked in the shelter with you?

Steamy!

You burn calories whether naked or clothed. That 100W must be lost regardless of clothing. If you don't you die of hyperthermia (overheating).

Given that you'd be wearing a fair bit of insulation I suspect radiated heat would minimal and most heat loss would be through breathing. 

I've got a bothy-2 for Mountain days, and a bothy-4 is permanently in the boot of my car just in case of road side emergencies.  

I can't remember the brand but the little bothy bag I have was a real blessing on an overnighter once when one of us [whistles] started to get cold and we were struggling a bit with nav. Just perfect to regroup, warm up a bit and get a bit of food in. For the bulk, they're great.

Also do a quick clothes change-over into dry gear which I've done a few times in Scotland when ticking the Munros. As well as sorting out navigation in really bad winter weather.

Lots of uses really.

I've got kitted up in mine a few times winter climbing. It's a bit awkward but definitely warmer. Last winter we got kitted up in a pretty stiff breeze on the Braeriach plateau and the shelter made a massive difference.

Brilliant idea.  I've seen a few families huddled miserably on the opposite site of the Armco to their broken-down car who could have really done with one.