UKH

Bloke snapping a Revo by hand, impressive

youtube.com/watch?v=8YF_33ZKSco&

In reply to John Kelly:

Thanks, I'll bear that in mind if I ever clip in using a bench vice.

In reply to John Kelly:

I find it hard to imagine how you could load a belay device like that in the wild. Still...

That said, I bet he couldn't do it to a Grigri.

In reply to jon:

Is that Joe Healey as in one of The Addicts from The Power Of Climbing?

edit: Whoever it is, they are clearly not sponsored by Wild Country.

In reply to John Kelly:

That's some sort of modern belay device, right?

What an utterly pointless exercise!

jk

In reply to jon:

It'd be difficult to achieve with a gri-gri due to the width at the clip in point. Using something like the DMM Rhino which keeps the device captive along the top bar would prevent the device from being loaded in this (provided that the horn is big enough)

In fairness to Wild Country the chap was probably not far off breaking the krab loading it in the way he did (this might have been part of why it pinged off the corner of the krab).

In reply to Climber_Bill:

Possible it's the j healy from Supertopo. healyje

In reply to John Kelly:

The moral would appear to be don't fasten the krab in a vice when belaying.  I honestly don't know what this is meant to prove.  I've been known to be a bit heavy handed and snap fairly thick bolts with a spanner.  So what it doesn't demonstrate any inherent weakness with the bolt.

Al

In reply to jon:

Halfway down the page

https://www.mountainproject.com/forum/topic/116575988/revo-3?page=7

In reply to GridNorth:

It's not put me off but I'm quite impressed with how he managed to overcome the Revo.

In reply to John Kelly:

To be fair I would say the vice overcame the Revo.

Al

In reply to John Kelly:

Pointless exercise.  Puts me in mind of early tests on the Army's SA80 rifle.  After many thousands of rounds were fired, the plastic butt began to crack.  This prompted a redesign with a different plastic, which melted in contact with insect repellent.  Common sense finally prevailed when someone pointed out that the bench test rig had no give, unlike a soldier's shoulder and that the original material was therefore fine.

In reply to John Kelly:

I mean I have my reservations about the Revo, but this is not one of them. Seems like a massive waste of 100 quid...

In reply to beardy mike:

Healyje? claimed online  he could snap one with his bear (bare) hands,  many said he couldn't.

I think one nil to Healy 

Relevant - probably not 

In reply to John Kelly:

Still a massive waste of 100 quid... if some bet you you couldn’t break something that cost you a load of money would you do it just for shits and giggles? I mean there’s another revo test with ref to rope soloing out there about using back up knots which is much more interesting and actually has some relevance to something...

In reply to John Kelly:

To clean up a quote from a plumber friend 

'This is like driving your car into a lake and saying "Why doesn't it float?"'

In reply to John Kelly:

100 ft upside down fall on an El Cap A4 rope solo - makes you think.

E

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In reply to John Kelly:when did bare hands = a vice? 

1-0 to Roger Irrelevant 

In reply to Enty:

Yeah, makes you think that maybe you shouldn't have attached the device to the mountain with a vice, at 90 degrees to the direction of the fall...

In reply to John Kelly:

interesting as I often belay with a vice, bloody hard graft I can tell you lugging it about, shan’t be doing any more though after watching this 

In reply to Enty:

Certainly does. I wouldn’t use a revo for rope solo. Surprised by the multiple replies suggesting it’s not an issue, but I suppose they aren’t considering roped solo use.  

In reply to alex_arthur:

why not? What do you suspect would fail?

In reply to John Kelly:

If you match an awkward combination of karabiner and figure eight descendeur, belay device and karabiner , or bolt hanger and  karabiner all kinds of dangerous twisted  hang ups can and have occurred.

IIRC there have been deaths involving the first example. 

There might be manufacturing design  guidelines now to reduce the danger, however, never underestimate the ability of an unlucky idiot to find an unlikely failure mode.

In reply to Rick Graham:

Having recently joined a rope soloing group on facebook, I'd say rope soloers are generally not idiots and rarely unlucky - seems to me like they are a very fastidious bunch - much more so than the average punter. That said they are the minority of revo users. But to me there are so many issues with the Revo that I just wouldn't touch it with yours... what was it that St Exupery said about perfection?

In reply to beardy mike:

Using the word idiot was from an older discussion, punter person or climber would do just as well. Even experts get surprises.

In reply to John Kelly:

Well it's sure 1:0 for Joe, he did what he said albeit using an orientation we hadn't considered.

However that mode of failure is impossible if the karabiner isn't restrained and I mean completely restrained as in a vice as the force on it is considerable, certainly more than would be needed to instead rotate the climber. In the more normal cross loading orientations the leverage is far lower and in my testing it proved inpossible to get the thing to remain in the cross-loading position due the shape of the eye. On the gate side you can get it stable but that goes for most gear anyway. 

Worth noting that while the Revo is broken it still retains and brakes the rope, in other words it's f#cked but you don't die

Rope-soloing it's standard practice to restain the device so it can't get cross-loaded.

In reply to jimtitt:

yep, Joe won the bet (maybe surprisingly) but he hasn't put me off the Revo just yet.

I view the Revo like via ferrata kit, might just stop you dying but I try really hard not to test it. 

revolutionary and complex bit of kit - more people twisting straining bending generally abusing it and reporting the better in my view

In reply to beardy mike:

“Perfection is achieved, not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing left to take away.” 

philosophy for engineers, nice, thank you

In reply to John Kelly:

If absolute perfection were achieved, all the devices would be identical.

In reply to jon:

And made from a single piece...

In reply to John Kelly:

So somebody has finally found a use for them. 

In reply to John Kelly:

crap bit of kit. Waste of money

In reply to John Kelly:

What he did is a bit like snapping a carabiner through the gate. It has a weak orientation, and a strong orientation, multidirectional torque is not a realistic force to apply to that connection point. 

In reply to alex_arthur:

A guy I was hanging out with in Yosemite in 2011 took an absolute monster off Zodiac when soloing. We were all watching from the meadow when it happend. We all looked at each other as if to say WTF just happened.

A few of hours later he was back down with us. The damage to his equipment was incredible. Torn slings, bent krabs, busted swages and cams snapped.

So, yes, makes me think.

E

In reply to Enty:

Yep I’ve heard about this accident and it’s one reason why I wouldn’t use a revo for lead solo. I’m luckily enough to have a silent partner though. 

In reply to John Kelly:

I wouldn’t trust the attachment point with a single carabiner...especially following the video above. Note the incident enty mentions below. If it’s the same one I’m thinking of a carabiner attached to a Grigri snapped. The climber was saved by a backup knot. 

In reply to alex_arthur:

Yes, I have a SP and use it with a steel krab.

E