UKH

My housemate and I are both graduating this summer and making the most of our long summer by heading to the Alps for about 8 weeks. As we have limited funds we're looking for anyway to save money! The current plan is to drive out (the cheap way via Luxembourg and Belgium) and to camp for flexibility and cheapness. We are also hoping to bivvy outside huts as much as possible and as we have a lot of time probably will walk a lot of approaches to avoid lift fees.

Any other suggestions on methods to save money? Thanks in advance

stay in Italy!

As cdpeg suggests, Italy is cheaper than Switzerland and France, however it is also cheaper in the Ecrin than say Chamonix. No lifts, friendlier locals and more places to wild camp. 

Eat and drink 'in' as much as possible would be my number one tip. I'm also considering moving out to save a couple of months of rent (which will virtually pay for my entire trip and then some given London rent prices, but means frantically house-finding when I get back).

The drive via Belgium and Luxembourg isn't bad at all; I've done it once on my own and timed it to arrive early in the morning in Chamonix. Didn't really lose anything time-wise because saving a few hours and arriving at 03:00 isn't very useful. Bivying is way better than staying in the refuge even if you're not trying to save money. Better views, no snoring and no Spaniards packing their bags in the dorm at stupid o' clock.

Don't go too mental on trying to save on lifts though. It's certainly possible, but sometimes taking the lift means means not being physically wasted before you've even set foot on the route...

When are you looking to head out? I'll be driving out mid to late June and so far have an empty car.

Shoplifting in my day.....seriously, everyone did!!

Buy all your food in one of the huge french supermarkets on the way down because all the smaller shops in alpine villages are always more expensive.

Go somewhere without lifts where walking is the norm. So many people I know have tried to have 'lift free' trips in serviced areas and you almost always end up doing far less than you could have done if you had paid for a ticket. 

For France try the Ecrin or the Pyraneese over Chamonix, and for cheaper again go to Italy. 

Have a really good list of climbs/mountains to try in different conditions so you're not wasting days on out of condition snow routes/damp rock routes etc just because you didn't plan ahead. 

Buy the big boxes/5l plastic demijohns of local red wine. It's (almost) always great. 

Thanks! Do you have any recommendations for areas/valleys in Italy? Or guidebooks? Looking for routes AD and up. 

We're driving out a similar time but have a full car! We plan to move about a fair bit and go to the dolomites so can't be without a car unfortunately, thanks for the offer though

No worries

I'd also second the recommendations for the Ecrins. I've spent a reasonable amount of time in the area and it's a truly wonderful place. Very friendly, very chilled and a huge amount to go at at all grades and styles of climbing.

We definitely plan to use the car to get to the big supermarkets. We're planning on moving about a fair bit so will call in via supermarkets on the way. 

Do you know a good guidebook for the Ecrins? We have the 4000 guide but they're mainly the big multi-day routes. Is there anything out there for short routes? 

A bit of a reverse answer to your question, but The Alpine Club guidebook is crap in its layout and usability. It is informative, but that's about all I'd credit it with. Very useful in combination with a better guidebook or if you already have route ideas, but it's not a guidebook to flick through for inspiration. The topos, for example, are in a section at the back of the book and have to be referenced by route number.

Sadly I don't have a recommendation for the 'better guidebook'...

For online resources, CampToCamp is very good.

Not quite shoplifting but a mate of mine used to go round the back of the supermarket where they kept the crates of empties, pick one up and carry it in the front to claim the refund, 1 Franc for each bottle and 5 Francs for the crate!

In reply to the OP

On my early trips to Chamonix we used to camp in the woods outside town to save campsite fees and wash in the toilets at the telepherique stations (occasionally) where we would also collect toilet roll so we didn't have to buy it.

The supermarkets also did a good range of cooking chocolate (with nuts and raisins etc in it) which was a fraction of the price of proper chocolate.

Remember to arrive in Luxembourg with a nearly empty tank and fill up with the cheapest fuel in western Europe. By law the fuel costs the same everywhere in Luxembourg so don't bother searching around for supermarket fuel, just fill up at the services.

Remember that a Chamonix Euro is worth about 30% of an regular French Euro and about 20% of an Italian Euro.

Turn your phone off in the vicinity of Switzerland unless you specifically have free roaming there.  Consider a sim from someone like 3 (other deals exist) because it covers Switzerland.

There's a set of relatively modern guides for the area here: https://www.sebastien-constant.com/

Not sure where to get sports/cragging/bouldering guides from though

good point about the roaming charges, hadn't thought about that! The guides look great, thanks

The best guide for sport/cragging on the Ailefroide side of the Ecrins is Briancon Climbs by the Rollands. It's now been through numerous updates. There are some big multi-pitch rock routes to be had on impressive crags like Ponteil. If you're on the La Berarde side, then make sure you do the traverse of La Meije at around AD+. One of the best Alpine days out I've had. Also, don't miss the Aiguille Dibona. Bolted (alpine style) multi-pitch doesn't get much better than Visite Obligatoire on there. 

Lots of good advice in this thread.

Plan on advance as far as possible so that your rest days/driving elsewhere days are on poor days. Make use of unmanned 'bivvy' huts where possible. Camping on the woods (out of a car) is possible in most of the areas mentioned but it does add some faff, mainly taking the tents down every morning and putting them up in the evening. 

Most of all, a two/three day route means you are up high, doing what you came to do, away from shops, campsites and temptation.

Have a great trip!

Don't ever fill up the car in Italy! One of the highest price per liter in Europe. France as well. Luxembourgh (as noted by pec) or even Austria is much cheaper. And be aware of the Italian highways tolls, they can add up quite quickly. On the other hand, any lifts and huts from the italian side are usually quite cheaper than Switzerland's (especially Zermatt comes to mind).

Unless you stay at a campground in the Saas valley, then the local lifts (with exception of the Metro alpine) are free. This makes Saas a great place for rapid acclimatization.

CB

For Guidebook for the Ecrins 

you have the Oisans Nouveau Oisans Sauvage Livre Est by Camion - this guide covers all the alpine rock routes on Briançon side of the Ecrins there is an west version to, don't think you can get it in the UK but online maybe and locally yes very easy, 

worth noting if you get this book the routes are starred this if for gear not how good, so 1 star fully bolted 4 star trad etc.

Snow and mixed climbs Ecrins east, Cerces and Queyras by Constant this is in available in English and should be available in the uk,

Mountaineering in the Écrins massif classic snow, rock and ice routes by VP a translation of an older french guidebook.

Ailefroide has its own guidebook and a english version.

and as some one else has said Brandon climbs by jj (there is meant to be a new version out this year) 

I know your on a budget but if rock climbing please get the guidebook it puts money back in to climbing here,

also I live 20 mins from Ailefroide so happy to help with any advice if i can

cheers Rob

I'd say that you're wise to consider bivvying outside huts (or even better, a long way from a hut), for both price and overall experience.

Staying one night in a hut is the same price as a week's camping in the valley.

My experience of staying in huts is 3hrs of broken sleep in a fug of farts, slamming doors, flashing headtorches and noisy climbers. My experience of bivvying is peaceful full nights of sleep under starlight, immersed in the Alpine environment. Of course there's exceptions to both.

If you're fit then going lift-free won't take too much out of you for your days up high. It'll add more time, but it sounds like you have plenty of that and personally I've found it makes for a more satisfying experience. Maybe save the lift-ticket kitty for when weather windows are short.

Not sure how, but when I drove through one of the smaller roads to get into Italy near Livigno two years ago, I filled up with diesel at the first small village I found and it was around 80cents/litre. It was cheaper than Luxemberg a few days earlier, and much cheaper than everywhere else in Italy that I looked at for the remainder of that week. I'd love to understand what happened and how to do it again!

You should check with the hut if bivvying outside is allowed. It’s just common courtesy and will avoid being told to move on. The answer is probably no! But if you are some way from the hut and out of sight and not near a path, it should be ok and you shouldn’t need to ask. Depends what you mean by outside I suppose. 

Not condoning this behaviour in any way and am not guilty but can remember the supermarket in Buoux being referred to as the "please u nic" back in the 80s.

Fuel prices in Europe are here

http://fuel-prices-europe.info/

Years ago, we stopped in Livigno to fill up with fuel on a skiing trip to Bormio.  I vaguely recollect that the fuel was duty free, as with Luxembourg.

Doing everything on foot with bivvies at hut height will get you fitter and acclimatised more quickly. And, as has been mentioned, you'll definitely sleep better, as well as saving tons of money.

Ah, but Livigno is a special case - it's a designated VAT-free area (although there are of course import limits from Livigno to Switzerland, in case you thought you could take a fuel trailer back home to pay for the trip )

https://www.fuelflash.eu/en/?land=it&suchfeld=Livigno&entfernung=20...

(quite good site for comparing fuel prices on map) shows a difference of 0.6€ per liter between Livigno and closest normal gas station...

They're free if you stay on the campsites too.

Lager in Swiss supermarkets is also bizarrely cheap, based on the cans we picked in Saas Grund last summer.

The lifts are free in Saas if you're stopping on a campsite but the pass is only valid during your stay at the campsite. So if you leave the site for a night or two in the mountains your pass expires and the lifts aren't free anymore.

To get your pass to cover days in the mountains you will have to pay for a hut, or of you intend to bivi you will have to pay to keep your tent on the site for the nights you aren't there. We got charged full price for the campsite even though we and our car, weren't there. Hence the "free" lift pass isn't quite as free as it first appears, nevertheless its still probably cheaper than buying a lift pass would be.

Things are a lot cheaper in Austria and Slovenija. Alpine club huts set you back 10-12€ a night (huts owned by the german AC in Austria are especially good value). Other than that, in the Dolomites you can often start from pass roads and bivy in the car if you are discreet. PM for more explicit info. 

In Switzerland, similar is possible moving away from the Furkapass road towards Sidelen or Albert Heim Hut. Lots of interesting alpine climbs there. 

As already said, bivvying is a great way to save cash but do it well away from the huts for a pleasanter stay and to not get moved on.

Avoid spending rainy days buying expensive kit in gear shops.

Use lifts to get up high, and make the most of the expenditure by staying high for a few days- take food and camping gear, but work out where you can get away with leaving stuff without attracting unwanted attention. Camping on the Vallee Blanche is banned, which is sometimes enforced, but stashing stiff and taking your tent down in the day/staying away from other campers makes it more acceptable...

Some places you can get away with sleeping in cablecar top stations- or you could when I was a student 10 years or so ago.

Lifts can be VERY expensive.  The alternative is to get up early and spend a day back packing up - will save you a bomb and get you really fit indeed. It's what the pioneers did In 8 weeks it's unlikely that you will be wanting to climb high up every day. Read some of the mountaineering books from the 1950s and earlier by people like Tilman, Shipton, Noyce, Smythe, Finch, Ward, Winthrop Young, Leigh-Mallory, Collie, Mummery and Whymper. They were true mountaineers and achieved amazing things without, or in some cases with very few, lifts and cable cars to save them a first day's grind up from the valley. 

I admit to using lifts, but I have also back packed up to camp high and it's very satisfying.

Another trick is, if say taking the cog railway to the montenvers station, one person takes the bags on the train and the other walks up. Next time, reverse roles.

The walk up/down is a lot more pleasant without a pack.

The Briancon Climbs has selected routes in Ailefroide plus others in the area but all rock.  The Sebastian Constant book is the best guide book I've ever used but it is more aimed at winter/ spring in the Ecrins rather than summer, although there are some summer lines in there.  

My main advice for budget alpine trips is to beware of false economy. Don't fool yourself in to taking an extra day to walk in with bivvy gear, suffering next to the hut (which costs less than €15 per night (probably the same as your camp site) if you take your own food and have AAC membership), then getting up and having to make breakfast, pack up etc while all the hut goers walk past you and on to your route.

Also,  camp sites are expensive, look on a site called www.roomlala.fr for cheap rooms which you could rent for cheaper than a camp site.

Thanks both, that solves that mystery. I'll add it onto my map of places to go to again!

Go to itaIy. Much cheaper. Don't get caught up in the Chamonix bubble, weather isn't as good there and so you spend time shopoing or eating out .

You're right, I misconstrued the point you were trying to make. You do need to be checked in at the campsite to get the lift pass, even if staying up in the mountains, but both the campsites I've stayed at in Saas Grund over the past couple of years have given discounts on the nights when you're away in huts (provided the hut gave us a receipt!)

Minor saving but every little helps.

My recipe for a budget trip:

1. Go for long enough to rent a flat with a kitchen (2 weeks or more) and split the flat with a mate/partner Somewhere like Chamonix for two weeks it should be possible to find something for under 400eur/prsn. For a month or longer it should be possible to find something for under 500eur/prsn/month.

2. Stay put. Traveling will cost you lots of money in tolls, gas and short term accommodations which are more expensive by the day than a 2+ week flat rental.

3. Do groceries and eat like the locals. For instance drinking cheap wine in France is cheaper than drinking beer. You don't need to drink, just picking a staple where you might be familiar with the costs. The same principle applies to food generally.

4. Stay out of Switzerland

I've gone on month long trips to Europe before and aside from the flight cost ended up paying less than if I had stayed home in Chicago without making any big effort to save on living expenses, lift tickets, etc.

You say you plan to move around a lot. This is a mistake. Travel will cost you a good deal of money in gas and tolls. You say you plan to camp. This gets rid of the short term accommodation premium that normally comes with moving around since you won't be paying anything for accommodations hopefully, but you still won't have a kitchen, which is a major money saver. You could cook on a gas camping stove all the time but it will suck and if your discipline falters you'll end up wasting money at restaurants all the same. If you insist on being mobile, just understand that you will be paying for that privilege.

What?! He's trying to do things on the cheap!

Obviously camp or just doss and follow the weather.

This answer raises some interesting points.

Personally, I've always gone with the option of maximising quality routes done. That sometimes means chasing weather a bit. If you have four weeks and spend weeks two and four sitting in the rain in Cham you will get less done than if you had gone cham/ecrins/cham/dollies or similar. Yes,  travel adds cost...but if you want to maximise routes done in a period of time it works quite well.

Let's just try and forget that I once drove chamonix-cortina, spent a day sport climbing, then spent two days in a tent and drove back because the forecast changed...

To the OP, if you have a car try and fill it with four folk rather than 2. You've just halved fuel/tolls and taken a chunk off the ferry/tunnel cost, as well as being a bit kinder to the environment and having more folk to partner with. Four in a car dossing in the woods around cham is possible. Wash in Lake Passy on rest days.

Oh and book tunnel/ferry as far ahead as possible, both ways. And use font as a stop off if driving through France; this can add an evening and morning boulder session to your trip, increasing your fun÷£ spent value.

Ha ha, I did something similar once. Drove from Chamonix to Canazei to avoid wall to wall rain for the next week only to arrive in the Dolomites to find it had reached their as well, they were actually snow-ploughing the Sella pass when we arrived in August!

Managed a via ferrata the next day before the persistent deluge arrived and drove back to Cham to be ready for when it all passed over.

The OP asked for tips for reducing costs. Any naive traveler will tell you that camping is free while paying for any sort of accommodations is not. OP does not need us to tell them this. My experience has lead me to believe that the perceived savings are deceptive in the case of longer trips though.

Camping has hidden costs associated with it, either increased food costs because you eat out more, or dramatically greater inconvenience if camp cooking, which over the course of a long trips eventually drives you back towards eating out a lot. On the other hand, renting a place is often cheaper than you'd think if you know where to look and avoid the short term tourist market (hence the need to stay at least a month). YMMV.

Needless to say this strategy works best when either you or your partner are trying to be frugal by choice. If you're both brutally broke, then it will be much easier to camp and never waste money frivolously, because you won't have any. But OP is choosing to spend money on travel and mobility, which will cost much more than the flat rental, so it sounds like a frugal by choice situation.

I should add a 5th point to the above 4 points I made. In addition to renting a flat, foregoing mobility,  and eating like the locals,

5) Travel with someone who is financially worse off than you (or at any rate more frugal than you). If your partner has more money or is more spendthrift than you in general you're more likely to be talked into wasting money in frivolous ways than if they're if your partner is more concerned about money than you are.