Lyskamm NNE wall / face

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 simplyawful 29 Oct 2021

Has anyone done this one?

Read an amusing account of an ascent in the 1930s when still a very new route - cutting steps up 900m without any protection of course... il have a dig if I can find it online to link but read on paper so unsure if possible.

This is the route description on camp to camp:

https://www.camptocamp.org/routes/46961/fr/lyskamm-liskamm-e-face-nne

it’s quite beyond my level at the minute (been to alps once, did Dome du Neige) but looks like an excellent route and wanted to hear if anyone had been out on it? Seems not that technical beyond the rimaye, more just strength required and the engagement pushing up the grade. Is it normally climbed early season?

cheers all

sa

 nniff 29 Oct 2021
In reply to simplyawful:

Did it years ago (lots of years ago).  Straightforward for most of it - took the rope off to make own pace, just getting into our own personal grooves of one step after another and repeat.  Put the rope back on for a rocky bit to the top.  Screwed up the descent by electing to take a different route to the one recommended, to the extent that the guardian was both appalled and impressed at the same time.  Just do as you're told.....

1
OP simplyawful 29 Oct 2021
In reply to nniff:

Sounds good. Is the normal ascent the east ridge? Apparently some ski the face for descent which seems absurd. How much of the route is on rock / how tough is the rock section?

cb294 29 Oct 2021
In reply to simplyawful:

There are three different "normal" ascents, east summit via east ridge from Col de Lys, east summit via Il Naso, or west ridge to west summit. The most popular route is the traverse, combining two of the three. Skiing the North face will probably range from moderate to suicidal depending on conditions (FWIW,  have not done that ski descent). However, in some parts it is not THAT steep, and looks skiable.

CB

OP simplyawful 30 Oct 2021
In reply to cb294:

Thanks. Traverse is very long, no? 
 

sa

 McHeath 30 Oct 2021
In reply to simplyawful:

Long, with potentially very nasty cornices. Infamous route with more than its fair share of victims. Beautiful mountain, but with a justifiedly bad reputation. 

 DaveHK 30 Oct 2021
In reply to simplyawful:

> Apparently some ski the face for descent which seems absurd. 

Good skiers ski the face when it's in appropriate condition. I doubt it's a descent option in the usual sense! 

OP simplyawful 30 Oct 2021
In reply to DaveHK:

Won’t bring a sledge then!

 Frostguiding 30 Oct 2021
In reply to simplyawful:

Even the "safest" line on the NNE face has a lot of serac risk these days, on the route and approach. The traverse really isn't that long and in good conditions it's pretty straightforward (for an AD ridge). Think 5 hours from col to col. Most go West to East. It's worth watching the film La Liste for the ski descent of the NNE face. 

http://www.laliste-film.com/

OP simplyawful 30 Oct 2021
In reply to McHeath:

Cheers. Do you know if cornices also an issue on the descent ridge as opposed to traverse? 

OP simplyawful 30 Oct 2021
In reply to Frostguiding:

Thanks for the info and will watch the link. I think it looks like an interesting mountain, even with the warnings above. Imagine completely dependent on conditions though

 McHeath 30 Oct 2021
In reply to simplyawful:

> Cheers. Do you know if cornices also an issue on the descent ridge as opposed to traverse? 

The guide description mentions big cornices on the S side of the E ridge. The problem with the traverse is apparently that the cornices go in both directions, making them easy to misjudge and treacherous in bad visibility . Not speaking from experience - I'd love to have done the route, but never wanted to actually get on it. 

Post edited at 21:31
 Frostguiding 31 Oct 2021
In reply to McHeath:

It's a really beautiful mountain! Cornices can go either side - and change mid season or disappear altogether. It's a popular traverse though, so unless you're first after a snowfall or strong wind there will be a track. It's not a good place for poor vis at all - even getting to the route (from either side) would be challenging if you can't see 

I did the traverse West-East 3 times this summer and conditions were different each time. Not sure if I can post links to my blog but try https://frostguiding.co.uk/blog

 McHeath 31 Oct 2021
In reply to Frostguiding:

It certainly is a beautiful mountain; please don't tempt me further...

(Nice blog by the way!) 

 pec 31 Oct 2021
In reply to simplyawful:

I did the Norman Neruda route on the NE Face about 30 years ago, the one which follows the narrow rock rib on the upper part of the face straight below the East summit. We kept well away from the face until directly opposite the rib to minimise exposure to serac fall and, especially once on the face, it felt safe enough but someone above suggests that's no longer the case. Certainly the Grenz Glacier which we approached it via is the most wildly crevassed glacier I've been on in the Alps, but again, I don't know what it's like these days.

We soloed up to the foot of the rib, it would have been very slow to pitch this bit but you really wouldn't want to slip, it's probably a good 50 degrees so self arrest isn't realistic.

You can follow snow to the left of the rib all the way if conditions are ok (the Welzenback Variation) but we took the rib for interest's sake. It was mostly about Scottish II and III mixed but I thought the crux pitch was quite hard, probably Scottish IV mixed. It was almost at the top of the rib and so over 4000m altitude which didn't make it feel any easier!

We descended via the East ridge to the Lisjoch which was quite exposed but fine from a cornice point of view but we were being chased off by an approaching storm so didn't hang about to savour it too much.

OP simplyawful 02 Nov 2021
In reply to pec:

Thanks for the detailed account t. Sounds like it’s often done unroped baring the rock past as this is common to all the accounts I’ve read / seen here. Rib sounds like it makes it a bit more challenging. 

How long does the decent ridge take? Imagine it’s much more treacherous if very tired...

 pec 03 Nov 2021
In reply to simplyawful:

> How long does the decent ridge take? Imagine it’s much more treacherous if very tired...

It was about 30 years ago so I couldn't put a figure to it other than to say not very long, very roughly about an hour to the col perhaps? We had no cornice problems (although there were cornices) and there was probably already a trail in the snow as it was August (though I can't remember for sure). We also didn't hang about because of the approaching bad weather. In other conditions it could take much longer I'm sure.

The AC guidebook gives 2.5 hours in ascent from the Lisjoch so in descent half that wouldn't be unrealistic in good conditions.

It's about 3/4 of a mile from the summit to the col.

If this link works then it's a photo of the ridge I took from Pyramid Vincent on a much more recent trip.

https://photos.google.com/photo/AF1QipPSjAUSH4pNozYDSVBpPu2gQzr9nybXHtevfAm...

Post edited at 23:01

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