UKH

MTB question

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 Heike 16 Sep 2019

So, I am looking for an MTB  for my hubby to replace his very much used and loved  Specialized Stumpjumper   Competition(from about 15 or or so years ago) which he loves, just about everything has been replaced on it several times and is knackered, but he wants: A bike the same or lighter than this, a triple chain ring (for the very steep hills around here - which doesn't seem to exist anymore) no full suspension, only front suspension and it being light weight - less than the previous. There is hardly anything to be found. Please help! Oh, and he doesn't like black or grey...he wants colourful. 

Post edited at 21:18
 wbo2 16 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike: theres a ton of choice?  Except you wont find much with a triple as it's pretty much non necessary.  Just get a decent  29 and you'll be set

In reply to Heike:

Most mountain bikes are 1x ("one-by") now - they have no front derailleur, all the gearing is based on the back block, but the actual gearing will still be the same, or even lower, as on a triple from a few years back.

But you save weight with no front mech and there is less to go wrong.

Have a look at Alpkit's brand "Sonder" - they are winning lots of "best in test" awards, and are designed by a UK firm for UK hills. The Transmitter came out just a few months after I had bought my MTB a few years ago, and I suspect that's what I would have got had I been looking that little bit later that I was!

 DaveHK 16 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

As others have said you wont find much with a triple these days but the ratios will probably still be comparable. Once you ditch that requirement you'll have much more choice.

 cb294 16 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

Buy used. I just bought a Santa Cruz Bronson for my wife (actually, the frame and then all components separately). A few years old, looking brand new, at fraction of the price, roughly 1500€ in total. This is a top of the line bike, much better than mine, but as a birthday present nothing less would do.

They also make fantastic hardtails which are quite a bit cheaper. 

Change the drive train to a state of the art 10-50 rear block, and you are in business.

CB

baron 16 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

It’s worth replacing all of the components again.

You’ll probably get top of the range components from a few years ago for a vastly reduced price because nobody wants them anymore - they’ve moved on to something better - well different anyway.

As for the colour, a couple of tins of spray paint and you can have any colour you want.

This way you get to build the bike you want around a frame that you like.

But he probably wants a new bike , doesn’t he?

Never underestimate the power of shiny new bike syndrome.  

4
In reply to Heike:

As others have said, unlikely to find a triple.
There are lots of good double or 1x bikes out there

Have a look at Planet X as you can build it to your spec.

 Heike 17 Sep 2019
In reply to DaveHK and all:

Sadly I can't ditch this requirement as this is what he wants...He uses his bike a lot and goes up lots of really steep hills and would like the range of gears with a triple. So, there is no point in me looking for something he doesn't want. I fear there aren't really many left. A couple of months ago I still found a few on the web, but they seemed to have disappeared now as well...

 Heike 17 Sep 2019
In reply to all:

Thanks guys! Lots of good tips!

 Heike 17 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

An update, he know says that he would be happy with a double: so this is what he wants

 Hardtail

·         Weight 12.0kg or less (excluding pedals)

·         Double chainring

·         Not black

Post edited at 09:16
 coinneach 17 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

I got a  Specialized Rockhopper 29er last year. Double chain ring ( I couldn’t tell the difference). Grey and red colour scheme and light as a feather. Would recommend.

 ChrisJD 17 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

> ·         Double chainring

He needs to realise its 2019, its (near enough) all 1x.

And what's the budget?

And what type of trails does he ride and want to ride

Post edited at 10:02
1
 Heike 17 Sep 2019
In reply to ChrisJD:

Budget is flexible depending on bike (but not too expensive, i.e. not the sort of prices where you can get a family car for)

Trails - cross-country all over and lots of steep hills round where we live 

 ChrisJD 17 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

> Budget is flexible depending on bike (but not too expensive, i.e. not the sort of prices where you can get a family car for)

That covers a big range of budget !

 Heike 17 Sep 2019
In reply to ChrisJD:

well, ok, not thousands then. Well,  the previous Stumpjumper has lasted probably 15 years or so and cost 1500 at the time I think, so something equivalent I could stretch to, but I am not talking silly money (like I have seen that some bikes cost nowadays).

In reply to Heike:

A 2019 Specialized Chisel Comp is about the closest you're going to get to the Stumpjumper and hitting your criteria. 

A bike from 15 years ago and a new bike are going to feel VASTLY different so really you need to be going to a shop and trying a few out. 

Just look at the difference in shape and style on this list https://off.road.cc/content/buying/the-best-mountain-bikes-under-1500-hardtail-full-suspension

 Heike 17 Sep 2019
In reply to thepodge:

Thank you! Looking at shops is a nice idea, but there are not very many bikes in the shops in Glasgow and surrounding areas and certainly not many that have bikes that fit the spec. Loads of e-bikes everywhere and cheap bikes and that's pretty much it.

 DaveHK 17 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

> Sadly I can't ditch this requirement as this is what he wants...He uses his bike a lot and goes up lots of really steep hills

People go up a lot of really steep hills on modern double and single set ups. The lowest ratio is often the same or lower than an old school triple, just achieved in a different way.

Post edited at 16:01
 Fonty 17 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

Double chainring

As several people have said, you can now get the same range of gear ratios with a single chainring that you used to get with double and triple chainrings. A typical current setup would have a 30 or 32 tooth single chainring upfront and an 11-50 tooth cassette at the rear. You can compare the gear ratios for this setup with whatever your partner has on his current bike using this website: http://gears.mtbcrosscountry.com/

.

 Heike 17 Sep 2019
In reply to Fonty:

The reason he wants double chain rings is because he does lots of very long uphills and wants small increments between the gears. It's not because he needs a really low bottom gear. 

Thanks for all the other replies, the search continues for something that meets all the criteria.

 dovebiker 17 Sep 2019

I work part-time as a bike mechanic - we sell Specialized and Cube - I wouldn't choose Specialized if value-for-money is important. Cube Reaction is a decent bike for the money, and you can get a good deal on 2019 bikes like this: https://www.tredz.co.uk/.Cube-Reaction-C-62-29er-Mountain-Bike-2019-Hardtail-MTB_200343.htm It has a carbon frame, Shimano XT 2x drivetrain.

 ChrisJD 17 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

Have a look at this bunch. https://www.mbr.co.uk/reviews/hardtail/best-hardtail-mountain-bike

He needs to embrace the new wave of long, low and slack bikes. They are ace fun.

Concerns about not having enough 'small increments' is really not anything to worry about with 1x11 and 1x12 systems.

 DaveHK 17 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

> The reason he wants double chain rings is because he does lots of very long uphills and wants small increments between the gears. It's not because he needs a really low bottom gear. 

Its not an issue. His old bike will have an 8 or 9 speed cassette whereas a new one will be 11 or 12 so 3 or 4 more increments. Also in theory you get 27 gears with 3x9 but 2 of them are pretty much unuseable, a few others next to them not ideal and several others are duplicates. That doesn't happen with 1x systems.

People haven't switched to 1x systems because they've stopped riding up long hills, lots of people are using 1x systems for exactly that.

 Heike 17 Sep 2019
In reply to DaveHK:

Thanks, Dave, I can understand your argument and that is all very nice, but I am trying to find a present for my hubby for his special birthday which will please him. What he wants was what I said, but if I buy something he doesn't want and tell him 'suck it up as it is 2019' then it is not really a nice present I think, so I think I am back to square 1. I found a nice thing now here https://www.canyon.com/en-gb/mountain-bikes/cross-country-bikes/exceed/exceed-cf-sl-7.0/2039.html?dwvar_2039_pv_rahmenfarbe=BK%2FBU&quantity=1 That might just be the thing?? Any thoughts

Post edited at 22:32
2
 Heike 17 Sep 2019
In reply to dovebiker:

Thanks! Sounds interesting

In reply to Heike:

I'd like one of them for my birthday present! I got a book from my missus this year - a good book I wanted to read, and in hardback as it was new, but still I think you'd win the most impressive gift competition with that bike!

All the same on the gears, I'm sure your husband is a smart chap (at least from the evidence of selecting a super generous life partner!), so I'm sure you could talk him through the logic and advantages of 1x gearing.

 Heike 17 Sep 2019
In reply to TobyA:

Hahaha! I don't give huge presents all the time, but cycling is what my man likes (apart from climbing) and his bike is knackered and he does deserve to go out all the time as he puts a lot of effort in! However, a good book is always the best sign for a loving relationship IMHO. Books are the way forward.

Post edited at 22:48
 DaveHK 18 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

Heike, if someone asked on here about getting a pair of straight shafted, leashed axes to replace their partner's ageing Vertiges or Charley Mo's what advice would you give them?

Edit: I'm sure that canyon would be fine.

Post edited at 06:55
In reply to Heike:

While very generous I think buying him a bike without him trying things is a risky idea. 

The canyon you linked to is a cross country bike but he may well suit a hardcore hardtail better, two very different bikes. 

Post edited at 07:01
 Heike 18 Sep 2019
In reply to DaveHK:

Hahaha, I'd say come to my garage, I have a fine selection of vintage axes for you to choose from....

baron 18 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

Pick a bike that your hubby wants.

Ignore all those telling you to get a 1x10 or 11 or 12, whatever the latest fad is 

They were all probably riding single speed a few years ago

Or unicycles

Triple chainset for the win

Post edited at 10:12
5
 DaveHK 18 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

> Hahaha, I'd say come to my garage, I have a fine selection of vintage axes for you to choose from....

Now you mention it I've got a fine selection of double and triple chainset bikes.

 Phil79 18 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

> The reason he wants double chain rings is because he does lots of very long uphills and wants small increments between the gears. It's not because he needs a really low bottom gear. 

There really isn't that much difference in the increments.  

A quick google indicates a 2005 stumpy had a HG50 cassette, which would have had 11-13-15-17-19-21-28-32 sprockets.

If you buy a modern 12 speed, you'll get something like 10-12-14-16-18-21-28-32-36-42-50.

I rode an old triple for years, before (fairly recently) moving to 1 x 11. You tend to loose a bit of range in the higher gears, but the lower gears you just don't feel any difference. I live on edge of Dartmoor and its pretty lumpy, lots of short sharp uphills, and longer climbs. 

You do loose a bit in the higher gears and tend to spin out at high speed, but the simplicity and reliability outweigh the slight reduction in range. 

As you have found, you just wont find a triple any more, not on a new bike. You can probably still get doubles, but even these are disappearing fast!

Post edited at 11:06
 Frank4short 18 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

I just looked up that very bike and was about to post it before reading your comment. You won't go wrong with that if he's into XC/distance riding and prefers a hardtail. 

Edit: As stated by another poster if his style of riding is slightly burlier/more hardcore he may be more suited to something like a cotic BFE https://www.cotic.co.uk/product/BFe or halfway in between a solaris https://www.cotic.co.uk/product/solarisMAX#bike

Post edited at 11:15
In reply to Frank4short:

You wont easily get a Cotic under £1500

 SC 18 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

A modern double with 11 speed cassette will give the same range as a triple. I gave up riding a few years ago after injury but I found 12 speed and a single chain ring fine for even lake district climbs and you get much better chain retention.

For front suspension only, I'd go for a Genesis or Nukeproof and definitely avoid anything from the big brands (Giant, Specialized, Trek etc) because they're all crap for the money

 Frank4short 18 Sep 2019
In reply to thepodge:

The whole bikes start at around £1,600-1800 which is around the cost of the bike the OP posted. Also as a small manufacturer who assemble in house based on their imported frames i'd say they're probably a lot more flexible building on an as required basis rather than production line of a more mainstream manufacturer. Anyway at the budget Heike's going for, for a hard tail especially, she'll be doing well to get a bad bike it's just a case of what suits her husband best. 

In reply to Frank4short:

Suggesting the OP spends more on a bike because the manufacture might do a deal isn't really helping the matter is it?

The Bfe isn't 3x or 2x, is over budget, likely to be heavier, 2/3 of its colour options have been vetoed and I suspect totally at the wrong end of the hardtail spectrum for what is wanted. 

The Solaris is much more likely to suit but still misses the mark. 

I'd like to throw another spanner in the works... what size are you going to buy him? A new bike is going to feel very different, a difference that he might not like. 

In reply to SC:

> For front suspension only, I'd go for a Genesis or Nukeproof and definitely avoid anything from the big brands (Giant, Specialized, Trek etc) because they're all crap for the money

Cheapest Genesis with front suspension is £2200, I was a little surprised by this. 

 Tricky Dicky 18 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

That Canyon is quite black in colour, I know that it's got a bit of blue, but if he said taht he doesn't want it black then...................

In reply to Heike:

I think what we have here is a perfect example of how a special gift chosen by people on the internet who cannot agree is probably not going to be as good as a special gift chosen by the recipient. 

 ChrisJD 18 Sep 2019
In reply to baron:

Bought my first MTB 33 years ago!

1x is not a fad.  On all three of my current bikes.

So glad to have no more front derailleur. 

 ChrisJD 18 Sep 2019
In reply to Phil79:

> I rode an old triple for years, before (fairly recently) moving to 1 x 11. You tend to loose a bit of range in the higher gears, but the lower gears you just don't feel any difference. I live on edge of Dartmoor and its pretty lumpy, lots of short sharp uphills, and longer climbs. 

> You do loose a bit in the higher gears and tend to spin out at high speed, but the simplicity and reliability outweigh the slight reduction in range. 

Have a look at the 11 speed E13 9-46t, works with SRAM  (and bigger gear range that the Eagle 10-50t cassette).  Will help with the spinning out.

 Phil79 18 Sep 2019
In reply to ChrisJD:

Its an SLX groupset, so assume not compatible?

Probably should have gone SRAM, but its absolutely fine for the riding I do.

 cb294 18 Sep 2019
In reply to Phil79:

Not compatible, but it is easy to exchange the freehub body. The nominal difference in shifting distance is minimal, much less than the normal play.

 Jon Greengrass 18 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

That Canyon bike looks great, don't forget a full face helmet to go with the racing ray front tyre. 

 SC 18 Sep 2019
In reply to thepodge:

> Cheapest Genesis with front suspension is £2200, I was a little surprised by this. 

No it isn't. They have hardtails from about £600!

In reply to SC:

> No it isn't. They have hardtails from about £600!

They might have done in the past but not any more. 

 ChrisJD 18 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

At the top end of the budget, but would get him some Ti. 

https://www.alpkit.com/sonder/bikes/sonder-signal-ti-sx-eagle-recon

(pre-orders at the moment)

baron 18 Sep 2019
In reply to ChrisJD:

> Bought my first MTB 33 years ago!

> 1x is not a fad.  On all three of my current bikes.

> So glad to have no more front derailleur. 

Did you get a sense of humour as well?

 ChrisJD 18 Sep 2019
In reply to baron:

Nope, never had one of those

baron 18 Sep 2019
In reply to ChrisJD:

> Nope, never had one of those

Probably my fault for not putting a smiley face after my sentence.

 Heike 18 Sep 2019
In reply to Tricky Dicky:

I know, but it ticks some other boxes. Cheers

 Heike 18 Sep 2019
In reply to ChrisJD:

Nice, but it is grey...

 Heike 18 Sep 2019
In reply to baron:

> Pick a bike that your hubby wants.

> Ignore all those telling you to get a 1x10 or 11 or 12, whatever the latest fad is 

> They were all probably riding single speed a few years ago

> Or unicycles

> Triple chainset for the win

Thank you I know, I just wanted to find what he wants which I was struggling with on the Internet (and in real shops), hence my question. He says now that he is happy with a double chainring so that was maybe my misunderstanding. I'll just have to keep looking.  I am sure I will find a nice bike somewhen...

Thanks for all the comments 

In reply to Heike:

I think by far the best option would be a nice little card with the words "£xxxx for you to spend on a new bike of your choice" .

Fit of a bike is so important that you could spend your money on a bike that ticks all the boxes your other half has given you, but ends up painful to ride.

Maybe try to get him to go to Glentress next weekend for the demo days they've got on so he can try a few sizes/models:

The Cotic Soul might fit the bill (except for the double/tripple)? if you go along and have a chat you may well find they'll swap to a 2x if you wanted it

https://www.moredirt.com/events/demo-days

 Heike 18 Sep 2019
In reply to balmybaldwin:

Yes, quite right, and I might well do that, I was never going to buy anything if I wasn't totally convinced. He can buy anything he wants with a nice card from me, thing is he has agonised for years as he can't find what he wants and keeps banging on about how knackered his bike is and unreliable etc, so I was trying to help him along to find a new one. That's all

Post edited at 19:42
In reply to Heike:

> Nice, but it is grey...

Lolz!
All over the country now there are people who have spent all their savings buying themselves super posh titanium bikes who are now in tears. That's a crushing put down!

 Frank4short 18 Sep 2019
In reply to ChrisJD:

> At the top end of the budget, but would get him some Ti. 

> (pre-orders at the moment)

Someone should report this post! Absolutely filthy...

In reply to Heike:

In that case a trip to a trail center that hires bikes would be a good call not sure what there is in your area, but phone ahead and check if they are happy for him to take a few different bikes out somewhere like bike park wales would be good. (It'll probably cost £100 for the days hire tho plus whatever fees for uplift/park entry). The key is probably to try loads of bikes of different styles & makes. Stumpies were great bikes, but the bike world has moved on. I was a cross country mtber and obsessed with light weight hard tails for years, but modern XC full suspension bikes aren't anything like as heavy as they used to be, and are often better climbers than hard tails now, plus in general going uphill quickly has gone out of fashion a bit, as a heavier bike with more bounce greatly increases the rewarding down hill. If uphill is really an obsession, maybe get him to try a cyclocross bike even.

Has he said anything about wheel size?

PS. I have a very tidy sub 25 pound 2012 120mm Front and Rear suspension Full Carbon 26" wheel Lapierre x-flow 712 with XTR/XT Triple Drivetrain (new chain/block) i'm considering selling which I would happily loan for a trial period (but I'm in the South) which I suspect will sell for around £1000 if I get round to putting it on ebay. it's an exceptional climber but can handle a decent amount downhill too. https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151882964847049&set=a.10150710912132049&type=3&theater

Post edited at 20:10
 ChrisJD 19 Sep 2019
In reply to balmybaldwin:

> If uphill is really an obsession, maybe get him to try a cyclocross bike even.

Or just accept you like pain over fun  ..... and buy a road bike. 😂

 SC 19 Sep 2019
In reply to thepodge:

> They might have done in the past but not any more. 

Maybe it's last years models but there's plenty of them still available.

 Heike 19 Sep 2019
In reply to ChrisJD:

He already has a beloved Pinarello road bike which he uses most other days when he is not on the mtb, i.e. when the weather is nice in Scotland  ...ok maybe not every other day...🤔

Post edited at 15:44
 Heike 19 Sep 2019
In reply to balmybaldwin:

Thanks, Wales is probably a bit far. No, he hasn't said anything about wheel size. When we bought our previous MTB bikes there was a good company in Edinburgh - Edinburgh bikes, my hubbies' bike is probably about five years older than mine,  but the thing is all of these places have now got very little stock in place, same in Glasgow in Dales and Evans.

 ChrisJD 19 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

Just surprise him with a 170/170mm enduro rig to challenge him out of his comfort zone and learn a new way of riding.

If the hills are as steep as you say, there will be a whole load of tek fun to ride down.

In reply to Heike:

My hardtail and full-suss are both 1x. I ride a lot in the Brecon Beacons where I live and can climb anything. I have a 10-50 and 30T on my trek and never need a lower gear. I cannot imagine what you would climb that would require a lower gear.

 StuPoo2 23 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

Don't buy a double ... he's mixing up number of gears vs gearing - not the same thing.  More gears doesn't mean getting up a hill easier - gearing does.   You can have a single with a huge range high/low or triple with a narrow range high/low.  

Nearly every decent hard tale MTB on the market now is a single chain ring and its awesome.  The chain just never comes off.  Like a reduction of 97%? maybe for me compared to when I was a kid. I think I managed to get it off once over the summer when a whole stick got in there and I went over the bars.  I've never heard anyone complain about a single.  

Couple of tips:

  1. Get a dropper ... amazing.  Biggest step forward in MTB's in 10 years.  He will ride more and he won't regret it.  (Plus ... it makes sense if you've got a single ... because now you've got space on the LHS of the bars for the dropper lever)
  2. Consider last years model.  It'll be £250 cheaper and no matter what anyone says ... bikes don't move that much forward in one year.  It's just marketing to keep up selling.

Happy riding!

 StuPoo2 23 Sep 2019
In reply to Heike:

Oh he's in Glasgow .. me too.

Where does he ride and I'll be able to tell you what you need to be looking at.

 ChrisJD 13 Oct 2019
In reply to Heike:

So what did you get in the end?


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