Recommend me a Belay Jacket

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 Dangerous Dave 08 Nov 2016
Looking for a belay jacket mostly for Scottish winter climbing and for climbing on the Aberdeen coast in the cold (90% of the year). There are a huge selection out there. Think I would prefer synthetic over the hydrophobic down but willing to listen to opinions. Generally like Montane and Mountain Equipment clothing, find Rab sizing a bit odd. Budget would be a maximum of £200 but would prefer near £150.

Cheers
 galpinos 08 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

The "industry standard" is the ME Fitzroy:

http://www.mountain-equipment.co.uk/fitzroy-jacket

Normally about £200, available for £130 if you're a tubber: http://www.needlesports.com/33927/products/mountain-equipment-mens-fitzroy-...
In reply to galpinos:

Thankfully not a tubber but that seems like it will cost my wallet more!
 Dell 08 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

You have to figure out how much you'd need to spend on food to get to the required weight for a discount jacket, to see if it's worth the hassle.
 galpinos 08 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

I've not worn one so don't know, sorry. I has the cheaper version of Primaloft in so on paper, not as warm for the weight.

ME in size large just fits me so I'm reluctant to deviate. They also do the best hoods in the business.
 Fiona Reid 08 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:
My other half lived in his Flux last winter and seemed very happy in it both indoors* and outdoors.


*We've now had proper heating installed so you no longer need several duvets/sleeping bag sit in the lounge. Last winter we entirely failed to get our lounge above 16C and 8-10C was all too common!
Post edited at 11:58
In reply to Dangerous Dave:
One man's belay jacket is another man's layer; not every jacket that someone belays in is a true belay jacket.

Very lightweight - not true belay jackets - Arcteryx Atom Lt, Patagonia Nano.


Lightweight - hardly a true belay jacket - Montane Flux.

Mediumweight - true belay jacket, but not always that warm - ME Fitzroy.

Heavyweight - true belay jackets, Patagonia Das Parka, ME Citadel.

FWIW I tend to run warm in winter. I didn't find the Fitzroy always great in schwat weather. I prefer the Das.
Post edited at 12:23
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

There is currently a Citadel for sale on here by Tom Last.
 ChrisH89 08 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

Another recommendation for the Fitzroy. They can often be found second hand because so many people use them!
 99ster 08 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

Another (very well priced) option is the Alpkit 0Hiro Belay Jacket:
https://www.alpkit.com/products/0hiro-jacket-men
 Alpenglow 08 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

I'd go for the Fitzroy or the Rab Photon X
 Mark F 10 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

I love my Montane Ice Guide jacket. Not the lightest, but toasty warm.

https://www.ultralightoutdoorgear.co.uk/mens-clothing-c1/mens-synthetic-ins...
 Fraser 10 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:
I picked up a Montane Black Ice 2.0 from Tiso last year for about £120 and it's great. It might be slightly too heavy/bulky for what you're after though, but is definitely worth a peek at that price.

https://www.montane.co.uk/mens-c1/clothing-c25/insulated-jackets-c6/black-i...

http://www.gooutdoors.co.uk/montane-black-ice-2-0-jacket-p353291
Post edited at 13:37
 lucozade 10 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:
Got the Flux and would agree that it's not really a belay jacket. It's good for throwing on and giving a bit more warmth but not enough for me in colder temps. Sizing is true to size on the Flux. Other Montane options would be Ice Guide which is a lot warmer and bulkier or maybe try the new Q Luxe or whatever it's name is.... Here (good price too) - http://www.gaynors.co.uk/brands/montane/insulation/dp-117680/mens-hi-q-luxe...
Post edited at 14:01
 nniff 10 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

I've just acquired an ME Fitzroy (from Needlesports before they had tuber-only sizes left). It's toastier than the Patagonia one that preceded it (some black synthetic nano-doofry-wotsit).. It has only been tested on the harsh and unforgiving local steppe (well, the heath). All seems good to me - although why manufacturers don't put a single popper at the bottom of a two way zip defeats me.
 jezb1 10 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

The Fitzroy wasn't warm enough for me as a proper winter belay jacket, but I'm soft. Citadel wins for me.
 Jim 1003 10 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

Try Decathlon for a Simond, less than £50, Ive had mine for 2 seasons now.
 CaelanB 10 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

I have the patagonia DAS parka, it's definitely not the lightest, but in its favour I've never been cold whilst scottish winter climbing. Really great jacket.
 Brian Pollock 10 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

You can get the fancy new Arcteryx offering, Nuclei AR (100g synthetic fill with gore windstopper shell) half price for £175 on Sportpursuit at the moment. Definitely a full purpose belay jacket, fits big and massive hood.
 tehmarks 10 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

I've got a Flux and it makes a great 'belay jacket' for the top of Stanage, but I don't think it'd be anywhere near warm enough for a poor Scottish winter day.
 Paul16 10 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

If you're going to be doing this for the foreseeable future then maybe save up some money and get a PHD jacket? I just bought an Alpha for around £300 and my rationale was that it's affordable if I keep it for 5+ years rather than upgrading again in a couple.

It may not be an option but if you can do it then I would.
 JayPee630 10 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:
I've got an Arcteryx SV Atom hoody for sale in black and medium, which fits into the lightweight belay jacket category mentioned above.

The new version is the AR Atom hoody, pretty much the same specs I think. http://www.arcteryx.com/product.aspx?country=ca&language=en&gender=Mens&cat...

It's in excellent condition, only worn a few times.

If you're interested email me on: lotusbamboo@hotmail.com
Post edited at 20:55
 Fenda 10 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

I love my Rab Photon X
 Taurig 14 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

I've got a Fitzroy, for what I use it for (winter hillwalking in Scotland, lunch stops, back up insulation) I can't find much fault with it. Lives in my bag Nov-April, good hood, quite robust.

However, if I was hanging on a belay for an hour in spindrift, I'd be looking for something a bit more substantial. IIRC it's 100g body and 60g arms; personally that's not enough for staying static, although I'm 5'9 and 70 kg so not exactly a big bloke.

Maybe consider the ME Citadel as above, or the Montane Ice Guide?
 ChrisNaylor 14 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

I'd recommend the Rab Photon X, great jacket, used it all last winter (Cairngorm, the Ben, Lakes) and highly rate it! I've climbed in it, slept in it, sat round fires in it even used it on cold nights out & it still looks and feels like new.

My dad has the Fitzroy and ended up doubling this up with his dead bird down jacket when we topped out on the Ben last winter. On the other hand I was toasty with the Photon X over my VR Alpine and merino baselayer.
 angry pirate 14 Nov 2016
In reply to ChrisNaylor:

Would you say that's down to the jacket or differences in your metabolisms?
On paper the Photon and the Fitzroy are very similar animals: same weight of primaloft, similar design and cut etc. so I'm surprised that there's much difference in them.
Fwiw I've got a Rab Alpine Generator (effectively the older Photon x) and I really rate it as a belay jacket. That said I've not yet spent hours shivering on a stance at -20 in a hoolie while a mate scratches his way up a grade VII death route as I'm too much of a punter.
For the general hill walking, lower grade routes, standing around for hours waiting for D of e kids stuff I end up doing I think the generator/photon is plenty warm enough and I carry a tiny down gilet for extra temperature boost if it's proper cold which I find more flexible and probably as warm paired up with the generator as having a heavier belay jacket for similar weight.
 HeMa 14 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

What I don't get is why nearly all dubbed belay jackets have that stretch sleeve ends? I mean how are you supposed to fit your damp/wet action gloves through them and then don the belay no-can-do mittens? How come none of them boast oversized sleeve ends with proper velcro-fasteners.
ROSP 14 Nov 2016
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

I love my Mountain Equipment Fitz Roy - wonderful feeling when you throw that thing on at a cold belay or during an epic. Always in my pack for climbing and it's not too bad for mincing about the town or campsite on a cold day!
 ChrisNaylor 14 Nov 2016
In reply to angry pirate:

Yeah in hindsight it could be physiological as opposed to down to the jacket.. It was the first scenario i was reminded of between the two jackets!
 ChrisH89 15 Nov 2016
In reply to HeMa:

Fitzroy has big sleeves with velcro fasteners!
 Robert Durran 15 Nov 2016
In reply to ROSP:

As belay jackets go, the Fitzroy is pretty thin. I use it as an outer mid layer and have a much meatier Rab thing for actual belaying.
ROSP 15 Nov 2016
In reply to Robert Durran:

Fair enough, it's perfect for me, but I normally wear an insulated softshell underneath! Horses for courses and all that!
 galpinos 15 Nov 2016
In reply to Robert Durran:

I think earlier versions of this thread revealed you seem to be the coldest man on planet though?
In reply to Dangerous Dave:

Must be one of the most often asked questions.......?

If it's warm enough for belaying for more than 1hr, it's too bulky, needs to be carried in a pack! Or you have one between 2, second wearing it, pass over at belay. Typically more expensive to trash also!
This system means all heat generated by leading is often lost, before a big puffy thing can be worn, then having to reheat oneself.

Something is better than nothing. A compact, light thing hanging off harness, can easily be carried by both, donned immediatly before evaporated heat loss takes place! If a monster pitch has to be lead, both can be worn/carried by second.

Winter climbing is inherently a cold enviroment, accepting this, what gives you the most fun climbing?

Stuart
 Robert Durran 15 Nov 2016
In reply to galpinos:

> I think earlier versions of this thread revealed you seem to be the coldest man on the planet though?

Probably. I expect I'd struggle with the cold on Venus too The point is that people feel the cold to very different extents, so recommending a specific jacket to the OP is really pretty pointless; they need to experiment with different combinations of clothing and different jackets to find out what works for them.
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