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Having a few issues with packing the absolute basics for two weeks in the Alps.
Option one, Take as much as you like- set a tent in campsite for the entire stay and go lightweight for the day/rough bivvy night, always leaving your tent and gear.
Option two, go lightweight from the UK-Admin myself in campsites and then tent camp whilst rambling/climbing for a few days at a time.
Things in the picture fill a 60l backpack minus the rack,helmet,water
http://oi64.tinypic.com/1zoxcut.jpg
Is it a bad idea to pitch the banshee 200 with just the fly-leaving the inner behind? Substitute the ground sheet with bin liners.
Could get a smaller sleeping bag quite cheaply I would imagine, as mine is probably overkill and certainly overkill size wise! Any recommendations?
Exped lite 5m is pretty lightweight so will probably pad out underneath with rope and rucksack.
First aid kit is a survival bag, zinc tape,dextrose, crepe bandage, compass with 3mm mammut cord tied as spare prussik for the neck loop.) BD head torch- Nut key is my knife
Montane flux jacket, not taking a hard shell.
Musto stretch shorts
Very lightweight trousers (mountain warehouse)
1 montane synthetic shirt, (dry fast after washing) and another to wear whilst it is drying.
Asolo B2s exclusively, and a pair of old Evolve defys racked, if I find myself not needing them, I will bin them at the first opportunity.
1 spare pair of thick socks
Things I haven't packed:
Montane Prism gloves or ME guide gloves
Waterproof Hardshell
Camera-GoPro and a small Lumix - chargers...
Suncream-lip balm-food-water-(bar the 1litre chute) toiletries-towel
Coffee mug and brew kit. Or a lighter, jetboil has a starter...
Packed it last night, and left all of the above out, and also left out rack, shoes, belay jacket, clothes, helmet out. All this kit, does not fit in a 60l rucksack. Am I doing something wrong?
Post edited at 12:09
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In reply to zimpara:
I only take a 38 litre. Tent under the compression straps at one side of the bag, sleeping mat under the ones at the other. from bottom up in the bag; sleeping bag (under one kilo, wouldn't buy heavier again, ) then belay jacket, clothes (2 sets, one for wearing and one for washing, and waterproofs for miserable weather, but thin and light) , stove, rack (alpine, thin out UK trad rack) harness, shoes, helmet. Boots have laces tied together and go under the lid along with the rope.
I only take a 38 litre. Tent under the compression straps at one side of the bag, sleeping mat under the ones at the other. from bottom up in the bag; sleeping bag (under one kilo, wouldn't buy heavier again, ) then belay jacket, clothes (2 sets, one for wearing and one for washing, and waterproofs for miserable weather, but thin and light) , stove, rack (alpine, thin out UK trad rack) harness, shoes, helmet. Boots have laces tied together and go under the lid along with the rope.
In reply to jonnie3430:
I've managed the same (although bivi bag rather than tent on the outside) in a 31 litre bag, however I've always taken other kit for basecamp (proper tent; guides - often several and fairly heavy; waterproof - it may not be raining when you're up high, but it'll rain in 2 weeks; chargers; larger pans and cooking stuff for making actual meals; other rack which I won't need on every route - ice gear and quickdraws mostly; maybe an extra axe/walking poles; spare clothes etc.), but I guess this depends what you're planning. Also I'd definitely take at least 1 pair of gloves.
I've managed the same (although bivi bag rather than tent on the outside) in a 31 litre bag, however I've always taken other kit for basecamp (proper tent; guides - often several and fairly heavy; waterproof - it may not be raining when you're up high, but it'll rain in 2 weeks; chargers; larger pans and cooking stuff for making actual meals; other rack which I won't need on every route - ice gear and quickdraws mostly; maybe an extra axe/walking poles; spare clothes etc.), but I guess this depends what you're planning. Also I'd definitely take at least 1 pair of gloves.
In reply to zimpara: I don't get this - what are you putting in the 60l rucksack? I'd aim to get everything in 60l, with the rope on the outside.
How are you getting there?
How are you getting there?
In reply to wbo:
Thinking about this I'm even more confused now. Assuming you're partnering up, you'll be sharing rack and tent/cooking gear with your partner(s).
If you're talking about getting it on a plane, you'd likely be limited by the weight, and if not, chucking most of it in a holdall for the hold and then carrying what you can/the extras in your 60l (assuming it'll flex down to cabin bag dimensions) will likely be more flexible at both ends of the flight. If you're not planning on having any kind of base camp you can switch this up by taking a 'bag for life' or similar as your carry on (lightweight and useful) and putting your 60l in the hold. Even the latter should allow you to fit in your extras with the space saved on sharing gear at the other end.
Thinking about this I'm even more confused now. Assuming you're partnering up, you'll be sharing rack and tent/cooking gear with your partner(s).
If you're talking about getting it on a plane, you'd likely be limited by the weight, and if not, chucking most of it in a holdall for the hold and then carrying what you can/the extras in your 60l (assuming it'll flex down to cabin bag dimensions) will likely be more flexible at both ends of the flight. If you're not planning on having any kind of base camp you can switch this up by taking a 'bag for life' or similar as your carry on (lightweight and useful) and putting your 60l in the hold. Even the latter should allow you to fit in your extras with the space saved on sharing gear at the other end.
In reply to wbo:
I'm aiming to get it all inside too, bar the rack, rope and helmet. But it's not fitting. The tent is massive and the doss bag. Is this a similar amount of kit to what you take?
Getting a lift there.
I'm aiming to get it all inside too, bar the rack, rope and helmet. But it's not fitting. The tent is massive and the doss bag. Is this a similar amount of kit to what you take?
Getting a lift there.
In reply to zimpara:
You'll want to comfy on the campsite so take plenty. It will rain so take a proper tent or you will be miserable and all your stuff wet. Wild camping isn't really allowed in the alps and carrying stuff is a real drag anyway. Best to use bivvy huts (loads in Italy, less so in France and Switzerland) or if money is tight just take a bed-night at huts with no meal and carry a stove..
You'll want to comfy on the campsite so take plenty. It will rain so take a proper tent or you will be miserable and all your stuff wet. Wild camping isn't really allowed in the alps and carrying stuff is a real drag anyway. Best to use bivvy huts (loads in Italy, less so in France and Switzerland) or if money is tight just take a bed-night at huts with no meal and carry a stove..
In reply to zimpara:
Lose the gri-gri and the cams. Take bug and tri-cams instead. (Offset nuts, hexes and tri-cams seem far more useful in the Alps, in my experience.)
Lose the tent bag - pack the parts individually.
DO take a hard-shell. I've needed a hard-shell in the Alps far more often than I've ever needed a puffy jacket - if you're moving, you'll be warm enough if you're dry, if you're not moving, you can always wear your sleeping bag. (My Alpine warm-gear system is: fleece-lined buff, beanie, soft-shell top & bottoms, hard-shell top, skiing gloves, thermals for dire conditions. I've carried more and never needed it. Additionally, I always carry a pair of light-weight shorts for the up-hill, below the snow line, and a spare shirt to remain dry. Spare socks if sleeping in a tent but never for walking - if your socks are wet, your boots are also wet - dry socks won't last a minute.)
Ditch the GoPro.
What do you need a towel for in the mountains? You ain't gonna swim in Alpine streams.
Coffee always seems like a good idea. I have often carried a Bialetti. It just never seems to work out, though. In the morning, you want to get up and going and drinking coffee at night is rather silly. Nobody wants to stop and mess about during the day. Ditch it.
Lose the gri-gri and the cams. Take bug and tri-cams instead. (Offset nuts, hexes and tri-cams seem far more useful in the Alps, in my experience.)
Lose the tent bag - pack the parts individually.
DO take a hard-shell. I've needed a hard-shell in the Alps far more often than I've ever needed a puffy jacket - if you're moving, you'll be warm enough if you're dry, if you're not moving, you can always wear your sleeping bag. (My Alpine warm-gear system is: fleece-lined buff, beanie, soft-shell top & bottoms, hard-shell top, skiing gloves, thermals for dire conditions. I've carried more and never needed it. Additionally, I always carry a pair of light-weight shorts for the up-hill, below the snow line, and a spare shirt to remain dry. Spare socks if sleeping in a tent but never for walking - if your socks are wet, your boots are also wet - dry socks won't last a minute.)
Ditch the GoPro.
What do you need a towel for in the mountains? You ain't gonna swim in Alpine streams.
Coffee always seems like a good idea. I have often carried a Bialetti. It just never seems to work out, though. In the morning, you want to get up and going and drinking coffee at night is rather silly. Nobody wants to stop and mess about during the day. Ditch it.
In reply to zimpara:
I ask how you'e getting there as if you're car camping, or can stash stuff in the car you can take a lot more, and valley camp in luxury, not so much luxury on the hill. I am quite surprised you cant get all that in a 60l - I use an Osprey mutant that's around 40, and get everything in that. My tent is a bit smaller (MH Direkt2) and my bag is a fairly basic 2/3 season down number so pretty small. For the walk in I can get everything inside, including the rack, but I don't put the rope in (in 60l I could though.)
What's the rucksack - is it a weird shape, or is it ok?
Edit - I'd take cams overy tricams for Cham granite every time. I assume the grigri is useful as Zimpypoos has a penchant for ropesoloing.
I ask how you'e getting there as if you're car camping, or can stash stuff in the car you can take a lot more, and valley camp in luxury, not so much luxury on the hill. I am quite surprised you cant get all that in a 60l - I use an Osprey mutant that's around 40, and get everything in that. My tent is a bit smaller (MH Direkt2) and my bag is a fairly basic 2/3 season down number so pretty small. For the walk in I can get everything inside, including the rack, but I don't put the rope in (in 60l I could though.)
What's the rucksack - is it a weird shape, or is it ok?
Edit - I'd take cams overy tricams for Cham granite every time. I assume the grigri is useful as Zimpypoos has a penchant for ropesoloing.
Post edited at 14:12
In reply to wbo:
Hmm... I was thinking more of that chossy stuff in Austria. Don't know Chamonix but I'd agree with cams for Granite.
> Edit - I'd take cams overy tricams for Cham granite every time. I assume the grigri is useful as Zimpypoos has a penchant for ropesoloing.
Hmm... I was thinking more of that chossy stuff in Austria. Don't know Chamonix but I'd agree with cams for Granite.
In reply to zimpara:
Not a terrible idea on the tent, if it still stands up ok.
Bin liners sound like a RUBBISH idea.
Cheapy poundshop groundsheets are crap, but very small and light, essentially a sheet of thin polythene with eyelets on each corner. (They are also in the DIY section of poundland as tarpaulins)
That MicroLite bag is likely to be neither Micro nor Lite. Use a skinnier bag and wear your spare clothes in bed, and a hat if need be.
Do change into your 'nightwear' every night and change back to your day clothes in the morning. You will feel less like a tramp and will be able to give your 'working clothes' an airing.
Will be uncomfy under the upper part of the body, try a cheap foam mat (£3.99 from Decathlon) to go underneath. Cut down to 3/4 length, rucksack under your legs.
Duct tape. Must.
Immodium and Ibuprofen, essentials!
3mm for prussic? Nooo!
Spare batteries!
Take a hard shell! Even if it's just a polythene disposable festival poncho for around the campsite.
Take a towel. A small backpacking type one. Or even a small microfibre towel (poundshop, under Car/DIY or toiletries section)
Bog roll and small bottle of hand sanitiser, don't forget your toothbrush!
The starters tend to break, take a mini Bic.
Share the jetboil and take a plastic cup each. Don't lug around the jetboil coffee press or whatever. Get the 3-in-one coffee sachets, and carry some milk powder to cream it up.
Of course you don't 'have' to take the jetboil....A solid fuel/esbit stove, or alcohol stove (diy beer can stove?) will save you a bit of weight combined with a cheap aluminium pan or large metal mug.
Yes, you aren't carrying the latest ultra-lightweight micro-packing expensive gear, as used by all your (sponsored) favourite climbing athletes and journo/reviewers. But there are always other solutions!
> Is it a bad idea to pitch the banshee 200 with just the fly-leaving the inner behind? Substitute the ground sheet with bin liners.
Not a terrible idea on the tent, if it still stands up ok.
Bin liners sound like a RUBBISH idea.
Cheapy poundshop groundsheets are crap, but very small and light, essentially a sheet of thin polythene with eyelets on each corner. (They are also in the DIY section of poundland as tarpaulins)
> Could get a smaller sleeping bag quite cheaply I would imagine, as mine is probably overkill and certainly overkill size wise! Any recommendations?
That MicroLite bag is likely to be neither Micro nor Lite. Use a skinnier bag and wear your spare clothes in bed, and a hat if need be.
Do change into your 'nightwear' every night and change back to your day clothes in the morning. You will feel less like a tramp and will be able to give your 'working clothes' an airing.
> Exped lite 5m is pretty lightweight so will probably pad out underneath with rope and rucksack.
Will be uncomfy under the upper part of the body, try a cheap foam mat (£3.99 from Decathlon) to go underneath. Cut down to 3/4 length, rucksack under your legs.
Duct tape. Must.
> First aid kit is a survival bag, zinc tape,dextrose, crepe bandage, compass with 3mm mammut cord tied as spare prussik for the neck loop.) BD head torch- Nut key is my knife
Immodium and Ibuprofen, essentials!
3mm for prussic? Nooo!
Spare batteries!
> Montane flux jacket, not taking a hard shell.
Take a hard shell! Even if it's just a polythene disposable festival poncho for around the campsite.
> Things I haven't packed:
> Montane Prism gloves or ME guide gloves
> Waterproof Hardshell
> Camera-GoPro and a small Lumix - chargers...
> Suncream-lip balm-food-water-(bar the 1litre chute) toiletries-towel
Take a towel. A small backpacking type one. Or even a small microfibre towel (poundshop, under Car/DIY or toiletries section)
Bog roll and small bottle of hand sanitiser, don't forget your toothbrush!
> Coffee mug and brew kit. Or a lighter, jetboil has a starter...
The starters tend to break, take a mini Bic.
Share the jetboil and take a plastic cup each. Don't lug around the jetboil coffee press or whatever. Get the 3-in-one coffee sachets, and carry some milk powder to cream it up.
Of course you don't 'have' to take the jetboil....A solid fuel/esbit stove, or alcohol stove (diy beer can stove?) will save you a bit of weight combined with a cheap aluminium pan or large metal mug.
> Packed it last night, and left all of the above out, and also left out rack, shoes, belay jacket, clothes, helmet out. All this kit, does not fit in a 60l rucksack. Am I doing something wrong?
Yes, you aren't carrying the latest ultra-lightweight micro-packing expensive gear, as used by all your (sponsored) favourite climbing athletes and journo/reviewers. But there are always other solutions!
In reply to zimpara:
Avoid the camping stuff entirely and stay in guardianed huts/hostels/hotels/self-catering. Then all you need is a sleeping bag liner instead of tent/sleepingbag/karrimat/stove. Yes it is more expensive, but you pays your money and takes your choice.
Avoid the camping stuff entirely and stay in guardianed huts/hostels/hotels/self-catering. Then all you need is a sleeping bag liner instead of tent/sleepingbag/karrimat/stove. Yes it is more expensive, but you pays your money and takes your choice.
In reply to Toerag:
Staying in huts and carrying your own food isn't all that expensive, particularly if you're a DAV member or can convince them that you're a member of the appropriate mountaineering club in your own country - something I successfully did for a friend who was a member of the MCSA.
Honestly, though, the food in the huts is expensive and boring. In Austria, "das Bergsteigeressen" (nearly always Spaghetti Bolognese) really doesn't make for inspired eating on the hill and everything else is pricey.
Then, you can replace mat, tent and sleeping bag with a tiny inner bag and a pair of slops for "hut shoes." Also, you have a source of fresh water so no need to carry a filter and you have proper toilets at least once a day. If you spend more than one night at a single hut, you can also leave a lot of gear there when you go to climb.
EDIT: Also, you get fresh, cold beer on the hill, at night - and it's more or less the same price as it would be in a pub in the valley (about 3€ for 500ml)
Staying in huts and carrying your own food isn't all that expensive, particularly if you're a DAV member or can convince them that you're a member of the appropriate mountaineering club in your own country - something I successfully did for a friend who was a member of the MCSA.
Honestly, though, the food in the huts is expensive and boring. In Austria, "das Bergsteigeressen" (nearly always Spaghetti Bolognese) really doesn't make for inspired eating on the hill and everything else is pricey.
Then, you can replace mat, tent and sleeping bag with a tiny inner bag and a pair of slops for "hut shoes." Also, you have a source of fresh water so no need to carry a filter and you have proper toilets at least once a day. If you spend more than one night at a single hut, you can also leave a lot of gear there when you go to climb.
EDIT: Also, you get fresh, cold beer on the hill, at night - and it's more or less the same price as it would be in a pub in the valley (about 3€ for 500ml)
Post edited at 15:50
1
In reply to Xharlie:
Wear all your clothes including helmet on the plane (i never put my foam helmet in the hold as it will get damaged anyway), gaffer tape bulky items onto the outside of your checked baggage and make some friends at youre valley campsite base who dont mind you stashing a bag with them when youre in mountains. And take a hardshell it can rain a lot in the alps especially in deep valleys like chamonix
Wear all your clothes including helmet on the plane (i never put my foam helmet in the hold as it will get damaged anyway), gaffer tape bulky items onto the outside of your checked baggage and make some friends at youre valley campsite base who dont mind you stashing a bag with them when youre in mountains. And take a hardshell it can rain a lot in the alps especially in deep valleys like chamonix
1
In reply to zimpara:
I suspect the 1.9kg cheap synthetic sleeping bag is taking up far more than its fair share of volume (and weight) compared to what most Alpinists bring...
edit: nearly 14l according to the packed size.
I suspect the 1.9kg cheap synthetic sleeping bag is taking up far more than its fair share of volume (and weight) compared to what most Alpinists bring...
edit: nearly 14l according to the packed size.
Post edited at 12:20
In reply to zimpara:
Just buy a massive holdall to get it there then just leave what you don't need in the tent when you are on the hill......
Just buy a massive holdall to get it there then just leave what you don't need in the tent when you are on the hill......
1
In reply to Dark-Cloud:
+1 and take the lightest sleeping bag you have. Buy a cheapo one at Decathlon or The Old Camper down the road a bit if you are getting cold.
> Just buy a massive holdall to get it there then just leave what you don't need in the tent when you are on the hill......
+1 and take the lightest sleeping bag you have. Buy a cheapo one at Decathlon or The Old Camper down the road a bit if you are getting cold.
1
In reply to andrewmcleod:
Nice one Andrew! Just got a Blacks aerolite 1000 jobby. They had the 700 but that looked a touch cold! Tried to get mountain equipment starlight micro but they couldn't get one in.
Dell: nice one for the ideas! I usually have a festival plastic rain poncho in my first aid kit. But took it out in persuit of alpenis light is right, forgetting I wasn't taking a hard shell.
Will post back when I've sorted the other suggestions.
Cheers
Nice one Andrew! Just got a Blacks aerolite 1000 jobby. They had the 700 but that looked a touch cold! Tried to get mountain equipment starlight micro but they couldn't get one in.
Dell: nice one for the ideas! I usually have a festival plastic rain poncho in my first aid kit. But took it out in persuit of alpenis light is right, forgetting I wasn't taking a hard shell.
Will post back when I've sorted the other suggestions.
Cheers
Post edited at 14:51
1
In reply to zimpara:
Proper hard shell, definitely. The lightest you have / can afford, but if you don't take one and you get caught without shelter in an afternoon thunderstorm you'll be properly f*cked.
Proper hard shell, definitely. The lightest you have / can afford, but if you don't take one and you get caught without shelter in an afternoon thunderstorm you'll be properly f*cked.
2
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