Petrol stoves for use with sub-par fuel

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 Roberttaylor 08 Apr 2016
After a bit of advice on using petrol stoves with shoddy petrol.
Friends have noticed that the petrol available in Kyrgyzstan tends to gum up petrol stoves, leading to them becoming less powerful as a trip goes on. Given that we are going for a month, has anyone got suggestions for the following;

-Best stove for reliability and power output with bad petrol?
-Best way to clean said stove?

Robert
 mike123 08 Apr 2016
In reply to Roberttaylor:
MSR XGK . Burns well with just about anything that's flamable . As opposed to a whisper lite which barely burns with anything but white gas. Take plenty (Several ) spare nozzles and prickers . Can be worth Jerry rigging a filter if the petrol is visibly dirty , as in if you put some in a glass there are bits floating in it . Cut up bits of Old cotton t shirt work well for filters . Also worth checking that the fuel you have bought for your trip does actually burn before you set off . Ffs you and your mates would have to be really stupid not to think of that and get to your first night of the walk in to find you can't even make a brew and have to send somebody back to the nearest town the next day . (Wanders off kicking stones and avoiding eye contact)
Edit : Msr video of cleaning etc ->
youtube.com/watch?v=eAciKxag47o&
Post edited at 17:14
1
 Mr. Lee 08 Apr 2016
In reply to Roberttaylor:

Another vote for the XGK. Used with filthy kerosene in Pakistan without problem on a couple of trips. It's a beast.
 leon 1 08 Apr 2016
In reply to Roberttaylor:
Agree about the spare jets Take at least 2 spare ones and some prickers. Paper coffee filters work really well for filtering dirty fuel. Its worth taking a few along just for that purpose, (a bit of cotton wool in the bottom of the coffee filter also helps and maybe a small funnel to do it with at basecamp). Also I think the Xgk EX is a much better stove to run than the older XGK s but whichever stove you take along learn to use it competently and learn how to strip it down and understand its foibles BEFORE you go.
Post edited at 18:29
 Andes 08 Apr 2016
In reply to Roberttaylor:
Saw this post on UKC about stoves. I have a brand new XGK-EX for sale if you like. It has never been used, surplus to requirements of my business now.
Also loads of spares including a spare pump I can throw in
Post edited at 19:30
 Jenny C 08 Apr 2016
In reply to Roberttaylor:

Another vote for the XGK - had to resort to the diesel jet in Peru, but with that fitted the stove worked fine.

As others have said be prepared to do regular servicing/maintenance to keep the stove in working condition.
 TobyA 08 Apr 2016
In reply to mike123:

I've got the Whisperlite International and have run it fine on petrol bought in rural India and Nepal. I think I ran it on kerosene bought in the Nepalese mountain too. I've run it on lead free as well which is mucky, but it works OK. Anyway, it needs cleaning from time to time, but keeps going. Works fine still 25 years on!
 RR 09 Apr 2016
In reply to TobyA:

I haven't had problems with the Whipserlite Universal, runs also on all sorts of different liquids and canisters. Is this an alternative?
Have an old XGK still working (bought in the '80? used until 2013/14) that is a save choice. That stove has seen all kinds of liquids. So I expect the new XGK EX should be better.
Both stoves are field repairable.
In reply to Roberttaylor:

I've been on a few Greenland expeditions where the fuel used was A1 Jet (a kerosene based aircraft fuel). Various team members had a variety of stoves between them including a WhisperLite and a DragonFly but the first never functioned properly and the second had problems. The only stove that was completely reliable burning this sort of fuel in sub-zero conditions was the XGK. The WhisperLite is cheaper but doesn't really work well on paraffin in my experience and the DragonFly simmers better than the XGK but seems more temperamental when conditions and fuels get tricky.

The new XGK EX had to be produced apparently as the older model could not fit inside a GI's helmet which gives you some idea of how many of these MSR probably sell and the sort of conditions they are designed to be used in.

Two of the great advantages of MSR stoves are the shaker jet system, which means most blockages can be cleared without turning the stove off, and the cut cable that lives inside the fuel tube and works a bit like a pull-through in a rifle, which means (if you pull it out and clean it regularly) you shouldn't get any blockages of carbonised gunk in the pre-heating tube. Having said that, I'd still take spare jets and prickers, along with o-rings on any trip. Maintaining the thing in the field is simple though it's best to go through it all in advance so that you are totally familiar with it.

Mine is an older model which has given years of good service. Having tried various other stoves, I wouldn't take anything else other than an XGK on an expedition.
 Tom Briggs 11 Apr 2016
In reply to Roberttaylor:
Depends what you're planning, but why not use gas? You can buy Optimus gas in Kyrgyzstan.
Post edited at 14:19
 ebdon 11 Apr 2016
In reply to Tom Briggs:

I have used fuel from a petrol station in a wisperlite in kyrgyzstan with no problems (we asked our driver to get the best stuff available) I've also used kerosene in Ethiopia allthough I wouldn't recommend the latter and I cant imagine it working if it was cold with the amount of effort it took to prime it at 30 degrees!
 LastBoyScout 11 Apr 2016
In reply to Roberttaylor:

Would have suggested the Primus Omnifuel, but everyone seems to have beaten me to it with the XGK, which you won't go wrong with.
In reply to ebdon:

> I cant imagine it working if it was cold with the amount of effort it took to prime it at 30 degrees!

Coleman Priming Paste is highly recommended for getting paraffin started.
 d_b 13 Apr 2016
In reply to Stephen Reid - Needle Sports:

What's priming paste like to light with a fire steel? I have never really used it.
 Mr. Lee 13 Apr 2016
In reply to Stephen Reid - Needle Sports:

> I've been on a few Greenland expeditions where the fuel used was A1 Jet (a kerosene based aircraft fuel). Various team members had a variety of stoves between them including a WhisperLite and a DragonFly but the first never functioned properly and the second had problems. The only stove that was completely reliable burning this sort of fuel in sub-zero conditions was the XGK. The WhisperLite is cheaper but doesn't really work well on paraffin in my experience and the DragonFly simmers better than the XGK but seems more temperamental when conditions and fuels get tricky.

I've had identical experiences. My first multifuel stove was a WhisperLite but it was hopeless. It blocked within a day when using Chinese kerosene. I've also a Dragonfly but it started becoming problematic after a few weeks when using Pakistani kerosene. My XGK in comparison is a different league. Last summer I used it for three weeks with Pakistani kerosene and never once needed to clean it.
 fhyndoh 13 Apr 2016
In reply to Roberttaylor:
i have a first generation MSR XGK (i brougt of ebay as a student) and a more modern one with a shaker jet you and @JdotP can try if you like, and i'm happy to lend the early generation one to you both for the trip.

PS. i also have experience getting it to run on odd fuels like olive oil (don't ask)
Post edited at 12:06
 Mr. Lee 13 Apr 2016
In reply to Tom Briggs:

> Depends what you're planning, but why not use gas? You can buy Optimus gas in Kyrgyzstan.

I personally prefer to use a multi-fuel stove at base camp because they are more environmentally friendly (no empty gas cannisters left over) and the fuel is a fraction of the price of gas. I've always used gas for climbing because it's more practical.
 Toerag 13 Apr 2016
In reply to Stephen Reid - Needle Sports:

> Two of the great advantages of MSR stoves are the shaker jet system, which means most blockages can be cleared without turning the stove off, and the cut cable that lives inside the fuel tube and works a bit like a pull-through in a rifle, which means (if you pull it out and clean it regularly) you shouldn't get any blockages of carbonised gunk in the pre-heating tube.

Dragonfly doesn't have a cable does it?
In reply to davidbeynon:

> What's priming paste like to light with a fire steel? I have never really used it.

Not sure, I've always used matches. But I don't see why it wouldn't light - though it would be worth taking matches as a back up.

In reply to Toerag:

> Dragonfly doesn't have a cable does it?

True - I'd forgotten that, but I've never used one.
In reply to Tom Briggs:

> Depends what you're planning, but why not use gas? You can buy Optimus gas in Kyrgyzstan.

I've found gas pretty useless much below 0C, certainly at -10C and below.
 ad111 13 Apr 2016
In reply to mike123:

I used the whisperlite to cook on for 5 months using a mixture of diesel and petrol and it is still running fine today. 4 months in I had to change one of the rubber bits - which was easy and took 5 mins and came with the stove in the repairs kit. I think it has been incredibly good and reliable.

The XGK just burns the living crap out of things as soon as you turn your back.
 Iwan 13 Apr 2016
In reply to Roberttaylor:

Various people I travelled with this year had issues with their Omnifuels. One guy had a blocked filter and had no spares. Another guy had a filter blockage every few hours even when using Primus Powerfuel. He also had numerous jet and feed tube issues. My XGK and a friend's Mk1 Nova had no such issues. We summised that the Omnifuel was prone to blockages as it is more finely engineered than the XGK. The Omnifuel is much more efficient than the XGK but the XGK is so much more reliable.
In reply to ad111:

> I used the whisperlite to cook on for 5 months using a mixture of diesel and petrol and it is still running fine today.

That's fairly amazing as it isn't designed to work on diesel.

In reply to ad111:

> The XGK just burns the living crap out of things as soon as you turn your back.

Indeed it does - but it's a brilliant snow melter. And you can just about cook on it - just don't turn your back!

 damowilk 14 Apr 2016
In reply to Roberttaylor:

Anyone used the Soto Muka on expedition?
Only runs on unleaded and white gas, but the high burn rate might be good for dirty fuel. I've got one, but limited use so far.
 ad111 14 Apr 2016
In reply to Stephen Reid - Needle Sports:

> That's fairly amazing as it isn't designed to work on diesel.

I know!

It was usually a mixture of petrol and diesel as it is easier to light than just petrol.

I just needed to give it a good clean every week to clear the gunk out.
OP Roberttaylor 24 Apr 2016
In reply to Roberttaylor:

Cheers all.

I've gone with the weight of experience and bought a MSR XGK.

R
 balmybaldwin 24 Apr 2016
In reply to Roberttaylor:

good choice. Love my xkg, its never let me down, and never had trouble finding something it can use as fuel.

I particularly like it as a wok burner and have done some pretty complex cooking on it
 ClayClay 25 Apr 2016
In reply to Roberttaylor:

The Omnifuel is serviceable, so you will be able to get it going like new with the included tools. One bit that does tend to gum up is the regulator needle. Unscrew it entirely (looks like a very long threaded pointy bolt) and you will see a couple of channels cut through the threads. These channels need reaming if gunked with black hard concretionatory material.

Often, it isn't the nipple hole that causes issues, but rather this.

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