UKH

Just looking for a bit of advice, I'm hoping to do some more winter wild camping in the snow in January, but quite a few websites I've been reading talk about how important it is to have crampons/spikes and an axe.

There are some cheap axes in the sales, so I was thinking of picking one up.

I've looked at a few though and the recommended short/more versatile length seem way to short to lean on when you are walking. Even the medium length ones are too short to lean on except up hill and my impression is that it's harder on snow/ice on the downhill.

Am I missing something here? Should I not be using the axe for walking just self arrest?

In reply to NobleWanderer:





65-70 cm. try an axe and a pole if the ground is suitable. Axe should be in your hand if a slip and slide would cause injury.

In reply to NobleWanderer:

Hi. I have a Grivel Mont Blanc at 75cm which I find great for winter walking. However I am going to get an Alpine axe, maybe a DMM Raptor, for those times when the terrain is steeper than expected and you want something a bit more technical.

I find 75cm enough for slight slopes and descending (keeping the axe on the uphill side) and for assisting with crossing streams.

In reply to NobleWanderer:




So personally I prefer a longer axe for easy alpine routes and winter walking. Mine is 63 cm, I'm 6ft tall.

However you are missing something IMO. My axe is long enough for to make stuff like the descent down the ridge from the aiguille du midi easier than a tech axe as well as being long enough to help as a pole on any slope steep enough to need it, generally the extra length is handy for these two cases, the first as it increases safety on dodgey terrain that isn't too steep (with perhaps a little stooping over) and as a pole on not too steep terrain. Once the slope is a bit steeper the extra length makes little difference going up or down.

When going down steep slopes you will either face in to the slope and use dagger technique or go down sideways with the axe in your up hill hand, in both cases the longer axe doesn't help really, if anything slightly the opposite. Once you can walk down the hill close to straight on, an axe would have to be very long to increase safety. Normally you are ready to arrest a slide but otherwise walking normally.

In reply to CurlyStevo:

Thanks, that does help, I was just trying it quickly in the shop and hadn't tested it sideways as you would on the hill. I'll try that next time I look

I'm not going high anyway so hopefully won't come across much ice, but you never know.

In reply to NobleWanderer:
The optimum length partly depends on how tall you are. I'm 5'9" and use a 60 cm axe. When on flat ground the tip of the spike at the base of the shaft is about 12cm off the deck. I find this works for me.

If you are not used to using an axe, pratice braking on a nice gentle slope, which ends on flat ground. When walking you want the pick facing backwards, so that when you bring the axe across your chest to brake, the pick is facing outwards. You won't stab yourself in this case.

In reply to NobleWanderer:

It might be a warm wet winter so far but ice right from the car is common some winters and depending on location, e.g. circa Dalwhinnie, you're already a few hundred metres up.

In reply to NobleWanderer:

The sort of thing you are thinking you might use an axe for I would use a pole instead. In fact, I've used poles on some quite steep ground where I felt an axe might not be much help.

In reply to NobleWanderer:

For winter walking poles are really handy- then for steeper ground this perhaps;

http://www.outdoorgearlab.com/Ice-Axe-Reviews/Petzl-Summit

In reply to NobleWanderer:

I have a Petzl Snowscopic, which as the name suggests telescopes out to 105 cm's, I find it a really useful bit of kit.