First Aid Kit

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 Greasy Prusiks 19 Jun 2015
Who carries one? If so what do you have in it?
In reply to ACollins: Always, and despite the amount of stuff it packs down small and light in my day sack.

Bandages, strappings & gauzes of varying sizes
Burns dressings
Tough Cut shears
Airways
Celox dressings (major external bleeds)
Epipen
Triangular bandages
Sam splint
Tourniquet
Pen light
Gloves
Swabs
Glucogel
Pulse oximeter

And yes, I know how to use all this stuff. If I go somewhere remote (e.g. Sinai, Sudan, Afghanistan) I have a raft of antibiotics and other drugs, stuff for fluid admin, all sorts of sharps, immoblization kits, and trauma kit (e.g. chest seals & naso airways) - the list goes on.

 ianstevens 19 Jun 2015
In reply to ACollins:
Clingfilm and tape. If there is something you can't fix it with that you're either a) a trained paramedic (and can use swanky kit as above) or b) going to call mountain rescue, no matter how much extra kit you have in your bag.
Post edited at 23:19
 The Potato 19 Jun 2015
In reply to ACollins:

i have got a suture kit somewhere in a cupboard but I dont see the point in carrying it, when I do take a first aid kit with me it contains

Compeed blister patches
Steri-strips
bandage
foil blanket
diorralyte sachet
electrical tape
assorted plasters
paracetemol/aspirin/caffeine tablet
led keyring torch
folding scissors
 neuromancer 19 Jun 2015
In reply to Frank the Husky:
Im not doubting your traininh but you regularly have need for airway devices on a normal day on the hills?

You mention npa later - do you mean then you take a trach kit or opas with you mirmally?
Post edited at 00:08
1
 neuromancer 20 Jun 2015
In reply to ACollins:
I find anything that can't be fixed with leukotape p brufen and a cup of man up is beyond the hope of a pocket first aid kit for the average climber walker.

I also have many levels of med kit, mainly for work, and that's a lot of tourniquets chest seals and celox and pulse oximeters and more celox and torniquets.
Post edited at 00:09
1
 Smelly Fox 20 Jun 2015
In reply to ACollins:

Finger tape, superglue and a hip flask with some single malt.
 JoshOvki 20 Jun 2015
In reply to ACollins:

Bandages + gauzes of a few different sizes
Scissors/Schears
Clingfilm
Finger Tape
Gaffer Tape
Triangular Banages
2 Epipens
Cheap thermometer on a wire (not for accurate measurements but for seeing a trend)
Button Compass
Petzl e-light
gloves
sam splint (down the back of my rucksack)
whistle (attached to the outside of the drybag)
waterproof paper + pencil
go jell and a protean bar
foil blanket

everything but the thermometer have been used in anger at one point or another (and replaced afterwards obviously)
In reply to ACollins:

Been a couple of threads on it in the past...

http://www.ukhillwalking.com/forums/info/search.php?forum=0&dates=1&name=&topi...

But probably vark's advice here:

http://www.ukhillwalking.com/forums/t.php?t=502873
Post edited at 00:36

750ml Ethyl Alcohol
Family Pack Latex Prophylactics
10m Gaffer Tape
Sheep Dog
Post edited at 01:52
 The Lemming 20 Jun 2015
In reply to tom_in_edinburgh:
>

> Family Pack Latex Prophylactics

>

Fun for all the family?



My first aid kit comprises of:

Bog roll
Sticking plasters
Zinc tape
Imodiums
Paracetamol
Ibrufen
Anti sick tablets
Hay fever tablets
Triangle bandage
Swiss knife with essential cork screw

Basically my kit list is to get me off the hill without pooing myself from the squits. No point carrying anything else as stuff can be adapted.

Seems like the Willey Waving contest has started early on with this OP.
Post edited at 07:38
 Sharp 20 Jun 2015
In reply to ianstevens:

You don't need to be a trained paramedic to carry a pencil and paper and first aid reminder card. All essential for their weight imo especially the pencil and paper, unless you're good at remembering coordinates and group/injury descriptions, phone numbers etc when you're under pressure and have to go and get help.

Even for the minimalist why not take aspirin, anti septic wipes, tic remover, gloves, scissors, anti histamine and appropriate dressings - real life first aid situations are stressful enough without stripping your sweaty clothes off to cover someone's wound. I can understand why people don't take sutures and trach kits but simple first aid is common sense and a few simple light weight items can make your life a lot easier in what may be one of the most stressful times of your life. Your duct tape is going to be useless if someone gets a bad reaction to a sting or bite on their neck. If you end up being the person trying to tear your buff up with your teeth and duct tape it around your mates eye when he's had a piece of ice slice his eye bal outl you might wish you'd lugged that 30g sterile dressing up the hill. Improvisation sounds cool but really I don't see any excuse not to carry a small and thoughtfully stocked first aid kit, of course it depends what you're doing and where you are but it should be something you think about and treat with respect because when you need it you really bloody need it. I think while some people who have had a life time of training and experience may well be able to make do with a roll of duct tape And their wits for most of us even after you've done your 3 day faw (and forgotten it all) in the moment you'll probably need all the help you can get and it always surprises me how many people respond to these kind of threads with "duct tape", which makes me think rather than there being a whole host of first aid climbing wizards the majority of people put zero thought into what they'd do in an emergency and what equipment they'd like to have on hand for their level of experience in the environments that they play in.
In reply to neuromancer: I'm not doubting my training either, nor is the rest of NWAS. The question about OPAs seems a little redundant. I don't "regularly" have need for such things on the hills, in the same way I've never needed medical insurance when I've been abroad, but for the sake of carrying something that weighs less than 30g and is smaller than a bar of chocolate I can't see any reason why I wouldn't. The one time I need it (but hopefully never) I'll be glad I bothered!

I haven't got a trach kit, I mean just bog standard NPAs.

 The Potato 20 Jun 2015
In reply to ACollins:
I agree that is useful to have things like a pad or bandage, but id say that something like duct tape has its place there too.
It can be used to create a strong splint with e.g walking pole, can be used around a pad to apply pressure to a wound, could make a stretcher, repair kit and gear etc.

Edit - but yes tape alone is pointless, an emergency first aid card is much more useful
Post edited at 09:58
In reply to Sharp: I agree with you. It's no effort to have a few bandages, dressings and a first aid card, maybe watch a few vids on YouTube. I guess most people in the UK imagine it won't happen to them (and it 99.999% of the time it doesn't) and that the MR/Air Ambulance will be there ASAP anyways. I did CPR on a walker that we came across last year in on our way to climb in the Rhinogs and although that might not have made any difference to the outcome, I knew that I'd given him the best chance, and hopefully his partner got some small comfort frm that. I just like to be certain that if I see my mate's wife after he's died at the crag then I can say with confidence that I did absolutely everything I could. Plan for the worst, hope for the best and all that.

 Jack B 20 Jun 2015
In reply to ACollins:
I know the OP asked about first aid kit specifically, but I'm going to mention a few other things. And I'm more in mind Scottish mutipitch climbing, and all-season hillwalking than roadside cragging here.

If you have a proper accident, probably the trauma is either in the "not going to kill you" or the "dead whatever you do" camp. Various things might help in the borderline cases, but I wouldn't put a high priority on them. If you have been immobilised, I would say priorities are:
- Shelter. A group shelter is a lifesaver, things like blizzard bags are also worth considering, especially if alone. I would normally take these over a first aid kit (though usually I take both)
- Warmth. Make sure that, combined with the above, you have enough clothes not to start suffering from hypothermia. Most people probably carry these without thinking of them as emergency kit.
- Food. Again, to stave off hypothermia. Some people like to have emergency rations, I just make sure that my lunch is bigger than it needs to be.
- Phone. Signal is slowly creeping into the remote places, and getting MRT out with the maximum possible daylight left is well worth it. I hate the distraction so it's always off, preserves battery that way too. Consider registering for the 999 text service, it's designed to help the deaf, but hillwalkers and climbers are also registering. Be aware that it's not really set up with MRT in mind and they may not know how the system works, so start your emergency text with "police->mountain rescue" or similar, so they know who to forward it to.
- A PLB is probably worth considering. I don't have one though.
- Pen and paper (or use the back of the map). If you want to send someone to find a phone signal, writing down some details is useful, grid references are particularly hard to memorise. Recording the times, and any changes in the casualty's condition may help the MRT.
- Only after all that would I say a first aid kit is really useful for an immobilising injury. Bandages and gauze might be useful, though they're going to come after direct pressure in controlling bleeding. Splints aren't worth much in this case, you don't need them until MRT arrives.

If you're not immobilised, then splinting an arm or something could make walking out or moving to a safer place to await rescue practical. Gaffer tape is good but doesn't stick to wet jackets as well as people expect it to. Vet tape is also supposed to be quite good. SAM splints are great, but I'm not sure they are worth the bulk and weight.

The only absolutely critical thing to put in a first aid kit is medication for people who need it. Epi-pens for people with severe allergies, inhalers for asthmatics, clotting agents for haemophilia etc.

Beyond that, I do carry some things aimed at making it possible to continue after a minor injury, or making things generally more comfortable.

So what do I actually carry in my first aid kit?
- 1 wound dressing
- 1 crepe bandage
- a few gauzes and melolins
- gaffer tape
- needle and thread (for kit not people, especially on multiday trips)
- 1 compeed
- plasters (cuts and rain make for blood everywhere otherwise)
- painkillers
- A pair of disposable nitrile gloves, because they don't weigh anything
- A resuscitation face shield, the type that folds down to the size of a £2 coin, and weighs about 5g
- A pencil
- A tick remover

Several organisations do reminder cards, covering incident management and first aid. These are probably great for people who've never had to deal with an incident before. It's easy to overlook just how stressful it can be.
Post edited at 15:03
 GridNorth 20 Jun 2015
In reply to ACollins:

Nurofen
Sticking Plasters
Pills to make me crap
Pills to stop me crapping
Latex Gloves
Mobile Phone

If I went out as a group leader I may take more but long ago I came to the conclusion that the best thing a first aider can do is remain calm and reassure the patient. That is of course after taking care of breathing, bleeding, bones but I am of the firm opinion that more harm could be done than good. And yes I have had several First Aid courses.
 Billhook 20 Jun 2015
In reply to ACollins:

Tick removers seem to be common on here. Surely you don't do navel - and other checks for them, when you're on the hill do you?
 Jack B 20 Jun 2015
In reply to Dave Perry:

I had one on my list. Mostly, it's there for use in the tent at the end of the day, but it's such a tiny light thing I don't bother taking it out for single day trips. TBH I haven't had a tick in years, I think the combination of ronhills and walking socks is fairly effective.
 neuromancer 20 Jun 2015
In reply to Frank the Husky:
It's not redundant, but perhaps you have read into the 'need' too much. Everything has a cost (weight, space) and an intention. We cannot take everything with us, therefore we must make value judgements. The best way to do so is a cost;benefit analysis. My point is I'm not convinced that an npa passes that test (and I've used one in anger, albeit at work not on a mountain).

Maybe a better question would be - let's say you replace some of you 'cool serious trauma' kit with more gas, or warm kit, or a group shelter, or food: are you sure on average you aren't better off than lugging a cat-t around everywhere?

This is unless you are guiding and other people can take other things / you aren't bothered by weight since you aren't tackling anything you find difficult.


Post edited at 18:09
1
 GridNorth 20 Jun 2015
In reply to Jack B:

Ron Hills seem to have the same affect on women.

Al
 gribble 20 Jun 2015
In reply to ACollins:

Finger & wrist tape
Smidge
sun cream

Perhaps a little more when I'm travelling!
In reply to neuromancer: As a general rule when I'm in remote areas with npa's etc in my med kit (and I've only listed a fraction of what I take, I've not listed the drugs etc) the kit is carried either between many people or on yaks/camels/donkeys. Sometimes it's left at base camp and can be retrieved in a relatively short timescale. Like you say, horses for courses and it's always worth doing as you suggest and weighing up the benefits vs cost. I'f I'm in the middle of Afghanistan or the Chadian desert with little hope of extraction I'm going to overcompensate, but if I'm on the Kinder Scout I'm going to rely on the RAF/MR. I'm not an alpinist or mountaineer BTW, so weight isn't really an issue.

 DancingOnRock 21 Jun 2015
In reply to ACollins:

I've changed my mind recently after dealing with a young girl pedestrian who was hit by a moped.

It's quite a long time since I've had to administer first aid to a stranger and a lot of my training and experiences from last century came flooding back quite quickly.

She had a bad open head wound and the only thing (and best option in my mind) was to get her to stick her hand over it and apply pressure. Which was pretty effective. About 6 bystanders were just standing there watching her bleed when I got there.

The thought of trying to get someone walking off a hill in that state doesn't really appeal to me.

So:
Training.
Some decent bandages, gauze, tape and sticking plasters.

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