UKH

I've enjoyed borrowing other people's kit this season in order to try some of the winter stuff for the first time. I've got the bug so want to get some of my own.

From trying and reading others advice, I reckon I'll be getting hold of some DMM cirque axes.

Only trouble is sizes. 55cm length has seemed about right for me this year. The adze version comes in 50cm, 55cm etc. but the hammer version only in 50cm apparently.

It makes sense to get adze/hammer pair, but would it make sense to have a 50cm hammer and a 55cm adze?

In reply to Parrys_apprentice:

Nope. I prefer both to be the same, weigh the same, swing the same. No doubt you'd get used to it.

Here's a thought: the Cirque is a straight handled axe best suited to snow gullies. Why not just get the adze and carry an ordinary claw hammer for the odd occasion you need to place a peg or warthog?

You could save the quids you saved on the Cirque hammer towards the pair of Apexes / Nomics you were looking at for later progression...?

In reply to Parrys_apprentice:

I don't know if Cirque is a good choice. I have almost identical ice axe (Grivel Air Tech Evo adze) and after one winter I realized that this wasn't the best thing to have. Already climbed some Grade 2s this winter and the main limiting factor were Scarpa SL B1 boots (well, people say you shouldn't climb any graded stuff with B1/C1 set).

Looking forward to get something more technical boots/crampons and ice axes wise. I wish I rented boots instead of needing another pair next winter. SLs worked good enough for summer as well, but bought trail shoes for that reason as well...

In reply to Parrys_apprentice:

Um, don't want to appear to be a sad old fart, but back in the late seventies I did The Curtain (graded IV at the time) with a 65cm walking axe in one hand and a terror in the other. The terror would have been about 10 inches long? My memory isn't what it was.......Anyway the point being that you can adapt even with a serious discrepancy in axe/hammer sizes!

In reply to Parrys_apprentice:

Go-go-gadget extenda-axes?? You can have that one for free DMM

In reply to pamph:

I found that having a technical axe and a longer semi technical alpine axe was good to get a longer reach

In reply to Parrys_apprentice:

No sense whatsoever. And no sense in getting cirques - you'll whizz up the grades and want to upgrade your axes soon. Get a pair of proper technical axes like Quarks or equivalent.

In reply to Parrys_apprentice:

As others have said it's perfectly possible to climb with two different sized axes* but it's not ideal. People take two mountaineering/walking axes when they're concerned about weight (i.e. high altitude stuff), I don't see any other reason why someone would buy a mountaineering axe hammer. You can't change the picks and they don't suit climbing well. You'd be better with a technical tool, keep your eye on ebay for some late season bargains and you'll probably pick up a pair of technical tools quite cheap.


* and B1/C1 boots PPP, I remember doing tower ridge with a 50cm cirque, 60cm grivel munro, some bendy walking boots and C1 crampons - stiff boots climb easier but bendy boots are what all the classic routes were put up in and there's nothing to stop you from doing the same on easy ground.

In reply to Parrys_apprentice:

Can I suggest you go 1 up from the Cirque and get the DMM Raptors. They are a bit more technical and you can replace the picks or swap the picks for fly picks if you want something a bit more technical than that in the future. They are very all round axes and the fact that the picks are replaceable means they a better investment. You can get them at Needle Sport at a discounted price at the moment.

http://www.needlesports.com/Catalogue/Winter-Climbing-Equipment/Ice-Axes/Al...

RN

It's okey really. Our body and brain adapts really fast.

DMM cirque is not the greatest tool for climbing. If you are reasonably fit and willing to spent time out you are likely to overgrow it in a season.

In reply to mick taylor:

No sense in getting a pair of Cirques, but I've found a single Cirque or similar paired with a more technical axe useful for Alpine style routes in Scotland such as the Aonach Eagach and Tower Ridge.

In reply to Parrys_apprentice:

What are the specific reasons why you would not choose a matching pair at 50 cm?

In reply to Pay Attention:

The main reason for cirques and size 55 was that far from blasting up through the grades with regular trips, it'll probably be 3 days a year with as much snow plodding as technical axe work. 55-60 seemed good for using in that fashion this year.
I was under the impression that cirques were a decent low grade all rounder but they've not got a great write up on here.

In reply to Parrys_apprentice:

So none the wiser there really.

I guess the right OP should have just said, please recommend some good value axes for steep plodding, scrambling and occasionally up to grade 3.

In reply to pamph:

Ditto (only in the 80's) using a Chacal hammer and a long Chouinard Zero axe

In reply to Parrys_apprentice:

Don't obsess over it - people have been using non-matched axes for years. The closest I had until recently were the Simond Chacal & Barracuda which were different lengths, didn't hold me back. When you get in to mixed, different lengths give you more options.

Choe Brooks was known for using a 65cm axe along with a Terrordactyl hammer at 30cm or so.

In reply to Parrys_apprentice:

Despite all the old wads waxing lyrical with what they got by with, I'd say no. Plenty of hard stuff was climbed with leashes but moving to leashless was a revelation to me, the climbing is much more fun (flows better, less faff) so just because you "can" climb stuff with mismatched axes doesn't mean you have too.

I'd get a cirque or equivalent for walking/Grade I then get a pair of quarks/vipers/apexs etc as and when. I've got a pair of old quarks for climbing (I only climb up to V) and a BD Raven Ultra for ski touring/walking. Covers prettying everything!