New waterproof

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 echo34 29 Jan 2015
I've been looking for a new waterproof jacket, ideally as light as possible, good helmet hood, and as breathable as possible. I have been looking at Neoshell, which feels nice, but I have found that all the jackets that use it have massive necks around the hood and they don't adjust enough to be able to get a good seal.

My current jacket is a Haglofs Endo 2 pull on which I like, the hood fits very closely around the neck, so there's a good seal and not loads of spare fabric flopping around.

I really like the look of the Jottnar Hymir, but I tried one earlier this week and again it was too loose around the neck, even when fully cinched in.

Are there any other options that are similar but with a less baggy neck area?

I am considering the Haglofs Roc Lite, but I don't like Proshell that much.
 TobyA 29 Jan 2015
In reply to echo34:

> I really like the look of the Jottnar Hymir, but I tried one earlier this week and again it was too loose around the neck, even when fully cinched in.

I was about to suggest the Hymir until I read that - there aren't many similar style jackets out there are there. I'm reviewing one currently for UKC - not quite sure what you mean about the neck though. Maybe I have a huge head or something as I've not noticed it!? https://twitter.com/TobyinHelsinki/status/556182152426307584 Anyway, good luck finding something similar. Lots of lightish Gore jackets out there but not so many in NeoShell it would seem.

BTW, I don't know if you have used NeoShell - its pretty good but I can still get it wet on the inside with sweat. It's not massively better than modern Goretex I'd say plus it lets some wind through, which helps with breathability but can mean the jackets aren't quite as warm as old Proshell (new Proshell I believe is also a bit un-windproof).
 JayPee630 30 Jan 2015
In reply to echo34:

Westcomb, but hard to find in the UK.
needvert 30 Jan 2015
In reply to echo34:

Light and breathable as possible you say, this will be up there with the best:

http://www.zpacks.com/accessories/wpb_jacket.shtml - 165g, eVent

Not a huge hood - that doesn't appeal to the greater light as possible crowd but they might be happy to do a custom job.

 Alan.T 03 Feb 2015
In reply to echo34:

I'm in a similar position. I'm in the market for a new hard shell but due to being tight I rarely buy new gear so my knowledge of the newer fabrics is limited. After doing some research I like the look of the Neoshell fabric based on its breathability with only a minor loss in windproofness (claimed).

Comparison demo here: youtube.com/watch?v=6TmzwZgEVmA&

I tried on a Montane fast alpine stretch neo jacket and initially found the same problem with the neck being large. On a second visit/try I managed to adjust it enough to provide a seal however when it wasn't fully zipped there seemed to be excess fabric in the neck area which just flapped around with no facility to scrunch it up out of the way. Also, the plastic buckle used to hold the snow skirt closed required quite a force to undo which made me feel like it would snap after a few goes however this might ease with use. Despite this I'm still considering buying this jacket as the cut is very good and it feels like a quality bit of kit.

Gooutdoors review: youtube.com/watch?v=UKqgBJEriLE&

Don't suppose I've helped much but the Montane might be worth a look and I'd be interested to know what you end up getting.
 BnB 04 Feb 2015
In reply to echo34:

Why do you want to cinch a scratchy hardshell around your neck? That's what your base or midlayer is for. The open neck of the hardshell is to allow airflow, ie so that heat and perspiration can escape the plastic bag. The only time you should want to seal yourself into the hardshell is when the weather is full on and you'll need to pull the neck over your chin and cinch the hood down to form a letterbox opening. For general wear in reasonable conditions get a base or midlayer with a high zipped neck that can be adjusted to suit your temperature, or simply buy a buff for £10 and wear it on occasions your neck needs warming. The Hymir you looked at is a lovely bit of kit and relatively inexpensive (by Jottnar standards). A perfect all round lightweight mountain shell, good for everything except Scottish winter thrutching.
 TobyA 04 Feb 2015
In reply to BnB:

> A perfect all round lightweight mountain shell, good for everything except Scottish winter thrutching.

I've been Lake District winter thrutching in mine for the last 3 weekends, so far to no ill effects! Perhaps Scottish thrutching is worse.

 Alan.T 04 Feb 2015
In reply to BnB:

> Why do you want to cinch a scratchy hardshell around your neck?

You're right, there is no need to cinch a hardshell however when it isn't zipped right up it would be good to have a method of stopping the unzipped neck from flapping around in your face.

 BnB 04 Feb 2015
In reply to TobyA:

> I've been Lake District winter thrutching in mine for the last 3 weekends, so far to no ill effects! Perhaps Scottish thrutching is worse.

I'm rapidly developing the impression that Lakes routes are harder (if shorter). The IV 5 I led on the Ben last week wasn't as hard as either III 4s I did in the Lakes at the weekend. Glad to hear yours is holding up. I seem to put holes in everything. I'm saving my Hymir for dry days only Good though isn't it? Do you prefer it to the Bergilmir?
 TobyA 04 Feb 2015
In reply to BnB:

So you got yourself one? Nice. A rather different kettle of fish from the Bergelmir I'd say. Really, for winter climbing when you know you're shoulders/back are likely to be in contact with rock, I guess the Bergelmir is the obvious choice as it just feels much more beefy, but I can see myself using the Hymir more just because come summer I'll still be sticking it in my rucksack 'just in case'.

If you want a coat for regular winter climbing that's more than wondering up snow gullies, the Bergelmir would be the choice of the two I suppose.
 BnB 04 Feb 2015
In reply to TobyA:

That was my feeling too, though I'm glad to hear yours is holding up. I bought mine to replace my flimsy lightweight shell for multipitch. The old one (Marmot SuperMica) is tough but TOO lightweight: the arms don't leave room for layering, nor the hood for a helmet!!

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