UKH

I want to buy new boots and I'm not sure which size to take. Mainly because of poor blood circulation.
Which combination of socks (2/3 pair) do you prefer in high alpine winter / expedition boots (if you're not dependent on your current owned boots, so perfect situation)? And maybe you have a sock or liner favourite brand/type, please let me know. Especially the liners cause I don't see them that much in shops and I havent used them before. Thanks

In reply to wout:



Why do you need more than one pair of good fitting warm socks that work well with the boot to give good circulation? Multiple sock just layers aren't necessary in modern boots as long as you get the fit right.

In reply to wout:

I agree. I have only ever worn one pair of socks with my LS Oly Mons or Baruntse.

In reply to radson:

Boots are for warmth, socks are for comfort.

I have tried liner socks under bridgedale summits, and my feet we cooler than with just the single thick pair on.

In reply to nickinscottishmountains:

In some situations, there might be a benefit to thin liners and one pair of decent socks - change & wash liners more frequently than the thick woolly hard to dry socks? Although probably more relevant to hot climates than cold high altitude stuff....

More than that has me baffled!

In reply to wout:

I just like one pair of socks and use Teko Expedition socks. There is a theory that if you wear two pair and you feet get hot whilst walking into a climb then they become damp with sweat. You dont notice this while your feet are warm until you find yourself standing in snow perhaps on a belay, your feet cool down and then they feel wet and cold. I think the insulation comes from boots nowadays rather than the sock.

RN

In reply to nickinscottishmountains:
Because I've got a bad blood circulation I want to compensate this with socks (if possible).
You're saying adding another layer isn't necessary. But if it's not necessary, does it mean it's not necessary for you personally or is it equal to just one layer so the fit is mandatory?

Besides this are you using ( or tried in the past) Vapour barrier liner socks and what are your experiences?

In reply to wout:

I wear a liner sock for much the same reason I wear a wicking under layer on my body. I would think that keeping feet warm would be better served by making sure that the blood supply is nice and warm, so extra layers on the legs especially around thin, boney bits.

Steve

In reply to wout:

There's potentially a downside to wearing too many thick socks, though - it increases the bulk of your feet in all directions, and even if you go up a size in boots to compensate, then they don't tend to increase in all directions, so you end up with poorly fitting boots. Which you then often have to lace more tightly to stop them moving, risking worse circulation problems...

Probably only something you'll know for sure by trying out combinations in the shop, though.

Thanks all

Are there more people here who have a preference based on different experiences instead of theory?

In reply to wout:

I use Icebreaker or Smartwool mountaineering socks. Big difference between new ones and well used, not just comfort but also warmth. So always keep a new pair for summit day. Careful with sizing. You need space to wiggle your toes when its seriously cold so too many socks will do mare harm than good.

Have used both the above socks with Scarpa Vega HA and Millet Everest as well as Scarpa SL for trek ins.

I found merino wool warmer and more comfortable but that may well be personal preference.

In reply to wout:


What sort of boots are you talking here? Stuff like La Sportiva Nepals or true alpine winter/expedition boots such as Scarpa Phantom 6000 and 8000 etc?

In reply to nickinscottishmountains:
Just Scarpa Phantom 6000 and LS Spantik at the moment. And for the future at higher altitudes + less technical outside the alps the LS Oly mons.

In reply to m0unt41n:

thanks usefull

In reply to wout:
I would consider the various heating options if you struggle for warmth. developed mostly for soft skiing types so you'll need to be careful regarding batteries and what not.

outside in Hathersage have the best range of cosy boots in the UK worth an afternoon I'd think

In reply to wout:
It all depends on the shape/fit of your foot in the chosen boot.

So foot, sock combo, boot - all need to be looked at together as one system.

You can't change the shape of your foot, only your socks or boots.

Your foot takes up volume in the boot. Your socks also take up volume in the boot.

multiple layers of socks may make your feet colder as they take up more space and may stop you being able to wiggle your toes to keep them warm.

I returned a pair of lorpen expedition socks becuase with my foot/boot combo I was convinced they took up too much room in the toe box and I would be getting cold feet.

On Denali I used Phantom 6000 boots and when I bought these a few years prior, I made sure there was enough room in the toe box to be able to wiggle my toes. The problem with this was that it introduced a tiny amount of heel lift - I chose to live with this as a trade off for having better toe wiggle'ability.

I then went through a process of testing heel wedges, volume reducers in strategic places, lacing tightness etc to get rid of the heel lift and get the best possible fit.

The last thing I tried was merino liner socks under a pair of heavy tight knit wool socks. Worked brilliant and I could ditch the heel wedges and never had any blisters foot problems.

So it all depends on the boot, foot, sock combination.

In reply to wout:

Patagonia expedition socks are great as the knit is tight and they dont bag out like the smartwool expedition socks which are terrible if worn for more than a day as you end with bags on your feet and creases everywhere which end up rubbing.

In reply to wout:

Hi,
Best to go to a store with experienced boot fitters help you with your choice. If that's not possible, then it's not unusual to go 1 to 2 sizes bigger than your foot size...which means ordering four pairs of boots, at least (2 Spanteks, 2 Phantoms)! Also consider getting superfeet, can be returned if you don't get on with them.

The warmest socks I've used are the Lorpen expedition socks. Personally I wouldn't wear more than one thin synthetic liner with whatever thick sock you opt for. To many sock layers will compress blood vessels in feet or if you buy boots sized to fit many sock layers, you end up with badly fitting boots once the socks compress etc.

Somebody mentioned heated foot beds. Not a bad idea, friend of mine who has climbed a couple of 8000'ers has used them as a just in case option. I think Kenton Cool might of done the same.

Try and be disciplined about eating and drinking enough as well as keeping your core warm when.

Where are you going?

In reply to wout:
For now just high alpine winter climbing in switzerland and chamonix. If that's going right I'll plan a 7000er in 1 or 2 years.

I tried the Spantiks, but they're huge and the fit is by far not as good as the Phantom 6000 for me.
In La Sportiva I wear 45 but a 46 in Phantoms was even too small so I'm waiting for a 47!

It's a good idea to add extra electrical warmth, I'll figure that out!

I've got the smartwool socks now, so that was a good advise!

In reply to wout:

My feet are 45 and I wear a 47 in the Phantom 6000.

In reply to steveej:

thanks good to know

In reply to wout:

For summit days when its very cold these are brilliant. Very expensive but they work extremely well

http://www.rbhdesigns.com/category/170&CFID=5895791&CFTOKEN=e0ec119...