UKH

The new Salewa ones look pretty sweet:

http://www.salewa.com/product/ice+screw/quick+screw-8

I have seen others with an integrated quickdraw but this seems to be the first with a plastic protector thingy.

Thoughts?

In reply to Morgan Woods:

Reckon its rubbish. The screw cap looks like it will be a fiddle (especially doing Scottish routes with big racks and gloves). The hanger will be a faff. Too much faff in my view - slick and simple is the way to go when it comes to ice screws.

In reply to Morgan Woods:

My preference for this type of thing is the Grivel Speedy (Helix with an attached QD) screws, mostly because they place really easily one handed. They are a bit bulky however. I mostly have a combination of these and 360's for varying circumstances - 360's place quicker when you're less precarious, and can handle irregular surface relief better and are practical for abalakov's, which Speedy's/Helix's aren't really.

In reply to Morgan Woods: My current rack is BD Express screws mostly 13cm and 16cm, however I have recently bought one of the new lightweight Petzl ones with the alloy tube but steel teeth.

If it works well, then the weight saving is substantial and I could see myself being converted, at least to the extent of buying another 2-3 for routes other than pure ice routes where you can end up carrying a fairly weighty rack to cope with all contingencies.

Anyway, for UK climbers I just don't see screws with captive draws being the best option. For climbers in Norway, Canada, US and continental Europe operating purely on cascades they may make sense but I won't currently be going for that option. However, always happy to listen to any other opinions.

In reply to Morgan Woods:

Looks like a very neat design, but having just googled them and seen the £75-£85 prices it doubles the price.
I believe I read some feedback with speedys of the collar freezing and therefore unable to rotate freely, I don't know how frequent an issue that would be but you can imagine situations with water spray or dampness where this could be an issue.
If I had the money to start replacing then I too would suggest the light weight screws would be wiser.

In reply to Morgan Woods:

We've got a big ice screw review coming up this winter and it will include all of the screws mentioned so far in this thread, I don't know what the outcome will be as we haven't tested all the screws yet, but keep your eye out for the review.

Jack

In reply to Morgan Woods:

I don't know about the one you suggest but I also use the Grivel Speedy's and they're brilliant. For my experience the Grivel Helix (which is what a speedy is) is the easiest screw to place, and the speedy adds the inbuilt quickdraw which is great, works really well, and you can clip it early (as in before the screws is all the way in) for peace of mind.

My Ice rack is 6 Grivel Speedy's and 4 Grivel Helix's which I pair with screamers.

In reply to Jack Geldard - UKC Chief Editor:

I bet that's a bloody good excuse for a tip to Norway on "business" (holiday)

I look forward to the read, not that I intend to replace my screws any time soon.

In reply to Morgan Woods:

The best ice screw is always the one one that goes in the fastest (minimise pump-panic) and it's the lightest 9 (so you can carry more of them or go light). I've seen these Salewa racked up, and 4 or them take up all your gear loop, leaving not much for anything else. I haven't placed any, but they look a faff to deal with.

In my opinion the best ice-screw is the E-Climb and the new lightweight Petzl ones. The advantage of E-climb is that 4 new replaceable tips cost under 30euros, so effectively getting 4 news screws for that prize. That's hard to beat really.

I always carry one Grivel 360 as they are unique for difficult placements, but they are bloody heavy and the teeth design is not great, they don't bite the ice as well as others. The best teeth design is the new BD express, super aggressive, but if run it to rock in thin ice is game over.

In reply to Morgan Woods:

All these fancy screws with QDs attached etc...IMO you lose some of the versatility of carrying draws separate, and if you carry these contraptions and separate draws then that amounts to a lot of gear. Helix take some beating, easy to start, fit perfectly in the hand so you can get some oomph behind them. I use lasers and express too but prefer the helix by far.

In reply to Morgan Woods:

Black diamond express ice screw 'Simple'

In reply to Jack Geldard - UKC Chief Editor:

I hope those e-Climb screws are included in the review, Jack. If not, get 'em in pronto. By 'eck they look good. So light (25% lighter than a comparable BD express) and with replaceable tips at under a tenner each.

In reply to Morgan Woods:

It's good to see something new tbh, the old way isn't always the best way and lets face it ice screws haven't really come on that much. Will look forward to seeing the review.

And I'm still waiting for my screws with teflon inside to stop with having to bash the ice out of them each time they're used.

In reply to Jack Geldard - UKC Chief Editor:

Petzl Laser Speed Light. Fantastic ice-screw: light (91g for the 13cm); really easy to carry/rack; really easy to deploy; really easy to use. Used them this year on Janahut in India. Brilliant.

In reply to Morgan Woods:

I always go for Grivel 360's - no question.

In reply to Simon Yearsley:

Another vote for the Petzl Laser Speed Lights, amazing weight difference, will be interesting to see how they hold up in terms of durability. If you are worried about durability go straight for the Laser Speed screws which are also excellent and relatively light compared to other all steel screws in their class.

In reply to Simon Yearsley:


Which bear a striking resemblance to the e-climb screws...

In reply to StuLade:

Two words, electrochemical pair

In reply to 3leggeddog:
That counts as two and a half words at least!

Also, what does that mean?

In reply to Bob_the_Builder:

Two dissimilar metals joined in the presence of an electrolyte, leads to accelerated corrosion. Time will tell but the future does not look good for these new fangled lightweight screws

In reply to 3leggeddog:

Oh, you mean like all these millions of wiregate karabiners that keep corroding and killing people? And don't forget all these badly designed iceaxes where people have used lightweight alloy for the shafts with steel picks...

There is no reason at all why products containing both Stainless Steel and Aluminium won't work perfectly well in practice. 99.9% of Winter climbers already use ones with the same mix of metals.

In reply to 3leggeddog:
I thought maybe that's what you meant but I didn't know what its called. Surely a company like petzl would take that into account?

In reply to Morgan Woods:

I think bd express go in the easiest and are regarded by many to be the gold standard. I owned a grovel 360 but sold it as I prefer the way the bd screws rack and find them easier to start too!

In reply to Morgan Woods:

But everyone wants a "quick screw" this christmas....i'll get my bi-metallic coat....

In reply to nufkin:

Yes they are basically the same design. There are pros and cons about both. I prefer E-climb because I'm sponsored by them... Ha, no honesty, the Petzl are amazing, just a lot more expensive then e-climbs. And e-climb are as good. There are different details, the Petzl lever has the ribbed plastic end which is grippier, but the e-climbs have soft rubber so you can put it in your mount without freezing into skin. Trust me, a revelation! Also, the lever is much longer so it goes in much quicker than Petzl. Petzl has better teeth design though. Also, I'm not sure how easy is to get hold of the tips for Petzl, I couldn't find them online.

Anyways both stand on a league of their own. For budget I'd go for E-climb. I've got dosh to burn the Petzl.

In reply to Ramon Marin:

The e-climb screws do look good (and are well rated by Pyrenean climbers, I've heard). I think I might get a couple to try - it's a same they're not more prevalent in the UK