UKH

Well the first snows have dropped early:

http://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/north-wales-news/look-first-snow-winter-201...

While the snow might not be climbable yet it sure does look good.
The best Welsh winters we had a few years back started with a prelude in November so heres hoping its going to be a good one.

In reply to Joss:

It's not looking good I'm afraid; it's over 3000 degrees celsius in Cwm Idwal at the moment: https://www.thebmc.co.uk/idwal

In reply to lukef:

That's gonna have an impact on my plans for this winter!

In reply to Joss:

The forecast for -7c next week!

In reply to Sean Kelly:


I'd love to know where you got that forecast from???

In reply to smuffy:

The Express?

In reply to lukef:

Well it was originally volcanic, perhaps the volcano isn't quite as dormant as we thought.

In reply to smuffy:

http://www.mountain-forecast.com/peaks/Glyder-Fawr/forecasts/999

looks like the forecast for a week on Saturday - see the nine day forecast. It'd be nice, but I wouldn't put money on it. I'll keep an eye on the kinder forecast though.

In reply to cragtyke:

Can we at least wait until January before this speculative rubbish?

It's been really warm of late, the groundwater will still be pretty balmy for this time of year. Until it freezes, any notion of snow on it will just be slushy crap.

In reply to cragtyke:



That's with windchill, not actual temperature

In reply to ianstevens:

I'm monitoring this thread carefully as a week after Idwal comes into condition then Kinder Downfall is "in"

In reply to ianstevens:
Can we at least wait until January before this speculative rubbish?

No! It's a UKC tradition.

It's been really warm of late, the groundwater will still be pretty balmy for this time of year. Until it freezes, any notion of snow on it will just be slushy crap.

OK for drytooling then?

In reply to cragtyke:

surely you mean wettooling with all this rain about

In reply to Joss:
Is it time to get this thread going?...

Looking at forecast for weekend with white stuff falling this week and winds moderating by the weekend...

I'd say ridge routes like Crib Goch could be good

In reply to Nigel Modern:

Looking at getting out mid-week; if anyone local can provide conditions report on this freeze/thaw storm cycle ; appreciated.

In reply to Neil Anderson:

85+ mph gusts forecast for the middle of the week according to MWIS.

In reply to Joss:

crib goch had a very light dusting of wet snow on Saturday, pretty much bare. However, there was an inch or so on the ground from crib y dysgl upwards.

In reply to Joss:

Only patches left on Carneddau on Sunday. Ground partially frozen above 950m. Wind was gusting to 80mph.

Had some snow overnight into Monday morning in NE Wales. Moel Famau was white this morning.

In reply to oglyndwr:

Hi Joss,

Would you be - or do you know any one who would be - interested in getting some easy winter climbing done during the Christmas period (25-28th) with a winter climbing novice - me ?

Gabor

In reply to Joss:

Any info on ridge routes/snow level?

Thinking of a Crib Goch 'appetiser' tomorrow.

In reply to Nigel Modern:

No info I'm afraid, but I was thinking of something very similar (as I'm sure are 50,000 others).

In reply to ianstevens:
Ogwen Mountain Rescue cameras are down/switched off but First Hydro ones show a good deal of snow by my estimation down to 6-700m

Ridges look good and I'm watching the weather.

We are hoping to find somewhere to practice moving together, so if you're up there wondering why those idiots are using ropes...ideally I'd like some juicy gully for this like sargeants but I'd say there's no chance of this as yet...patience....(not my forte)

In reply to Nigel Modern:

Drove through the Pass this morning. Snow cover looked really thin to be honest and I doubt any gullies would be much fun. Around 2C going over the Pass. Walking or scrambling the ridges would be best bet IMO.

In reply to wynaptomos:
Ta mate...remain undecided then. Webcams seemed to indicate more of a dumping than that and eg Crib Goch would be plastered.

Temperatures high up look OK ie -1.5C in Cwm Idwal at 850m

In reply to Joss:

Hi all,

just spent the last three days out and about and the conditions I found were

ground has some freezing above 750m, turf is not frozen and the 'snow' only came in this morning about 6am onwards (I was camping out)

the tops are white mainly due to hail / very shallow snow, the wind has been very strong we measured a gust at 91mph

In reply to sam benson:

Thanks Sam, much appreciated

In reply to Joss:

Saw a few pictures on Facebook of a guided party ascending a very white Hidden Gully yesterday. The snow did look surprisingly deep, however given the current ground and air temps Im sure that it was the usual superficial powder thats blown into the gully and purely for decoration at the moment! Given a thaw/freeze it could be in good nick soon.

Worth keeping an eye on the conditions here:

Ground and air temps:
https://www.thebmc.co.uk/idwal

MWIS
http://www.mwis.org.uk/english-welsh-forecast/SD

Webcams

http://www.ogwen-rescue.org.uk/oggi_cam/

In reply to Joss:

We did North Ridge and Bristly Ridge then back down Y Gribin. Snow line was raising through the day though and turf not really frozen anywhere but the ridge lines were good fun and feeling very wintry with a reasonable covering of snow and even patches of ice. Brilliant day out and a great start to the season.

In reply to Joss:

any snow left on the tops for a saturday scramble?

In reply to alex pickard:

it don't look good on the webcams....

In reply to JamButty:

All gone bar the odd patch

In reply to Joss:

What's the latest? Anyone aware of forecast for the next couple of weeks?

In reply to Joss:

warm, wet and windy by the look of things...
https://www.metcheck.com/UK/14days.asp?zipcode=Snowdonia&locationID=625...

Snowing heavily in parts of North Wales at the moment....

In reply to whitewaterpops:

Ground still not frozen.

Patience!

In reply to Joss:

Snow on the roads Pen y Pass, Ogwen, Cape Curig and Hiraethog moors. Warm and wet though.

Nothing below 200-300m generally.

In reply to richprideaux:

Thanks Rich..

Are the roads accessible? What kind of depth snow is it?

Regards

In reply to rob malik:

A bit of slush as you get into Capel Curig at the moment...nothing in Betws.

In reply to rob malik:

Back home in Ruthin now, but as Nick says road access is good from what I can tell. Seems that the worst road conditions were during peak of snowfall.

Freezing level is around 850m according to shiny new BMC site:

https://www.thebmc.co.uk/idwal

In reply to richprideaux:




Check the date... it appears to have been broken for a couple of days.

In reply to richprideaux:




Have you checked the date on that report?

In reply to timjones:

Didn't notice - good spot. However still pretty warm out there...

In reply to Trevers:

Funnily enough the last time I checked was Christmas Eve...

In reply to richprideaux:

To be fair it took me almost 2 days to spot that the graph wasn't changing

It would be good to see it updated as I would like to see how temps are changing up there.

In reply to Joss:
Was good on Crib Lem (Llech Ddu Spur) today. Video on here https://www.facebook.com/Rustybalemountaineering

In reply to Joss:

Winter has well & truly returned & it was a stunning day to be on the hills; that said, few routes are actually in condition. There's lots of powder & graupel in the gullies. This tends to consolidate under a good heavy kick but not sure I'd want to be on the Trinity face as it is; probably needs a bit of a thaw/freeze. The gullies in Cwm Cneifion saw a little action today with Easy (I) & Hidden (II) getting multiple ascents including possibly the first canine one of Easy! The turf underneath the snow is however insulated & largely unfrozen. That said where it's exposed (above 600m) it is frozen. Bits of ice appearing above 900m but not enough to climb on. Rock routes & ridges with a good covering of snow are where you need to go (see last night's post on Crib Lem). Golden Girl Ali (?) & a new route on Clogwyn Du were done. I'm sure V12 or the winter wiki will have the details later. Get out there; the forecast is stable for the next few days.

In reply to geoff b:

Sorry to correct you Geoff but my Border Collie has done Easy Gully, Hidden Gully and Tower Gully in winters past.

In reply to Joss:

Conditions are good for high level walking and ridges at the moment. I went up Y Garn and then on to Glyder Fawr and Glyder Fach today. Snow was fairly soft on Y Garn, and I didn't use crampons until descending Glyder Fach, via Bristly Screes which was quite slippery. I imagine with more footfall the snow will consolidate more, making crampons necessary. Some photos at https://www.flickr.com/photos/rockcatch/

In reply to Andy Mountains:

Hi Andy,
Had a feeling it might have been done before, hence prefacing it with a 'possibly'! Ioan Doyle's sheepdogs made it look easy, but then they do have in-built crampons! Hope you got out today& I may see you in the hills over the next couple of days; mwynhewch!
Geoff

Hello: I wondered whether there might be enough snow to take my touring skis out from the north side of the carneddau on Monday (29th). There was enough snow for a good ski around the clwydians/llantysilio hills sat and sun.

Is anyone able to help with advice from an excursion today? Many thanks...

In reply to geoff b:

Do you know if any grade IIish climbs are in... heading up tomorrow for a couple of days and trying to make a plan. If none of the gullies are in yet then I might just do the north ridge of tryfan.

In reply to Danbow73:

Snow firming up where trodden on paths, routes need a few freeze thaws yet. Given the forecast I would go up some classic ridges and enjoy the summit views and light. Magnificent today.

In reply to Danbow73:

Did the North Ridge of Tryfan today. (Hope you enjoyed it, Paul) Good value, especially if staying on the crest, or even more sporting lines. Most people skirted the direct lines. Lots of unconsolidated powder snow, turf not frozen, there is ice but it is not sticking to the rock. I think that the gullies would have been a swim. Definitely did not fancy a gully.

It was freezing at 4pm but it would benefit from thaw freeze cycles.

No wind forecast for tomorrow which is a good job as all that powder is waiting to be blown away. North Ridge is always an enjoyable route.

In reply to Danbow73:


Bristly Ridge, Crib Lem, N ridge Tryfan are all goers in these early conditions. Bit to early to be expecting decent snow conditions in the gullies but you can have a cracking day out on the rock ridges.

In reply to fenlli:

I was on the Carneddau today (from Gerlan) and I would say there enough snow to ski tour tomorrow too if you missed it today!
Mwynhewch!

In reply to geoff b:

but you'll have to carry your skis a fair distance from and back to the road and you'll have to watch out for breakable crust and rocks ! Some good snow cover for skiing on the S facing slopes below C. Dafydd if you are really keen to get out.

In reply to Joss:
Did anyone climb Parsley Fern today or yesterday? I was wondering if there was enough snow to ski it yet? The top half looked ok but I couldn't see any more than that in the bad vis on Saturday, I'm guessing the lower half is still a bit rocky...

In reply to torquil:

This suggests someone did: http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/c.php?i=41359

In reply to torquil:

Spoke to two groups who went up right hand. Said it was very thin but just about climb able.

In reply to 1philjones1:

Golden Girl Ali and Reade's were climbed again today but any one who was out today knows that nothing was frozen and even the highest crags were black and dripping.

YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE..!

Got out into the hills today. Temps were very mild 7.5 degrees at Ogwen Cottage. Lots of thawing going on. We went up to Cwm Cneifion and up Seniors Ridge. Snow is pretty shit to be fair. Slushy in the lower slopes and sugary powder higher up. I wouldnt bother with snow gullies until we get a thaw freeze cycle which could well happen if the snow doesnt all melt away first!

In reply to Joss:

http://news.v12outdoor.com/2014/12/30/wide-asleep-x-9-%E2%80%93-pete-harris...

In reply to Steve Perry:

Ian's description of the route on facebook made him sound a bit shell shocked just by the experience of seconding it! The weather looks perfect that day.

In reply to wolf.leeb: well said nothing climbable in the lakes either but only a very few logging unacceptable routes. Whereas lots of routes in Wales getting logged that can't be in Nick.

In reply to Joss:

Anyone had a look on Trinity face yet? I imagine it might be a bit wet now?

In reply to Joss:

From the webcam, a lot of the snow appears to have melted of Y Garn.

Any thoughts on how things might shape up for the weekend? Might a refreeze bring some of the gullies into condition or is it just two warm and wet?

In reply to Joss:

Indeed. Some gullies were ok early on Tuesday am (enough snow, just about consolidated enough), but by midday it was really thawing out and climbing gullies in the afternoon was just likely to make a mess of the turf.

In reply to Trevers:

Round 2 is over..
Will be stripped bare before the weekend.

In reply to Joss:

Heading over tomorrow, looking at webcams is anything left at all.
Not expecting anything more than snow plodding, although that might be hopeful too

Ta

In reply to JamButty:

It was 10 degrees in Capel Curig this morning, and most of the snow seemed to have disappeared off Y Garn. It's currently warm, wet and windy in Bangor.

In reply to rockcatch:

Warm and very wet all afternoon in Bangor with just a few nits of soggy hail. Can't see the mountains but wouldn't expect much fun tomorrow!

In reply to Ron Rees Davies:

Looking at the Met Office. Trinity Face could be in ok condition by the weekend?

In reply to skizxi:

Really?! Love to know how you think that is going to happen!

In reply to TobyA:

Freezing level around 700m tomorrow and Saturday.

In reply to TobyA:

I was wondering myself. Out of the wind it was warmer OUTSIDE my office in Ruthin than inside today!

In reply to Joss:

Not sure if this link has already been posted on here but...

https://www.thebmc.co.uk/idwal

Ground temperatures look pretty high!

NMM

In reply to skizxi:

Pretty much all the snow has been washed away. Back to square one - typical of North Wales winter!

In reply to Joss:

- decided not to go over today despite lovely sunshine, it was still howling so the thought of struggling up somewhere with no snow to cheer me up killed it off for me
Try again when snow comes back hopefully!!

In reply to Joss:
It would appear that some people did manage something,

http://news.v12outdoor.com/2014/12/30/wide-asleep-x-9-%E2%80%93-pete-harris...

In reply to JamButty:

It was a lovely afternoon for a walk up Snowdon to burn off some calories even though all the snow has gone !

As quickly as it dissapeared, some snow has returned. Light dusting on the Glyderau.

In reply to Joss:

Has anyone been out today? Thinking of going on an adventure tomorrow but not sure what gear to take

In reply to wazzalad20:

Expect icy paths where last of slush has frozen over night - crampons or grips. Some snow on tops but not much unless falls over night.

Out tomorrow scrambling. Wont be taking axes or crampons. Just big boots.

In reply to Joss:
Few shots from Crib Goch today: https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.718546428260811.1073741888.484572...

Pretty soft snow, not much actual frozen stuff, but a lovely few hours in stunning conditions.

I didn't feel the need for crampons or an axe, although I had both in my bag.

In reply to jezb1: Nice Jez - I think you went up the north ridge though looking at your photos

In reply to Rory Shaw:

Yep, you're right of course!

In reply to jezb1:

Anyone been out today? too cloudy to see the tops from home.

In reply to Joss:

I am heading there at the weekend. Forecast looks warm and wet, but does anybody have any first hand info on the conditions? Is there any point taking crampons / axe(s) etc....

In reply to markh554:

Which forecast are you looking at?

In reply to crag_hopper_Jay:

MWIS and met office. But appears to have changed (yet) again. Last time I looked it reckoned high winds, 3-7C and rain.

Now windy, cold possibly snow...

You been up recently?

In reply to markh554:

Yeah I know, it seems pretty uncertain!

I was in ogwen on Sunday, but I doubt that'd give you much information now as the weather is all over the shop!

Fingers crossed, supposed to be over that way on Saturday & Sunday

In reply to crag_hopper_Jay:

I suspect it may be a case of make some plans for different variations, go friday, wake up and see what is happening...

In reply to markh554:

On Snowdon yesterday - just a dusting above about 900m. Warm very wet and windy in Ogwen this afternoon wed so I guess all has been washed away but forecast is for some snow showers high up on thurs and not looking good for friday so I doubt you will making much use of crampons on sat.

In reply to markh554:


Just take them anyway? Unless you're traveling there via horseback I doubt an extra 2/3kg will make any difference. And even if you were, I doubt it would.

In reply to Joss:

has anyone seen what its like over the weekend, am planning on being up there Monday through to Thursday but snow looks unlikely, how icy is everything?

In reply to td72:

Pretty warm, wet and windy... Icy it won't be.

In reply to Joss:

Just wondering if anyone knows of any websites that show weather reports for previous days in mountainous areas. It's getting harder and harder to keep weather journals with work commitments. Mainly for snowdonia of course.

In reply to Joss:

Looks like there's been a big dump of snow in Ogwen and temperatures have dropped quite a lot and look to stay cold. Could be some good conditions once the weather settles down a bit? What do people think?

In reply to td72:

Was on Glyder Fach and Fawr on Saturday - was as close to zero ice as could be. It was paper thin on some puddles was all I saw, and one or two bits (also paper thin) on wet rocks.
Sunday we stayed lower in Ogwen and only saw 1 minute of hail, which also likely fell as hail higher up too (the clouds were mostly stratus like, and they don't really produce snow unless it's ultra cold, which it wasn't).

In reply to Trevers:


Much more a dusting than a dump I'm afraid.

Temp and forecast seems to be up and down daily this week so we are likely to get a bit more snow but also mild south-westerlies with heavy rain........

In reply to wynaptomos:

http://www.ogwen-rescue.org.uk/oggi_cam/

This says "dusting"

In reply to Rampikino:

I was on working on Tryfan today and for an hour or so the snow was pretty heavy.

What's left though is a dusting and a few frozen puddles.

Lovely day out but certainly no need for axes and crampons quite yet.

In reply to wynaptomos:



Yeah I wrote that earlier when two of the Oggi cams were covered in snow so I assumed there was more than there actually was.

Still it looks like there might be plenty to come, and it will be cold higher up. I'm not ready to abandon all hope

In reply to Joss:

Can anyone give an update on conditions on the ground? The webcams are all being completely useless at the moment.

In reply to Trevers:

Unfortunately it appears we lost internet access at Oggie base last night, probably due to the weather.

This means the webcams will be down until someone has an opportunity to investigate the cause (possibly at the weekend), and then of course the time to fix the problem will depend on what exactly has gone wrong.

Typical isn't it, that this happens when everyone wants to see what the snow conditions are like!

In reply to rockcatch:

Stolen from another post
'The First Hydro webcams are still alive.
Snowdon: http://www.fhc.co.uk/weather/images/sn_huge.jpg
Moel Eilio: http://www.fhc.co.uk/weather/images/me_huge.jpg
Elidir Fawr: http://www.fhc.co.uk/weather/images/em_huge.jpg

Looks like there aint no snow left

In reply to pasbury:

https://www.thebmc.co.uk/idwal

Close to frozen.......

In reply to LakesWinter:

Shame that there is precious little snow to freeze !

In reply to dgp:

Has not much come down today? The forecast suggested it was snowing all day up high... :-/ Tossing up whether to drive over tonight to do an early route tomorrow - maybe Bristly or Crib Lem.

In reply to TobyA:

Looked up at the hills at last light today and it seems pretty patchy, doesn't look like any fresh stuff has come down.

Pretty warm/damp/windy here at the moment.

In reply to jezb1:

MWIS and Met Office forecasts are both suggesting it is cold and getting colder high up. The turf at 850m is getting close to freezing in Idwal. So any new snow should be settling. But the internet is the only window I have

In reply to Trevers:

Yep, looks like it's getting chilly. I camping out tomorrow night for work

In reply to jezb1:


Thats good! Enjoy it. Have also been studying the Idwal readings all day trying to guess at what's happening.

In reply to TobyA:

some snow patches left high up on sheltered NE aspects - ie trinity face, cwm glas but I can't comment on whether gully lines are complete. No fresh snow today that I could tell. Wind and temps dropping off. Sunday looking like a nice day to get out but I'm not sure if there will be anything to climb.

In reply to Rory Shaw:
Coming up on Saturday, will the trinity face be in or would I be better heading for ogwen and maybe tryfan?

In reply to Joss:

Has there been any more snow today, doesn't seem like there's that much from what people have written (and the webcams are all black now).
Anybody been out and about today?

In reply to pec:

Y Garn looked like it had had a dusting this morning. I could see the line of Banana Gully. I don't know if any more fell during the day but temperatures are now pretty cold so I doubt any melted
https://www.thebmc.co.uk/idwal

From the Met Office:
Latest: Date of observations: 16/1/2015 Observation made on: Snowdon Time of observation: 11:30:00 AM Winter conditions above: 350 metres Ground Conditions: Light dusting of hail/snow, Streams and wet areas are frozen, Depth of snow increases with height, Snow drifts in areas. Kit Advice: Recommended to carry ice axe and crampons, Wear crampon compatible boots, Walking poles can provide an aid to balance and security when walking through unconsolidated snow, Ski goggles can aid visibility in strong winds and blowing snow, Take waterproofs, hat, gloves and spare warm layers

Issued at: 1653 on Fri 16 Jan 2015

In reply to Joss:

Weather warning for early hours tomorrow:

http://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/north-wales-news/north-wales-weather-sleet-...

In reply to Joss:
Just got in from being out yesterday and overnight.

We were in the Glyders. A few inches of snow higher up. Turf actually quite frozen in places higher up. The routes in Cneifion didn't look particularly rimed up but I did see one pair starting up a route, unsure which.

Looking across to Devils Kitchen yesterday: https://scontent-b-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/10522557_72741761...

In reply to Joss:

has it started snowing at all today? if there is a big dump today conditions look good for early next week.

In reply to td72:
Been up Tryfan today. Turf was frozen and but there isn't much snow, a lot has meted through the day and only a couple of flutters came down. All the gullies around ogwen look patchy.

In reply to Joss:
Was up the Carneddau today. Turf frozen on tops but not lower down i.e. below 800m. On snow on tops and only a light dusting, although appears to be getting added to. Paths on Yr Elen were treacherous and although there was little snow, the scree was frozen with verglas. really difficult to walk on it. Black ladders looked bare. Still not really cold enough. Was only when I hit the snow line that I needed to put a jacket on!!!!!

Ryan

In reply to Joss:
Clogwyn Ddu is in great nick, get on it! Pretty much all the routes are in. Snow, dribbles of ice, some verglas, turf frozen solid, rime, the lot.

In reply to Misha:

I'll second that Clogwyn Du/Cwm Cneifon is doing alright, had two pretty good days out, Sunday, was a bit blustery and lots of hail/powder flying around but good ice, firm turf and pretty nice all in all!

In reply to TAG_UTLEY:

How is the snow quality in Cwm Cneifion? And did you notice any cornices at all?

In reply to Trevers:
Snow was powdery / graupel once in the Cwm. Top 20 metres of Easy Gully stripped down to good neve by the wind. Cornice was about knee high. Interestingly, there was avalanche debris down in the gully but that was a few days old.

Hi all.
Has anyone been on y garn gullys or central trinity.
And just a general question please if you can help. How much harder is central trinity than bannah gully.
Thanks

In reply to Removed Userdmbishop:





On Y Garn today, not so enthusiastic as Misha after looking at Banana Gully though there has been a little traffic....turf still unfrozen high up, only met ice on summit though better forecast ahead

In reply to steveboote:
All good up in Cwm Cneifion today according to a friend who was there. They did Golden Girl Ali, while a hard new route was put up on Clogwyn Ddu (the second new hard route this season!). Baggy will no doubt have the details. Looking at the forecast, it will be good for mixed up high as long as the cold spell lasts and Ysgolion Duon might be worth a look soon (turf will need to be frozen and the crag base is lower than Clogwyn Ddu). Idwal ice is some way off (hardly anything building yesterday, though that was from a distance). Wouldn't be surprised if snow gullies are a bit hit and miss as not really been any thaw since last Wednesday.

In reply to Removed Userdmbishop:

Central Trinity has a couple of rocky/icy steps to overcome, needs some (fairly straightforward) navigating to stay on-route and seems a little steeper.

In reply to steveboote:

Thanks. I'm newish to this and I done bannah gully and A gully. But wonted to do b and c only if conditions were good.
Do you know any other grade 1 or 2 lines that are in at the mo.

In reply to mysterion:

Thank you. Iv done gribbin ridge, crib gogh, bannanah gully x2, A gully on y garn, striding edge x2, all in full winter. I coped fine with these (scared but technically nothing) do you think central trinity which Im sure is grade 1 will be the right next step.
Sorry to bring the conversation down a grade or two. I gather some of you are pretty good. But I got to start somewhere.

Also do you know of some easy ice to practice on.

In reply to Removed Userdmbishop:

This forum is for all grades and abilities so don't be apologising for bringing things down a grade or two!

I don't have a huge amount of knowledge on these areas, but Great End is a decent place to go for winter lines that are technically a little higher in grade than winter walking. Once you've done the lines you're happy with their, you're also in a prime spot for some great winter walks. Plenty of scope to push into grade 3 should you feel ready also.

In reply to neilwiltshire:

It's certainly not all about grades here...Though Great End isn't exactly in Snowdonia...

I'm hoping to get out tomorrow - anybody cast any guesses on the level of the frozen turf at the moment?

In reply to Trevers:

It wasn't brilliant but pretty good, as a fair amount of fresh powder was blowing around on Sunday, and on Saturday the powder was dry and loose, BUT underneath is some good solid stuff, and with the wind on Sunday it was removing some of loosest stuff. Small cornices, some evidence of a small avalanche down Easy Route, but looked fairly old, and was almost covered by the fresh snow overnight and into Sunday.

Get on up there!

In reply to cymjt:

You're right, sorry, I didn't really look at the title of the thread and was just responding to the posters comments about striding edge. I take it all back

In reply to Removed Userdmbishop:

As with all routes the grade can vary dependent upon conditions although trinity should be fairly straight forward and within your capabilities judging by the routes you've done to date. If you looking for ice to play on then Sargeants Gully in Cwm Glas would be ideal if it's in condition, you could then plod on up to Parsley Fern Gully - a good full day out although you'd need to check the avalanche risk around the Parsley Fern area.

In reply to Removed Userdmbishop:

Scared is right, easy but serious. Either Central Trinity on Snowdon or Tower Gully in Cwm Cneifion would be a good next step (one rocky/icy step halfway up Tower Gully after a fairly steep 50 something degree section). Broad Gully in Cwm Lloer is somewhere intermediate (one rocky/icy step at start). Parsley Fern Gully in Cwm Glas would be similar to Banana Gully and gets you into another cwm you might not bother with in the summer.

In reply to neilwiltshire:

We did Tower Gulley up to the crux to get at Golden Girl Ali yesterday and it was in decent nick. Another team from PYB completed Tower Gully with no problems and plenty of ice. Plenty of ice in the Tower Slabs area. Cwm Idwal wasn't freezing when we walked in around midday, but freezing level appeared to be around 700m at that point, dropping by the evening (clear skies).

In reply to Joss:

I did Tower Gully today and it's in great nick. Was happy to solo it and you can see from my logbook that I have next to no winter experience. There is a bit of a tricky ice step about half way up that can't be avoided.

In reply to Trevers:

Was up there today and looked at Tower Gully which looked good, Tower Slabs also looked quite tempting. Ended up doing Hidden Gully. As previously noted appeared to be a bit of partial buried avalanche debris in the approach up Easy gully. Hidden itself had 6 inches or so of powder covering much of it. Underneath a mix of old neve and frozen turf. However neve seemed a bit soft and the powder was covering a fair few hidden rocks (wheres me file). Frozen turf seemed the best placements. Overall not the best conditions but usable and fun to be had. Clogwyn Ddu left hand and Pillar Chimney were building up nicely but probably need bit more time yet.`

In reply to everyone, thank you for answering my question. It really helps a lot.
I won't to do them now.
Wish me luck.
And good luck to all you.

In reply to thlcr1:

What sort of time were you up there? We topped out shortly after midday.

Yeah there's been a bit of southerly wind lately so caution probably wise on north facing slopes. There were some tiny cornices as the back of Cwm Cneifion. Tower Gully seemed pretty safe from any avalanche risk in the conditions today.

In reply to Joss:

So the big question is, should I put my gear in the car and extend my work trip to Bangor so I can climb on Friday?

And if so is anyone looking for a partner for Friday? I can lead grade 3 but can probably second 4 if I can still remember how to use axes after all this time.

In reply to gethin_allen:

I think they're expecting a thaw to set in on Friday, but I think the longer term forecast is for a refreeze next week? Maybe

In reply to Trevers:

That's what mwis are saying, high winds and rain.

In reply to Trevers:

Think I was there about 11-11:30. Guess I only just missed you ! Will have to see if I can get back out there for a go at Tower Gully

In reply to Joss:

Any idea if some of the ice routes in Cwm Idwal will be good to go Saturday? Freezing levels due to drop again Friday evening

In reply to Anhibian:

Unlikely I would think , usually need a consistent spell of colder weather for them to form with freeze thaw cycles as well

In reply to Joss:

There was a dump of new snow last night, and temperatures have also risen. So it goes without saying, take care if going out tomorrow

In reply to Trevers:

Thinking of getting out Saturday, any ideas of current conditions? There is a brief thaw coming Friday but cold again Saturday so feeling positive

In reply to wazzalad20:

Yesterday was great higher up. I wasn't out today but it wasn't looking great for the next couple of days. I don't think it will have been cold enough for long enough on Saturday to get too excited, but I'm just a punter so don't listen to what I say

In reply to Removed Userdmbishop:

I'm not sure I've seen all the answers to your question about Central Trinity. I've only done it once, but we found a section quite high up that was bare rock and harder than anything else on the route. As I recall, there was a reasonable belay below it, but the short, lean section itself was unprotected.

If you're in any doubt, back off. The route will always be there another day.

In reply to wazzalad20: was up in cwm cneiffion today. Lots of unconsolidated powder. A group was heading up right hand gully and we went up Hidden Gully, surprisingly good neve and some ice. Felt very warm as we went up.

In reply to 1philjones1:

Ok sounds promising, a quick thaw and re - freeze could sort that out nicely thanks

In reply to Anhibian:

no chance for idwal.. nada. even the stream is a good few days off.
clog du good to go though, (ice and turf) so long as you get on it before it rains midday tomorrow (fri).

ah well, thats wales!

In reply to Joss:

Have put a photo on my profile of Snowdon today for those who want to know how things look.

In reply to Climbingspike:


Or rather to piss off those that had to work and look at the inversion all day from below

In reply to Nicholas Livesey:

Thinking of those from outside the area. where are you, it's been wall to wall sunshine on this side.

In reply to Nicholas Livesey:


I saw pictures of it and I'm bloody jealous!

In reply to Joss:

Does anybody have an idea how much effect today's thaw will have? With a hard freeze overnight I'm speculating that it could help consolidate any loose snow, but that's from my office... What's it looking like up there?

In reply to Nick Russell:

I'm dreading Oggi Cam clearing to show everything stripped clean

In reply to Joss:

Can't comment on the effects of today's thaw, however, this is what I found on the Black Ladders yesterday:

Turf largely frozen (but with the odd mushy bit) below 800m, well frozen above that. Some ice but very wet (think small waterfall).

A lot of very loose unconsolidated snow in the gullies etc, making it somewhat hard work, both to climb and to get to the turf below.

I would guess that the amount of frozen turf after today's thaw/rain will have significantly decreased...

In reply to cymjt:

I caught a brief glimpse of Y Garn on Oggi Cam earlier, or at least the lower third. It wasn't entirely stripped so I'd imagine a lot of snow and ice remains higher up, but not in a good condition.

Air temp currently 3.6C at 850m.

Fingers crossed for a healthy refreeze in time for next weekend!

In reply to Trevers:

Was out on clogwyn du today.
By the time we left 2.00pm ish buttresses where black and everything was thawing fast.
That said there was some reasonable ice about and plenty of snow.
With a good re freeze it could well come good high up.

Does anyone know if there's any snow left on snowdon. Webcams blurred and can't see from South snowdonia. Looking to get out tomoz. Cheers Si

In reply to sdawson1:

Judging from Oggi Cam, there's probably still a bit left higher up, and turf probably still frozen so take spiky stuff.

Looks like it might be grim weather tomorrow though. I hope winter's not over for this year

In reply to Joss:

Went to do one of y Garns gulleys today, looked from the car park decided it looked a bit thin, so walked the loop instead. Had a quick look up Banana Gully which looked bare for the bottom 1/3rd. Chatting to a couple of guys who did it who'd just topped out, and they said there were some ropey bits, bit thin, not really frozen, so they spent part of the time on the rocks and turf at the side.
Not really much snow left on the plateau, so all a bit grim really for anything more than a plod.
Even on our walk I didn't use crampons or axe (glad we left the other kit behind!)

We were a bit hopeful this morning heading out, and although we knew it had been stripped in the last 24hrs, there was much less snow than we expected.

In reply to JamButty:

Good conditions on clogwyn du. Plenty of ice and turf solid. Surprised after yesterdays temperatures.

In reply to robgixer:
But it looked black from the road in the gaps between the clouds so we figured the mixed routes wouldn't be in and retreated to White Goods (which was sunny all day and as ever sheltered from the wind). Reasonable snow cover in Cwm Cneifion from what we saw but rapidly becoming patchy on the final approach slope before you get to the Cwm.

In reply to Misha:

It didn't look promising like you say, maybe the harder mixed routes wouldn't have been ok but left and right branch, pillar chimney were all seeing multiple ascents.

In reply to robgixer:
Yes I can imagine the ice routes would sti have been fine and you don't need the crag to be white for ice routes. Was the rock rimed up at all? It seemed to be only at the top of the crag from what we saw.

In reply to robgixer:

Great day out on the Trinity Face of Snowdon on Saturday.
Multiple routes were in, spoke to a couple who'd just completed the V with the welsh name.
Snowdon's washed out now, but will be in again next weekend (well the Park Warden promised me it would be).

In reply to Joss:
Out of date now but very lean on the Trinity Face on Saturday. We backed off Right Hand, too lean, then plodded up Central on very soft snow. At least we did something!

In reply to Joss:

We went up with good intewntions Sunday. Not sure if anyone did anything. Looked too WET for us. we did however find a small bit of ice by the zig zags and had a tootle up that. About 20feet of pleasant WI II/II. Pretty wet day overall my salopettes giving up on the way down.

In reply to Joss:

Cwm cneifion was good fun on Saturday, with lots of ice on the easier routes on the left as you enter the cwm. On clogwyn du on the right, there were plenty of parties climbing. Turf was good with reasonable ice about. Check out this link to see some of the ascents with comments
http://www.ukclimbing.com/logbook/winter.html

In reply to Joss:

Does anyone know if anything has survived the thaw?

In reply to Joss:
Here is a film I made on Saturday of Central Trinity. It's a record of that day, very different now I should think. youtube.com/watch?v=gU_PcXfSULQ&

In reply to Trevers:

It's meant to be cold the next few days, even the non-surviving stuff might well be back in early next week.

In reply to ianstevens:

Ogwen webcam is not yet showing the predicted " frequent heavy snow/whiteout" (MWIS), "snow on hills, feeding in on the strong northwesterly winds" (Met Office), "heavy fall of snow" (Snow-Forecast) etc. etc.

I want to know if it's worth waxing my skis in preparation for the weekend.

In reply to Pay Attention:

I was more thinking of mixed stuff - if the forecast comes true then all the snow will be horrid powder. Surely it's worth it just in case?

In reply to ianstevens:

It was awful in idwal this morning, small patches of snow on tops and in Cwm cneifon, mega windy , rain and hail

In reply to Joss:

Well the mercury has dipped quite dramatically according to the BMC Idwal page. So I'm going to maintain my sense of optimism for some unspecified point in the near future.

In reply to Trevers:

I'd link to think there'll be some climbs in condition this weekend as we'll be there, but I'm expecting to be walking instead.

In reply to Simon Caldwell:

Looks extremely cold for the next few days. Fingers crossed mixed routes will be in higher up for the weekend, surely!

In reply to Joss:

Looking to climb on ice with a beginer, ideally Idwal stream. Anyone got any idea if its looking as though it will be climbable by Saturday?
Alternatively higher up how about Hidden Gulley?
Thanks for any help.

In reply to wazzalad20:
My thoughts exactly.

Mountain monster - Given that ice takes time to form, and has probably mostly thawed - almost certianly not by the weekend. If Idwal stream comes in before next week I'll eat my metaphorical hat. No harm in going and having a look though!

In reply to mountain monster:

Any chance you might be around during the week next week? I'd be looking to do something along those lines with someone more experienced than me!

In reply to wazzalad20:

All my fingers are crossed

In reply to Trevers:

Sorry I already have my beginner. I can only make it at the weekend anyway.

In reply to Joss:

Anybody been out today? Whatsit like? Ta

In reply to mmmmcake:
Left hand branch was in better than average conditions today in Clogwyn Du! Tower gully & Hidden Gully look fine, Tower slabs thin but ok, harder mixed stuff well rimmed with an impressive ascent of some very overhanging terrain being climbed as we were coming down!

Nothing in Idwal from what we could see.

Raining at the car park in the morning but got much colder with height and also seemed to cool as the day went on. Ice building well higher up. Looks good for the weekend.

In reply to kenneM:

What was the weather like?

MWIS and Met Office suggesting it's gonna be a pretty windy weekend!

In reply to Joss:

I'd steer clear of the Snowdon range today. It's under attack from a giant spider

http://www.fhc.co.uk/weather/images/sn_huge.jpg

In reply to Trevers:
Funny

In reply to Joss:

Cwm Cneifion is definitely the place to head for.....yet again! Despite looking unpromising from the Idwal car park there's lots up there in great condition. Lots of folk on Tower Gully, whilst the slabs to the left gave some entertaining ice & turf action at II. The descent gully was fine whilst Hidden Gully saw a number of ascents (& a descent too!). Cleft Gully was done & looked icy, the ice behind the Pillar was gone from last week but I think there was a party on the alternative traverse. Left Hand Y Gully was leaner than last week but it still looked ace & had a couple of ascents. Right Hand Y Gully was beautiful, perfect ice, neve & turf every time; I'd forgotten how good it was! There was a team on El Mancho as I left, borne away by the wind. Goggles were very handy today.

Upper Cwm Glas (the Pass) looked like it might be holding some snow in Parsley Fern but neither it nor Crib Goch looked as wintry as they have done earlier this season. Lastly, ice was beginning to form on The Devil's Pasture in Cwm Idwal, more so than it was last week, but it'll be a few days before it or any of those routes are in.

Mwynhewch/Enjoy!

In reply to geoff b:
Cement Cneifon definetly looked much more wintery than the rest of Idwal. Went up past the Devil's Kitchen, snow was often sparse and always soft. Some ice beginning to form but the sound of running water gave some indication of how much colder it needs to be.

Pmc

In reply to baron

Anyone been over to Black Ladders recently?

In reply to Joss:

Ref the Black Ladders/Ysgolion Duon; not been in there for a week or two but it looks very wintry from Bangor. Turf was frozen from 800m upwards yesterday in Cwm Cneifion so it may be that the lower part of the Ladders aren't sufficiently frozen yet. The only way to find is to go there I guess.

In reply to Joss:

Has anyone taken a look at Idwal Stream lately?

In reply to Trevers:
Stream would be a good description of it's condition yesterday!

Pmc

In reply to geoff b:

The ladders were in brilliant mixed condition, tons of hoar 2" at the bottom 6" at the top, and decent hard turf on saturday above the main terrace, below that a fair amount of care was needed to reach the terrace as lower ice falls weren't there indeed very little ice at all, (the grade 3 ramp that leads to the start of the Somme got us up to the terrace) from there my self and Andy Humpheries did battle with the 'Guns of Navarone' VII.5. 7 defo a super meaty VII which turned out to be a brutal epic given the amount of hoar, 80mph wind and the route being full on. Be warned the first 2 pitches above the terrace are bold and technical but the upper finishing pitches of canon rib weren't much easier due to the hoar covering all the placements and gear especially as the wind was intensifying. All in in all a fantastic *** ladders classic not to be underestimated (It took us 5 hrs from the terrace to the top) Still thats what the ladders are all about. Rich Stone.

Went to try Sergeants gully in Cyrn Las on Saturday but it was pouring with water, we skirted round it and went up Parsley Fern in the upper Cwm. Deep, unconsolidated powder but several parties happily going up it.
Sunday was better conditions in Cwm Lloer, nice and cold and snow was fairly consolidated and the turf frozen. lots of stuff getting done, we did Broad gully which was in good nick. its staying cold up there so will be plenty left, though it could do with a bit of a thaw and re-freeze to consolidate things.
Have fun!

In reply to Rstone:

Yes Ladders looked in excellent nick for the hard mixed stuff. The gullies were pretty much empty of snow - we had good views of Eastern and Central - there might be a little ice but can;t tell from a distance. Icefall Gully was climbed yesterday - very thin apparently.

In reply to Joss:

Lots of snow fell on the hills early Monday morning; we even had a few cms in Llanberis (that's a couple of inches in old money). With a freeze/thaw cycle forecast for the next few days & nights, it's looking very promising. The Black Ladders looked stunning from Bangor.

In reply to geoff b:

Y Garn looks lovely in the moonlight right about now:
http://www.ogwen-rescue.org.uk/oggi_cam/

In reply to Joss:

Was anyone out yesterday who can comment on conditions?

In reply to Joss:

damn its a beautiful day today, driving over the moors looking over towards snowdonia could see snowdon all the way over to drum, gutted as i was heading to work on such a perfect day.

In reply to Joss:

Clogwyn Du was in great condition yesterday...

...however, out late start meant that we lost a bit of gear...We had to bail back down clogwyn left hand branch on Clogwyn Du yesterday in darkness...we left 2 anchors behind...one sling on a large thread low down, and then a nut/hex belay (with sling) above one of the steep pitches (not sure which one, it was dark!)

Im not entirely expecting to see it again, but if some kind soul would like to return it, then I'd happily buy you a pint or two/donate to MR/NWBF/whatever you want...

Thanks!

In reply to Al Cartwright:

Was in Snowdonia today, was on my own so looking for a reasonable solo and wondered if Sargent's gully had frozen up a bit in the last few days. drove up the pass and had a look through binoculars. Seemed to be a fair bit of ice in it but possibly a bit thin and several large areas of running water clearly visible. Was tempted to walk up as it looked like it might just be climbable but in the end decided even if it was it was likely to be dicey for a solo. In the end drove round to Capel and nipped up Daear Ddu ridge on Siabod. Lots of unconsolidated powder and turf only semi frozen until high up but followed the crest as directly as I could to try and make it slightly more exciting. Could probably have done it without axe and crampons, but I'd damned well carried them up so was going to use them . Grand view at the top though.

Lee

In reply to Joss:

Pretty good conditions in Cwm Cneifion today. Clogwyn Du very busy and looking in great condition.

Will be out again next two days so will update with what I see.

https://www.facebook.com/jbmountainskills/posts/737331229715664

In reply to Joss: On the Trinity Face today climbing Central Trinity, yet again. There were sections of deep powder, very soft (I sank up to my waist at one point lower down) and there were other sections of thin scoured ice. Despite the low temperatures the ice was surprisingly thin and brittle. Turf was frozen at the top but not lower down. From what I could see of the other lines on the Face they looked very thin with very little ice in the crucial sections although from a distance the huge amounts of snow gives the impression that they are 'in'. Having said all of that the mountains look fantastic at the moment.

In reply to caradoc:
Sorry to hijack the thread slightly. I'm coming up to Snowdonia this weekend, hoping to get out on Sunday, Monday and Tuesday. What would be good for a relative beginner to have a go at? I've done an alpine skills course, but nothing in the winter in the UK, and would probably want to start with some winter hillwalking before maybe doing something scrambly like Crib Goch.

In reply to caradoc:

Interesting comments re Ice development - does not the thickess ice build from freeze thaw temps rather than a sharp hard freeze, which may freeze the weeps holes and so prevent trickling water running and freezing causing ice build up.

similarly a big dump of snow on unfrozen ground will often mean everything appears in but turf crucial to some routes is actually unfrozen under the insulating blanket of snow.

snow routes also tend to need snow consolidation from freexe/thaw action to produce great neve, rather than powderslogs.

Only passing comment as despite climbing in winter for 20 yrs I still feel I'm learning what is or isn't in nick, and what temp cycles produce the best routes where.

looks like it is warming Friday/Sat before refreeze next week which could be just what the doctor ordered.

In reply to Neil Anderson:

I was wondering about Banana Gully today. It gets a fair bit of sun, so is this enough to set off a freeze thaw cycle while other parts of the mountains are in the shade? Has anyone been up it recently?

In reply to Trevers:

Callum skied down it today and said the snow was really powdery and not as much snow as you think there is on it ! Should be good for next week I guess...one of my mates did Eastern Gulley on The Black Ladders today which was in good condition. The Trinities not so good deep soft snow, as were most gullies in the area..Clogwyn Du seemed to be quite busy !

In reply to mr mills:

I attempted central trinity last night after work, snow was really soft and unconsolidated. I waded up to the spider to see if it got any better but it didn't so we came down. Very thin on the face at the moment. I'm sure it would go but it wasn't enjoyable!

In reply to BStar:

Some other friends of mine went up to Cwm Clyd last night thinking of going up `A Gulley` but the conditions were not good, they did not try anything and walked back down !

In reply to Joss:

Anyone been into Cwm lloer and can give an update. Heading down Saturday....I know, going by forecast possibly not the best day, but its the one i got available.

Cheers

Ryan

In reply to Trevers:
Sun hitting on snow (radiation) in Feb isn't enough to complete a freeze/thaw cycle in my experience. All it does is melting the surface snow and refreezing it again over and over. So you get this crispy pork scratching effect I call it. Still soft inside. I was walking over some virgin snow lying on relative flat ground at about 500m a.s.l. near Llan Ffestiniog with my dog. It was like that; slightly hard crust and soft inside as temperature has been consistently cold. Day time temperature no more than 3c in valleys. Not enough heat to melt stuff. Ok to melt on pavement and footpaths.
What needs to happen is the ambient temperature to fluctuate above and below freezing (convection) much greater so the bigger depth of the snowpack is thawed at a time and refrozen. Then you get a consistent layer of consolidated stuff.

In reply to Skinny Kin:

Sun hitting snow (ok, mostly ice) is enough to promote sub-surface melt in Antarctica up to 30cm depth, where temperatures are a long way below freezing. Short-wave radiation (from the sun) can penetrate snow to a depth of >10m (references on request!). So if a snow slope gets sun on it all day, it can melt to full-depth easily. However, limited sunlight hours on all but southern facing slopes mean that this effect is limited - hence the formation of a hard crust over powder. Obviously clouds can mess with this effect too as they absorb energy in the spectrum which penetrates the snowpack.

In summary, I agree with what you're saying - that the snowpack isn't thawing at depth - but disagree with the science behind it. Albeit a bit of a tangent from the actual thread...

In reply to mr mills:

Aye, lots of people out on Clogwyn Du and in Cneifion yesterday. Good conditions up there. The cold in Hidden Gully was pretty intense as it filtered all the wind. But the slopes leading up to Cneifion are covered in powder over loose turf. I did the top of the gully left of Idwal slabs, not fun!

Also noticed lots of windslab about on lee slopes and behind boulders etc. The descent from Glyder Fawr towards the col with Y Garn seemed safe enough though.

In reply to ianstevens:


A useful tangent... thanks!

In reply to Trevers:
HI , update on my blog. Cheers Baggy

http://wwwbaggy.blogspot.co.uk

In reply to Joss:

A quick drive up the Pass reveals that the routes on Railway Buttress (Irish Mail etc) have touched down; that Sergeant's Gully & Face Route (along with a number of its variations) are in, in lower Cwm Glas & even possibly Back in Black. Ice is forming all over Craig y Rhaeder but not enough to climb the routes yet. I couldn't see into upper Cwm Glas but I'd assume it's pretty darn good up there. Anyone ventured on to the turf routes on the Black Ladders?

In reply to mmd:

Cheers mate, nice to see some positive comments about conditions for a change looking forward to getting out Saturday.

In reply to Joss:
We did RH on Clogwyn Du, very good condition. El Mancho and LH were done amongst other routes.

Top day out up there today.

Few phots:
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.737829166332537.1073741893.484572...

In reply to Joss:
Report from a friend in Idwal today.
All routes in Idwal covered in ice..... 5cm thick at best ..... With water running behind it.... Lots of water..... And the sound of big lumps crashing down every so often.
They sensibly didn't chance it!

In reply to Joss:

Slightly OT, but what sort of state are the easy rock routes in, generally? We've got a club meet heading to Snowdonia this weekend and I'm fairly sure there will be people looking for long and very easy rock that they can move fast and keep warm on. For example, is Ordinary Route on Idwal cold but climbable, or buried under half an inch of verglas?

In reply to Jamie Wakeham:
Ordinary route was a mix of dripping wet and snowy yesterday. The descent will also be pretty snowy. Not the nicest thing to climb.

I reckon tremadog will be your best bet and shorter stuff on the slate / Holyhead / coastal sport.

In reply to jezb1:

Thanks Jez - that's helpful. Don't suppose you know if Tryfan Bach is in the same state? We're trying to avoid going too far afield as we have a night navigation course booked to start in the late afternoon...

In reply to Jamie Wakeham:

Can't say I noticed to be honest, but being a bit lower I reckon there's a good chance it'll be ok.

In reply to Joss:

is much going to still be in come tomorrow (saturday) and the rising temperatures?

In reply to Matt Schwarz:

Or indeed Sunday with the further rising temperatures?

In reply to kestrelspl:

The met office mountain forecast tonight has temperatures back to 600m fl on monday and 400m on tuesday

In reply to LakesWinter:

Isn't it 1000m on Monday, 600m on Tuesday and 400m on Wednesday? Being pretty much a newbie I don't know what influence this will have on what's left though...

In reply to kestrelspl:

O yeah that's right, would help if I could read!

In reply to LakesWinter:

There's loads of snow still, so if it does survive the weekend, next week should be awesome if the high pressure and cold does arrive.

In reply to Joss:

Climbed western gully on the Black Ladders today. Conditions were lean, snow was useless, turf was frozen and the route was amazing.

http://www.masterplan-mountaineering.co.uk/2015/02/western-gully-black-ladd...

In reply to Joss:

Has anyone, other than the last post, got actual info on conditions on the ground? I'm particularly interested in Cloggy, as thats our plan tomorrow.

Cheers

Ryan

In reply to alastairbegley:

Wondered how others in the cwm got on yesterday - think there was a team heading in to central gully too. All of you were finished well before we were...

We did Pyramid gully - in pretty good condition. The eastern end of the cliff looks to have a bit more ice - though eastern gully looked to be more snowy after the initial icefall. The big icefalls on the western end looked pretty thin from a distance.

On Pyramid, we only found 2 bits of rock gear on the whole route apart from some spikes high up. -Everything else was on screws and turf gear including belays - we wished we'd taken more than 5 screws for P2. Rock looks like it's pretty compact anyway, but from P2 onwards all the rock is plated in thick rime ice. The little entry pitch was dripping a bit (so will be building steadily), but really solid, plastic ice. Good thing too, as the first few moves are properly steep. P2 is continuous good ice, plating a bit, but taking good screws if you picked the right spot. Above, the snow got better all the way, plenty of small turf and ice bulges to maintain interest through the easy ground. Great first visit to the ladders!

D

In reply to Joss:
Ladders in good nick today but the rimenhad retreated towards the top of the crag by the end of the day. Lots of ice on all the usual icy routes. Central gully is now tracked. The crux bulge features overhanging ice formations, pretty awesome, bring stubbies and cojones (I had neither or perhaps common sense kicked in so went round as is usual in lean conditions).

In reply to Joss:

Another stunning day on Clogwyn Du & very, very busy. Hidden, Cleft, El Mancho, Pillar Chimney/Face, Pillar variation, Left Hand & Right Hand Y Gully all getting multiple ascents. The Cwm was also very busy with the easier routes getting a lot of traffic. Anyone know how the dude who fell off Pillar Chimney got on/off/out?! Hope he's okay.

In reply to geoff b:

It was 1.5 degrees in ogwen when I left at 5.15pm, so should be good to go tomorrow.

In reply to geoff b:

Brilliant day at Clogwyn Du today, although the rime was getting thinner as the day progressed due to the warm temperature.

Climbed Left Hand Branch which is in grade IV condition at the moment due to a ladder all the way up the route. If you so desired it would be possible to lace it with gear due to thick ice all the way to the top. After we climbed El Mancho which was brilliant with well frozen turf, lots of solid hooks and great gear.

El Mancho felt much easier than Western Gully did yesterday.

http://www.masterplan-mountaineering.co.uk/2015/02/left-hand-branch-el-manc...

Hi Folks,
Can anyone report on Central Trinity?
We're considering it for Monday - wondered if conditions have improved in the last couple of days.
thanks in advance.

In reply to Confused Vorlon:

did left hand yesterday. could really do with another freeze, was really warm yesterday.

In reply to Matt Schwarz:
Went up to black ladders today, had a look at pyramid and central gullies before deciding to go for a walk instead. Very drippy/hollow ice low down, and turf not frozen until the top 50m or so. Still attempted by some parties we met at the bottom, although don't really know how this could be justified as being "in" however desperate people may be for a winter tick.

In reply to ianstevens:

Just driving home after doing trojan. Five years after we bailed, patience has been virtuous. Just a little bit happy. Yyfy!

In reply to ianstevens:
that was my assessment also, went past for a run (around 12:30) lots of nice snow but not hard enough and soft turf, ideal for running though

In reply to ianstevens:
Hi Ian. We had a great day climbing up those streaks of ice running down the crag. The mixed routes definatley were not in. We had a great time climbing hope you had a great time walking.

In reply to Ewan Russell:

Which ones were those? It did look like a lot of the ice on the right hand side of the crag (facing in) was good to go, glad you had a good day. The section we looked at didn't look great, hence the retreat. Quite a bit of ice falling down unaided.

Walk was lovely, really nice weather on the top of the Carneddau (as I'm sure you saw).

Shame its been so warm, as I can't see what is left lasting for more than about 23 minutes. Might be time to bust out the rock boots and hope for another cold spell before the spring.

In reply to Joss:
Just got home after a few days in Snowdonia. Several trips into Cneifion and got my first few winter climbs under my belt. Absolutely stunning weather in the hills, all I needed was a deckchair and cold beer and life would have been perfect. Hope everyone else enjoyed it

https://www.flickr.com/photos/mtrevers/16477393155/in/photostream/lightbox/

In reply to geoff b:
Yes he was fine, saw him in the evening.

In reply to Joss:
Clogwyn Ddu on Sunday - still fairly white in places in the morning but rime falling off all day and by the end of the day the crag was mostly black, though there was snow holding out in some cracks and on turfy ledges. Turf was still bomber but something like El Mancho would now be way too bare I think. We did the Lampard Brewer route, which was great and nicely varied. The ice routes are holding out fine - our route took in the ice version of Pillar Chimney, which is steep but has hooks if you need them and you can bridge or lean against the pillar much of the time - 5 in its current state. The wild traverse on the last pitch is also still very much in. The first pitch was still holding snow in the cracks, on the turf ledges and in parts on the crux slab but may be not for much longer. The last two pitches should still be good for a while and can be approached via the big rampline. Or you could finish up the normal Pillar Chimney route. Clogwyn LH is pretty fat. Usual icy sections on Tower Slabs. Blenderhead seemed to be holding a fair bit of snow in the cracks, at least earlier in the day. So icy stuff still good but pretty slim pickings for the mixed stuff.

In reply to ianstevens:
I can't see the ice in Cwm Cneifion going anywhere for a few days as long as the nights are clear and therefore cold. The stars were put this evening so should be good for tomorrow.

In reply to Joss:

Rotten, dripping ice on the routes in the Kitchen, such a contrast to Clogwyn Du.

In reply to Misha:

What do you reckon the odds are of the Clogwyn Y Garnedd gullies being in this week? They were apparently full of powder last week but I'm hoping the warmer days and cold nights might magically turn it all into neve

In reply to Joss:

Sat: Cwm Lloer, mucked around on some grade 3 short sections of ice to left of Hourglass then did Broad Gully. Gd 2/3 variation start of BG
crumbling and heard someone had fallen off it earlier in day so we opted out of doing it. Main gully was fine, v little ice, mostly damp soft snow with bucketsteps. Amazing steep icefall splitting small buttress at back of lake - may be Moonflower but not sure. Looked climbable from a distance but didn't get close up to check.

Sun: Cryn Las, went to do Sargeants Gully but running with water, ice brittle so left well alone. Did Sinister Gully instead. Main icefall thinner than last time i did it but definitely complete. Got 2 screws in at bottom and 1 short one halfway up. Good snow in upper gully and nice icy pitch at the narrows. Upper slopes really cruddy, v soft powder and loose stones so care needed topping out. 2 friends in Parsley Fern said conds ok, snow fairly firm, last 40ft hard neve. Stunning inversion over the sea from top of Snowdon and far reaching views inland. Thought we may have glimpsed Mourne Mountains in Ireland poking up above inversion right at limit of westward horizon - could it be possible to see that far?

In reply to Misha:

I just assumed they'd been hacked down by the weekend hordes I'll give you that the nights are cold, but the days are very warm in contrast!

In reply to Cuillin Calling:

Not sure about Sunday, but certainly on Saturday the view seemed the stretch to infinity

This may help:
http://www.viewfinderpanoramas.org/panoramas/WAL/SNOWDON-N.gif

In reply to Trevers:

Wow what a brilliant website - thanks for forwarding the info. Looking at the view West on the site, I'm pretty sure now it was the Wicklow Mountains as we were looking out past Mynydd Mawr, and Moel Eilio from the top of Crib Y Ddysgl. There was this faint outline of mountains peeping up above the distant cloud. Too faint to come out clearly on my camera but will put some pics of the inversion on the Photo Gallery when I get a mo in the next few days.

To whomever took a dump three quarters of the way up hidden gully.
It is perfectly acceptable to sh** yourself when winter climbing.
However, it considered better form if you sh** your pants, rather than sullying the route.

In reply to Misha:

Ref the Lampard-Brewer finishing traverse to Pillar Chimney; what were your thoughts on it? I was pointed at the line by my unsuspecting colleague on Saturday & found it highly 'entertaining' as my toeholds crumpled beneath me like some hideous action film. I did get the last laugh tho' as Derek decided to back-rope it off an ice-screw which then needed retrieving by abseil!

In reply to Confused Vorlon:
Were you up there today? Was there much snow? I couldn't see on the cams today to much cloud. I was hoping for it to last till Thursday. It is a touch colder on wed and thu. Just looking for some easy gullys.
Has anyone done the gully to the left of cneifrion arate. ?
Just won't to do two more easy ones befor I go up to grade two. Any suggestions welcome.
Thank you in advance.

In reply to geoff b:
Exciting but the axes are bomber and the gear is decent. Feet require care for sure but there's enough there. Not that long for the exciting bit so VI 7? Great pitch, great route!

In reply to Removed Userdmbishop:

dmbishop: still plenty of snow up cneifion, but the melting means that there were more icy sections than we had seen before. We were on grade II routes, and they certainly seemed to be pushing the upper bounds of their grade.

We did banana on Sunday. Again, plenty of snow, but somewhat mushy for the bottom two thirds, also there is a small cornice at the top which is curling over and looks like it has to come tumbling down before long.

In reply to...

Any eyes on the ground with an idea of if its worth the (long-ish) drive up and home again tomorrow. Mixed, ice or gullies, guessing Cneifion is the most likely spot. It's either that or a day at work..

Cheers
George

In reply to Confused Vorlon:

Thank you

In reply to Confused Vorlon:

Anyone been out over the last couple of days? Be good to hear what it's like up there

In reply to wazzalad20:

If anyone has any good forecasting ability - I'd love to hear what they think the ice and snow on the Carnedds will be doing on Saturday. By looking at the Met Office figures on Monday (I will recalculate later today with updated figures), estimating freezing levels for the 2 days prior, I estimated that there'd be little-to-no snow until about 700m (as there'd be at least 2 days of full thaw here), soft snow until about 900m (fair amount of thaw at this level), and snow with a crust above 900m with rare patches of thin ice (thaws during the day, freezes at night).

In reply to wazzalad20:

I was out on Sunday on Pen yr Ole Wen. Did Y Gully right hand. Lots of snow but it was fairly unconsolidated. If there hadn't of been a good line of steps it would of been pretty hard going. Monday was Cwm Cneinifion. I did one of the easy lines to the right of Clogwyn Du. Again there was lots of snow and a line of bucket steps. Some of the other easier lines (Hidden Gully, Tower Gully etc.) were in but looked a bit thin with a fair bit of bare ice showing rather than nice firm neve.

In reply to Misha:

Anyone tackled Spectral Wall yet? Key bit is the ice coming up into that traverse so sounds like it's been in condition... (Good rock gear underneath - honest!)

In reply to Scafell:
There wasn't much ice below the overlap. There was actually quite a bit more ice on it when I was there two weekends earlier. Lots of ice on the easy ground above the overlap where the Lampard Brewer joins it and dribbles of ice on the Lampard Brewer traverse line and on the Pillar Chimney pitch, but not on the lower section of Spectral Wall. I thought that was a bit odd, particularly given the decent build up a fortnight earlier. The vagaries of winter!

Can anyone give an opinion for the conditions on summits for Saturday? It looks like the snow is gradually melting, and seems like the snowline will be quite high. Going walking with some friends and they don't all have crampons, so we're figuring out whether they need to rent some.

In reply to Matt250:

I was on Snowdon on Tuesday and although there is very little snow on the summit the paths still require care and I was glad of axe and crampons on the zig zags. I also took a heavy slip in the dark at Bwlch Moch as the path was a sheet of ice (crampons back on)!

Personally, if there is any snow at all on the hills I always take crampons and axe. It's better to have them and not use them than in my opinion

In reply to Joss:
Been up in Cwm Cneiffion today- went up not expecting much and the axes and crampons were in the bag more in hope than expectation, particularly as it was 10 degrees when I came off the A55.
However, I was very pleasantly surprised. Once you get towards the back of the cwn things start to improve greatly. There is still a huge amount of snow about and a lot of thick ice particularly on Tower slabs. I ended up going directly up the centre of Tower slabs on good ice, reasonable neve and any turf exposed was frozen solid. There was no running water at all under the waterfall so I would think it that, unless it gets a lot warmer, it will be there for a while.

In reply to Matt250:
Don't know about sat, maybe a touch hard going on the snow that will be there. cause the temp is above 0. But more than enough around all of the back of nameless cwm.snow hard enough to climb on today but not rock hard. If you go there def take kit for it. I was there today and enjoyed the back of the cwm along with meeting another four lads who looked like they enjoyed it to.
May be worth holding on till tue, there's a drop in temp and the snow should come good again.
Also I may add I am no expert.
Enjoy.

In reply to Misha:

The lower wall traverses up and out right, leaving the ledge where Manx Wall goes left up an obvious left slanting groove - straight up on ice is still the dream line, but never seen it go all the way down to the base of Pillar Chimney... When it went clean, the bottom wall was fairly mixed up to and slightly beyond the big roof. Good gear in the crack up to the big roof, then traverse up and right onto the steep wall and through overlaps. Thin ice on the top little overlap which is the crux - skinny placements, but they soon get better! Bomber rock gear in the overlap just below it. Would love to hear of someone getting on it

In reply to Removed Userdmbishop:

can anyone comment on conditions in ogwen valley this Sunday?

Expectations are not much is in condition so fully prepared for a days walking. Would settle for a trudge up a gully or so, was thinking cneifion is the best bet for this?

In reply to Scafell:
Defintely on the list, cheers.

In reply to garethtodd:
Not to sure sorry but mayby this might help.

http://www.snow-forecast.com/resorts/Snowdon/6day/top

I would think there should be some snow left on north facing sides. if it made it through the two warm days last week then some should last theses couple of cool days.

In reply to Removed Userdmbishop:

Rapidly thawing in clogwyn ddu. Did right hand branch and hidden gully this morning. Those and left hand branch ok, but probably wouldn't bother tomorrow unless it gets colder than forecast. Turf just frozen, but bet it won't have been by the end of today.

In reply to garethtodd:

Doood...
Are you thinking of Tower Slabs or Gully/ Cneifion,,,,Amigo Ice

In reply to amigoice:

Mr b... This is exactly what I have in mind...

In reply to John Roberts (JR):

Saturday:
Carnedds were pretty much devoid of any ice. There was thin patches of consolidated snow that could in a pinch pass as ice. Wet snow on the Northern flanks.

Sunday:
Went up Yr Elen from Bethesda via the ridge. Ground was muddy all the way up to the summit, snow was quite wet, but firm enough in places to kick decent steps. No ice anywhere in sight.

In reply to SenzuBean:

It was OK in Cwm Glas on Saturday. Slushy snow on the way up the stream. Sergeants gully was nearly all running water. Deep soft snow in the Cwm, that firmed up midway up Parsley Fern gully. Ice on the lower bits of the gully was dodgy, but got better in the tops sections. Top bit of the gully was good Neve, the Cornice on the left being quite steep. I down climbed and went back up the Left hand gully where most of the Ice was OK. Not much Ice on summits of Garnedd Ugain and Yr Wyddfa, and not much on Gyrn Las. Saw the usual nutters sliding around on their backsides in Wellies and trainers on the Llanberis path.

In reply to AntC:

Saturday - slate quarries: Turf not frozen, rock dry, warm in the sun.

Verdict: No winter this week (especially given the forecast).

In reply to Joss:

Did Clogwyn Du Left Hand Branch on Sat, ice on pitch 2 very stepped and felt like gd IV. Top pitch crumbling away but ice on variation left finish was excellent. Crag getting damp and water starting to seep under ice. Very quiet in the Cwm, had the climb to ourselves after the first party backed off.

Did a recce into the Black Ladders on Sun. Quite a lot of ice around but most of the routes incomplete, from a distance Icefall Gully looked in. Soloed Eastern Gully but bypassed the first pitch as the ice was wet and a bit crumbly.

In reply to Joss:

As expected a lot been stripped by Saturday, kept driving and found some great surf instead.
Sunday, went for run up North end Carneddau. Soft remains of snow making running interesting but still fairly frozen in places towards summits.
Short vid showing conditions in Cwm Glas last Sunday (8th Feb).

youtube.com/watch?v=b1W7C1NKaeo&

In reply to Joss:
Went to the Trinity Face on Saturday and climbed up to the chockstone on Central Trinity, which was running like a tap. The finest 5* crud I have ever encountered in 50 yrs of winter climbing! We opted for rock-climbing by the seaside afterwards...

In reply to Joss:
Here's another one from last Sunday on Clogwyn Du... youtube.com/watch?v=-atkbA9dHEk&

In reply to caradoc:
Been up in Cwm Cnwifion again today. Still a lot to go at. Spoke to a team who had just done y gully left hand and they said it was in good nick. Right hand also looked as if it would go. I went up a variant of Tower slabs, still loads of good, thick ice and solid placements, with improving neve as you go higher. I then dropped down Easy gully and, having spoken to a pair who had just done hidden Gully on good snow, went up there as well. Great day in surprisingly good conditions.

Hi.
Does anyone know if bannanah gully, tower gully, hidden gully, central trinity are still full lines after today's heat ( wed ). Just thinking if they are they might re freeze to semi good neve over the next couple of days.
Any thoughts please?

In reply to Removed Userdmbishop:

Did hidden gully and tower gully on Monday, banana gully Tuesday up in cwm cneifion today. Each day has got progressively worse! Today was very patchy in the cwm and slushy snow. Base of tower gully soft and patchy, couldn't see hidden gully because covered in cloud, but the ramp up easy gully also soft and slushy. Both were OK on Monday but alot has thawed since then.
Banana gully was OK on Tuesday... Soft snow until about half way up, then firmed up progressively to the top. Top out was good. Imagine it has thawed significantly lower down today as would have been in light rain for most of weds. If it gets cold tomorrow some may remain, but could really do with fresh snow to make any of them worthwhile!

In reply to Jonno:
Thank you.

In reply to Joss: Hi all, I'm heading to Snowdonia Friday Saturday Sunday for a club meet.

Are any of the low grade gullies likely to be in condition?

In reply to maxsmith:

Unlikely I would of thought. Right now in Capel Curig it's pouring with rain, as it was pretty much all last night, yesterday and the night before last. It's also been fairly warm, at least in the valleys. I can't see the hills unfortunately to tell you how white they're looking due to low, thick cloud. But as I haven't been up myself I couldn't say for certain.

In reply to maxsmith:

https://www.thebmc.co.uk/idwal

In reply to maxsmith:

Very unlikley.

In reply to ianstevens:

thanks all

In reply to maxsmith:

You may find something like Easy Route in the back of Cwm Cneifion (grade 1) is holding a bit of snow. Looked that way from looking up into the Cwm from near Bangor yesterday. Parsley Fern Gully may also have enough left in it. Then again, it may not...!

In reply to maxsmith:

And check

http://www.ogwen-rescue.org.uk/oggi_cam/


for y garn gullys. They have looked full through out the last few weeks and

http://www.snow-forecast.com/resorts/Snowdon/snowfinder

Says it's going to freeze abouve 700 ish for fri and sat

In reply to maxsmith:

If on Banana Gully on Y Garn you'll be following my footsteps from Wednesday if they haven’t melted. It was windy/foggy so didn’t I get to go all the way up but there was a reasonable amount of snow in the gully bottom, although it could definitely do with the freeze to be worthwhile doing this the weekend

Anyway hope that helps in some way?

Peter

In reply to maxsmith:

Did you get anywhere in the end?

In reply to Removed Userdmbishop:

Is it all washed away?

Anything still clinging to Central Trinity or Parsley Fern?

Any snow/ice left on Crib Goch?

In reply to Nigel Modern:

An awful lot was completely stripped over the weekend. There are bits of kicking about but we couldn't find anything so headed to Gogarth instead!
http://wainwrightclimbing.blogspot.co.uk/2015/02/better-in-that-out.html

Cheers

Sam

In reply to Samuel Wainwright:

Great blog and i loved the photos looked like you had a lot of fun despite the deluge!

In reply to Nigel Modern:
Saw a post on Facebook that implied there was "walking" snow above 700 m, and recomended crampons/axe for those going up the Pyg/Miners track.

In reply to Nigel Modern:

I take it back, it was on twitter: https://twitter.com/snowdonweather/status/570952039016083457

In reply to Nigel Modern:

Sorry mate I bottled going tonight, it looked to bare. Hopeing that next weeks cold snap turns good.

In reply to ianstevens:

Thank you

Probably some fresh snow on that Friday night so we're thinking ridge route ie Crib Goch. Might be a bit blustery but not too bad

Might make up for narrowly missing out on perfect ice last week in New England...couldn't find the crag! Just going to start a post.

In reply to Nigel Modern:

Been to Cwm Cneifion today...stripped a lot but good neve. Tower Gully looks bare , Easy Gully complete good neve all the way up. I had a look on Hidden Gully...some snow there but hard to say from distance how good it is. I have seen other teams and been told that Parsley Fern still completed
Some pictures from Cwm... https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/117338863415124537554/albums/61205619391...

In reply to Nigel Modern:

Very patchy/limited snow on Crib Goch today. Probably far more like a grim summers day than a winter one up there at the moment.

Anything back in nick after the snow?

In reply to scope:

Temps are pushing double figures in the valleys this weekend.

So no. Go rock climbing.

Winter is closed.

In reply to ianstevens:

Not entirely true. Still low grade routes available in cwn cneifion. Hidden gully and easy route both hard neve/ice once you get up to them. Not a lot of snow left on top of the Glyders though.

In reply to Joss:

Anyone got any idea whether Central Trinity may end up in condition again?

Is any one else thinking of winging it on an easy gully this weekend.

In reply to Joss:

No, it looks like great rock climbing conditions...!

In reply to Joss:

Someone climbed Central Trinity yesterday apparently.

Anyone gonna own up to this, I'm interested to know what condition it's in? (Probably being a bit over-optimistic)

In reply to Joss:

Snow down to 700m on Cadair today. An inch on the griund and a bit more where it collected in hollows. Ice above 800m.

All not of much consequence, take care on steep paths etc.