UKH

Next season I will need new touring bindings.

Should I wait to buy a pair of new Dynafit Beasts then (probably expensive) or should I try to pick up a pair of more conventional Dynafits at the end of this season (probably cheaper!)?

The Dynafit publicity suggests the new bindings are strong, light(ish) and safer releasing; all guidance will be gratefully received!

In reply to essexman:

As much as I like Dynafit, the Beast is nothing more than a wildly overpriced marketing stunt. It works, but unless you need your bindings to go to DIN above 10-12 (and you don't, or you wouldn't be asking this question), then spend half and get the only mildly overpriced Radical ST or the Plum equivalent.

In reply to essexman:

Is there any reason you want the Beasts, have you seen a pair in the flesh ? they are massive, weigh a ton, go to DIN 16 and need a modified heel piece on the boot.

If you want tech bindings and DIN release then the Fritschi Vipec is probably a better option that the Dyanfit beast

In reply to essexman:



The Dynafit Radical 2.0 will come out next season, and will offer some of the advantages of the Beast, at a weight similar to the existing Dynafit Radical bindings.

In reply to Dark-Cloud:

Wait one more year for the Vipec, they are still fiddling with the design and are having quite a lot of problems with the current batches. The design is good, but it needs serious polishing.

In reply to Dark-Cloud:

Have you seen the Fritchi Vipec? They look like they'd last about 10 minutes... all that plastic makes me shudder...

In reply to mike kann:

Yeah I have seen them, not used them though, I did think there was a lot of plastic in them, still better than a Beast though !

In reply to Dark-Cloud:

Vipecs don't go flat in hike mode. On level or low incline sections your heel is still elevated. Not ideal.

In reply to essexman:


The same issue exists on the Beasts.

In reply to Dark-Cloud:


They don't DIN release, they just release by falling apart...

In reply to essexman:

The beast skis very, very well and I've got a pair mounted on my DPS wailer 112s (not bought at full price) so can talk from experience.

Lots less vibration transfer on hard pack or spring snow than conventional tech bindings (having skied radicals and plum yaks), a very solid feel and excellent power transfer to the ski.

Yes they've expensive and heavy but it's horses for courses. I wouldn't do the haute route with them unless I was feeling very fit but the down hill is great fun, especially if you enjoy being fast and jumping off stuff.

In reply to essexman:

Beasts do seem pretty excessive to me. I love my plum guides. Skied them two seasons and the only problem I had was my stupid fault. I've done almost all my skiing on them including jumping of cliffs.
The Vipecs do need some serious "polishing". Perhaps its best not to try and polish a T**D though. They have the right ideas but I've heard some bad reports from this current batch. Dynafit seem to still be doing it well in their FT and ST bindings. Looking forward to seeing their new ones for next year. Probably worth the wait unless you can pick up some cheap Plum/Radicals.

In reply to essexman:
I have been on Vipec's since December, 10 days use only so far but Im very pleased, light & the "real" DIN setting is reassuring. The weakness is likely to be the plastic heel lifts which need beefing up in the next edition imho.
J

In reply to sam1971:

Glad to see you like them, I'm thinking of getting some rather then Dynafit mainly because as I understand it the Vipec will release in climbing mode, which the Dynafit won't.
Don't really fancy being avalanched on the way up a couloir and being locked into my skis, seems to one of the main concerns about Dynafit type bindings...

In reply to Gael Force:

The new version of the Dynafit Radical look like the binding to have next season.....

youtube.com/watch?v=RVfQfWyXv8A&

In reply to Dark-Cloud:

Cheers for that, but it still looks like you are locked in for uphill, not good if your kick turning your way up a couloir and it avalanches...or have I got it wrong.

In reply to Gael Force:


yea, if that happens you'll have got it wrong

In reply to essexman:

I've been skiing the beast all season on a set of rossi super 7's, mainly ski touring. They are awesome, i've got a set of plum guides, dynafit speed and vertical st's aswell and as someone else says its horses for courses. The beast is absolutely solid, you can push big skis hard with them, and for what they are, a freeride touring binding, they are light and they tour quite well.

If you are looking for a purely touring binding, go for the radical or plum, if you are looking to ski some gnarly sh@t and 'have it', treat yourself and get some beasts.

In reply to essexman:

I think footworks and cocqouz sports in chamonix both had the beast on sale (well they did on the 17th of march)

In reply to essexman:

I thought this was an interesting and informative review, for the more general discussion of binding function as much as the Beast itself

http://blistergearreview.com/gear-reviews/update-dynafit-beast-16-at-bindin...

But as pointed out above it is nice if your skis come off in an avalanche and I've wondered on occasion, lower limb wreckage aside, how much the benefit of my ABS could be vitiated by continued attachment to skis

In reply to Gael Force:

I am pretty sure that the last thing i would be worried about is my ski coming off if i was avalanched in a couloir......

In reply to Dark-Cloud:

I think the consequences of being attached to skis in non release mode in an avalanche would be pretty top of most people's agenda at that time. The potential for injury alone is huge never mind the rest.

In reply to Gael Force:
My point was getting avalanched in a coulouir would be pretty much game over anyway so skis releasing or not would be the last thing to worry about.

I think most injuries with dynafit locked occur when people ski them in that mode do they not ? Would they not release at the toe in any case in tour mode with enough force ?

In reply to Gael Force:
I really don't get this point. If you were skinning up and got avalanched in the way you suggest how would not having your tech bindings locked have any affect at all? They still will release (allegedly at din 8 for first lock and din 10 for full lock on plums) but unfortunately that will be the last thing on your mind anyway.

In reply to smithaldo: Im not sure why you think if you were avalanched this would be the last thing on your mind, as this would be one of the main reasons you might not get out unscathed. It's a fairly straight forward point for anybody that does much ski touring and kick turns up steep slopes. If you are wearing Dynafit and kick turning up a steep slope then your feet are locked into your bindings at the front and unattached at the back, as far as I can see although I don't have them.
If there is an avalanche then obviously it's extremely bad news to be locked into skis as theres a good chance of severe twisting injuries to legs or burial due to being dragged down by your skis.
Its one of the main reasons some people don't like Dynafit type bindings.
The new Tech Vipec binding does release in uphill mode hence the interest in it from people who spend a lot of time touring such as guides or those spending the season skiing.

In reply to Gael Force:

I think opinions are going to have to differ on this one, I think your analogy is a bit weird that's all, getting avalanched in a couloir steep enough to be kick turning in would pretty much mean you are done for, skis off or not.

In reply to Dark-Cloud:
No, skis staying on means you are much more likely to be injured or unable to get to the surface, rather obviously...lots of people survive avalanches.

In reply to Gael Force:

Yes, thanks for the clarification, I am aware that having skis on your feet will mean that you may get dragged down, glad you pointed that out......rather obviously.

Perhaps you should read the other posts, Dynafits will release.

In reply to Dark-Cloud:
I've read the other posts but they're not right, Dynafit are not DIN rated, and any release comparison would only apply when the binding is in ski mode, when it can release.
How will Dynafit release when the toe is locked for uphill mode?
As far as I known in uphill mode in the Dynafit binding there is a physical blockage, i.e. a piece moves across to prevent the toe from coming out.
There is no DIN setting in Dynafit for any mode, locked out means locked until the binding is forced open by which time your ski could be wrapped round your ears.
So as I understand it the ski can be ripped off by the force of the avalanche, or it might stay on if your leg is ripped out it's socket, due to the forces on your knees or ankles, either scenario is not good.
I don't have these bindings but am attracted by the weight saving, but the non release in tour mode puts me off, having been avalanched and buried previously.
If you can direct me to any tests at which Dynafit release in locked mode then I stand to be corrected.

In reply to Gael Force:

Gael Force already wrote a whole thread on bogus reasons why Fritchi are the best ski touring binding around

http://www.ukhillwalking.com/forums/t.php?t=562404

For sure : a fully locked dynafit toe might not come off in an avalanche (DIN25). However as suggested you could lift the toe piece just one notch and still tour up hill in them (... roughly equivalent to DIN 8).

Generally its best to avoid skinning up avalanche couloirs though!

In reply to Haggis Trap:
I think the thread would be better described as Haggis Trap's bogus reasons why Dynafit are the best touring bindings around.
Where do you get the DIN 8 from, have you just made it up? People I was skiing with this winter including 2 guides couldn't get their Dynafit bindings to stop releasing skinning up on the first click when we tried it, hence they were all skinning up with toes locked out. Is that not what most people do with Dynafit, or do you skin up with yours on the first click.
Saying it's best to avoid skinning up avalanche couloirs is a bit silly, it's not an exact science is it, as numerous deaths of top off piste skiers prove...maybe you can predict them though?

In reply to Gael Force:

Reading the above I would like to hear your experience of being buried, was it partial or full burial, where did it happen, how did it happen, did you dig yourself out, were you found by a ski partner, transceivers used ?

So in summary regarding binding as this thread was about hat in the first place, if the first thing you want to happen in a slide is your skis release then you will have to go Fritschi or Marker......

Personally I would rather avoid getting into a position where I may get avalanched, but maybe that's just me, I know that's always not possible but for a skier its a very bad career move getting avalanched in the first place.

In reply to Gael Force:


Yip - 99.9% of the time I skin uphill with my toe piece full locked out.

Uphill travel can be done on the 1st notch (not fully locked) - you just need to be a smidge more delicate on kick turns etc.

In reply to Gael Force:



I would have thought that most off piste avalanche deaths occur on descent when entering dangerous terrain.

I would have said skinning up a couloir is more predictable in terms of avalanche safety.

In reply to Haggis Trap:

I think its true to say that 99.9% of people skin up with their Dynafit locked out because they release so easily without the heel being in the binding due to the increase in forces on the binding without the heel locked in.
What the other posters said about skinning up with the toe not locked in is rubbish, nobody does it because your ski could easily drop off kick turning, especially on steep slopes.
I'm interested as I'm after new skis and bindings, and not sure about the Vipec as its so new.
Incidentally I also had problems with my Freerides doing kick turns on steep slopes, around 40 degrees, as they won't hang at a big enough angle to the ski.
All things considered I'll probably buy Vipecs on Nunataqs.

In reply to Gael Force:

yes : most people use dynafits as they were designed